Can Catholics and Mormons work together?

[why_me]

Wow, Gone for a week, and now it’s burning me like a toaster oven. It’s almost like that Megadeth song says- “Peace sells, but who’s buying”

Tommy

The problem tommy is that certain antimormon catholics on this forum have forgotten about christian love. They must do their own examination as to why that is. Stick with it and don’t dispair!

 

[mike7795]

Tommy i think anyone can word together and get along as friends, But to get along on a religious level, I am sorry to say never. It would be like you comming over to my house and saying lies about my kids, and me just either letting you say them and agreeing with you, or saying nothing at all (the same thing). As a Catholic we are taught to respect other and their beliefs, but to also defend the Church. Now to let a Mormon teach us the bible is like someone telling lies about our kids and not sticking up for them. See what i mean? Its like God is our kids. We cant stop people from telling lies about our kids but we dont have to sit there and listen to it. That is why it wont work. Sooner or later im afraid anger will fest. And then explode. But as far as in the work force itself why not? As long as a Mormon doesnt preach to us, we wont preach to him.

Defend the Church? Does Truth need to be defended, or does it stand on its own?

Let’s be real…most of us were born into our religion and what we believe is a matter of circumstance.

“When I do good, I feel good; when I do bad, I feel bad, and that is my religion.” - Abraham Lincoln

 

[tommyberryhill]

Not a crime, just, mormons do it because they want to convert people.

I have other friends who invite me to their church, but I know it is because they are a friend. No intent to convert me.

I am sure there are Catholics that invite people to church.

And I am sorry for getting so defensive on the conversion thing. I live in Utah, and me and my family are constantly bombarded by attempts to convert us. Even my daughter, her very first job, she had a co-worker of the same age who gave her a freaking BoM and sent missionaries to our house. It gets tiring, this constant invasion of our lives.

She has a boyfriend who works at a grocery store, and this older lady works at converting him every time she grocery shops.

I have had mormon missionaries waiting in grocery store parking lots, who want to “help” me with my groceries. When I said no thank you, they were offended, and said something like “we only wanted to help”. They creeped me out, because I was alone and it was getting dark. I don’t like strange men doing that sort of thing to me.

I could go on and on, the constant and never ending, often rude, conversion attempts. It takes everything I have to not cuss a string of foul language. I stick to “no thank you”. Over and over and over, and am usually ignored, like I am not saying anything at all.

So, I am used to every mormon I have ever met doing nothing but trying to convert me to a religion that I find beyond false. And hearing the mormons that I do know better talk about how they take every chance they can to proselytize.

If you are not like this, then you are probably the first mormon I have ever met who isn’t all about converting every person they ever said hello to. Congratulations.

And, I shouldn’t participate in any conversations re: polygamy, which is a conversation going on at the same time as this one. Nothing gets me more riled up than these two particular mormon topics. I have to zip it because a lot of old anger comes around and I am trying like mad to not be angry at that particular religion.

I am terribly sorry that you have angry feelings, and I understand angry feelings (As a former Adventist). But, I just met a lady who was a wonderful Adventist Lady, and I meet Mormons who are wonderful, and I meet Catholiccs who are wonderful. I believe the key is is to try to look at these people as if they are Christ, and love them regardless of how much you hate their efforts to convert you or others… Peace…

Tommy

 

[rinnie]

Defend the Church? Does Truth need to be defended, or does it stand on its own?

Let’s be real…most of us were born into our religion and what we believe is a matter of circumstance.

“When I do good, I feel good; when I do bad, I feel bad, and that is my religion.” - Abraham Lincoln

Yes im afraid the truth and the Church does have to be defended. If not people would not be so busy trying to tear down the Church. Wake up People are attacking the CC every day. And as i agree that most of us are born into our Religion it is through the Grace of God that we get the gifts of God. But in order for people to work together in anything you have got to share and give up things. thats how things get worked out. And in the Catholic Religion there is no half way. IT must be the ways of the Church. There are just too many things that cant be worked out. Sorry but thats how it is. The only person we listen to is the Pope. Not Mormons sorry. Not trying to be mean just saying we cant live the way they do. Now as far as a friendship absolutely, i would never push my faith on others. I could have a mormon as a friend, But not on the Religion to much conflict.

 

[Donna_Mc]

I remember hearing Father Grochel talking about Catholics
and Mormons that run a successful soup kitchen together
somewhere in Utah.

I do have a Mormon friend and have met several Mormons
throughout the years. It is like any other group of people,
some are a credit to their church, some are not. I remember
being in a car with two Mormons when we passed a Catholic
church and the one girl starting saying horrible things about
the church. She had continually done that as long as I knew
her. However I don’t base my views on all Mormons that
way.

I do pray that my Mormon friends will be converted into the
Catholic church someday but I am never disrespectful
towards them.

 

[rinnie]

I remember hearing Father Grochel talking about Catholics
and Mormons that run a successful soup kitchen together
somewhere in Utah.

I do have a Mormon friend and have met several Mormons
throughout the years. It is like any other group of people,
some are a credit to their church, some are not. I remember
being in a car with two Mormons when we passed a Catholic
church and the one girl starting saying horrible things about
the church. She had continually done that as long as I knew
her. However I don’t base my views on all Mormons that
way.

I do pray that my Mormon friends will be converted into the
Catholic church someday but I am never disrespectful
towards them.

See Donna this is what i mean, Its just so hard to take it when you hear People doing this. But you are right there are wonderful mormons and you did the true Christian thing and turned the other cheek. And i agree you can have them as friends, but to come together in Religion Never. We just cant too many differences.

 

[Jerusha]

Whenever they start discussing religion or their version of history, just walk away. And try not to get stuck in a car with them.

 

[zerinus]

Not a crime, just, mormons do it because they want to convert people.

I have other friends who invite me to their church, but I know it is because they are a friend. No intent to convert me.

I am sure there are Catholics that invite people to church.

And I am sorry for getting so defensive on the conversion thing. I live in Utah, and me and my family are constantly bombarded by attempts to convert us. Even my daughter, her very first job, she had a co-worker of the same age who gave her a freaking BoM and sent missionaries to our house. It gets tiring, this constant invasion of our lives.

She has a boyfriend who works at a grocery store, and this older lady works at converting him every time she grocery shops.

I have had mormon missionaries waiting in grocery store parking lots, who want to “help” me with my groceries. When I said no thank you, they were offended, and said something like “we only wanted to help”. They creeped me out, because I was alone and it was getting dark. I don’t like strange men doing that sort of thing to me.

I could go on and on, the constant and never ending, often rude, conversion attempts. It takes everything I have to not cuss a string of foul language. I stick to “no thank you”. Over and over and over, and am usually ignored, like I am not saying anything at all.

So, I am used to every mormon I have ever met doing nothing but trying to convert me to a religion that I find beyond false. And hearing the mormons that I do know better talk about how they take every chance they can to proselytize.

If you are not like this, then you are probably the first mormon I have ever met who isn’t all about converting every person they ever said hello to. Congratulations.

And, I shouldn’t participate in any conversations re: polygamy, which is a conversation going on at the same time as this one. Nothing gets me more riled up than these two particular mormon topics. I have to zip it because a lot of old anger comes around and I am trying like mad to not be angry at that particular religion.

Your problem with Mormons is not that they try to convert you. The Mormons I know don’t. Your problem with Mormons is that they are alive! You don’t want them to be. They irritate you by virtue of the fact that they live, and walk, and talk, and breathe air, and eat, and drink, and exist. That does not come as a surprise to us. We have seen it before. It is a typical sentiment of a confirmed apostate. You hate Mormons because they are there, not because they do anything to you.

Well, I have got bad news for you. Mormons aren’t going to go anywhere. They will get bigger and not smaller. Mormonism is true. Joseph Smith was a prophet. The Book of Mormon is scripture, and a revelation form God. The LDS Church is true, and led by prophets and Apostles acknowledged by the Lord. And your hatred of Mormons and Mormonism, if not repented of, will eat away your soul until you are consumed in the fire and venom of your own satanic hatred to ashes beneath their feet; while Mormons and Mormonism will continue to prosper, and become greater and more glorious as God in His Holy Scriptures has promised. I like what Job says:

“They that hate thee shall be clothed with shame; and the dwelling place of the wicked shall come to nought” (Job 8:22).

zerinus

 

[Jerusha]

Defend the Church? Does Truth need to be defended, or does it stand on its own?

I agree with you, especially in the context of the last post.

Actually, I have a positive attitude towards Community of Christ people, since they no longer hold the BOM as sacred scripture. They may still think of themselves as Mormon, however. I need to be more specific, and use either LDS, or “Brighamite Mormon”.

Reaction formation, projection, and compartmentalization are commonly used psychological defenses in LDS culture.
changingminds.org/explantions/behaviors/coping/coping.htm Prime example is Z claiming that “apostates and anti-mormons” have genocidal intent. He is one sick puppy, and not representative of all LDS people, thank God. Too bad his church doesn’t excommunicate people like him. He certainly is as much an as those missionaries.

 

[rinnie]

Your problem with Mormons is not that they try to convert you. The Mormons I know don’t. Your problem with Mormons is that they are alive! You don’t want them to be. They irritate you by virtue of the fact that they live, and walk, and talk, and breathe air, and eat, and drink, and exist. That does not come as a surprise to us. We have seen it before. It is a typical sentiment of a confirmed apostate. You hate Mormons because they are there, not because they do anything to you.

Well, I have got bad news for you. Mormons aren’t going to go anywhere. They will get bigger and not smaller. Mormonism is true. Joseph Smith was a prophet. The Book of Mormon is scripture, and a revelation form God. The LDS Church is true, and led by prophets and Apostles acknowledged by the Lord. And your hatred of Mormons and Mormonism, if not repented of, will eat away your soul until you are consumed in the fire and venom of your own satanic hatred to ashes beneath their feet; while Mormons and Mormonism will continue to prosper, and become greater and more glorious as God in His Holy Scriptures has promised. I like what Job says:

“They that hate thee shall be clothed with shame; and the dwelling place of the wicked shall come to nought” (Job 8:22).

zerinus

My Point, See why Catholics and Mormons cant get along. What he just said is unless we repent and become Mormons we are going to burn. IT didnt take long for the mean hatefull things to come out. Well i guess i better get ready to burn according to him. Well i will be on the rock, with Peter and CHrist and the gates of hell will not bring down my Church. Now that isnt from the book of mormon but PETER is the Apostle who they claim to follow, he will be on the side of the CC. Jesus promised me that. Peter got the keys so when he opens the gate i pray ill be with him. Thats my goal in life. And I know Peter follows Christ so he will lead me. The good SHepherd, THe Pope today. Still leading the flock.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Your problem with Mormons is not that they try to convert you. The Mormons I know don’t. Your problem with Mormons is that they are alive! You don’t want them to be. They irritate you by virtue of the fact that they live, and walk, and talk, and breathe air, and eat, and drink, and exist. That does not come as a surprise to us. We have seen it before. It is a typical sentiment of a confirmed apostate. You hate Mormons because they are there, not because they do anything to you.

Well, I have got bad news for you. Mormons aren’t going to go anywhere. They will get bigger and not smaller. Mormonism is true. Joseph Smith was a prophet. The Book of Mormon is scripture, and a revelation form God. The LDS Church is true, and led by prophets and Apostles acknowledged by the Lord. And your hatred of Mormons and Mormonism, if not repented of, will eat away your soul until you are consumed in the fire and venom of your own satanic hatred to ashes beneath their feet; while Mormons and Mormonism will continue to prosper, and become greater and more glorious as God in His Holy Scriptures has promised. I like what Job says:
“They that hate thee shall be clothed with shame; and the dwelling place of the wicked shall come to nought” (Job 8:22).zerinus

Well zerinus maybe two years ago I would have agreed with you, as I did go through a phase where for a while the whole mormon church from top to bottom and everyone in it felt disgusting to me. And I actually did say, to a close friend, that I did wish that the mormon church had never existed.

But, it was nothing personal, against you, or any particular mormon. I felt hurt, betrayed, played on, and to express those feelings in the mormon culture is taboo. To do so is to only be told that you don’t deserve God’s Love. And that something is wrong with you. Which only adds to the feelings anger.

It is the strongest evidence, I believe, that mormonism is a cult. People can’t leave without going through this gauntlet of emotional abuse. And you, zerinus, continue to heap it on. So yeah there are days where I have to ignore you, the same as you ignore me.

I no longer feel disgusted over mormonism. And I don’t wish it away. But I do not agree with it, in any way, shape, or form.

 

[LaMar]

It is the strongest evidence, I believe, that mormonism is a cult. People can’t leave without going through this gauntlet of emotional abuse. And you, zerinus, continue to heap it on. So yeah there are days where I have to ignore you, the same as you ignore me.

I no longer feel disgusted over mormonism. And I don’t wish it away. But I do not agree with it, in any way, shape, or form.

Zerinus has apparently forgotten the 11th article of faith. This is common among Mormons.

Another thing Mormons forget is the tradition of personal revelation. Apparently (and I’m sure you’ll correct me if I’m wrong) you feel guided toward the RC tradition. Zerinus may be trying to lead you away from what God himself is telling you. Not a very safe course for such a devout believer as s/he claims to be.

Ultimately, it’s about what’s right for you. Zerinus is right about one minor point, in that Mormonism isn’t going away (not anytime soon). S/he should feel confident that if you feel led back you’ll be able to return. Until then s/he should wish you well and be happy that you’re following the dictates of your own conscience.

You can analogize it to the pioneer spirit. You’re taking up your handcart and risking everything to do what you feel is right, despite the fact that some don’t agree with you. Mormons should learn to respect this, rather than join the mob.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Zerinus has apparently forgotten the 11th article of faith. This is common among Mormons.

Another thing Mormons forget is the tradition of personal revelation. Apparently (and I’m sure you’ll correct me if I’m wrong) you feel guided toward the RC tradition. Zerinus may be trying to lead you away from what God himself is telling you. Not a very safe course for such a devout believer as s/he claims to be.

Ultimately, it’s about what’s right for you. Zerinus is right about one minor point, in that Mormonism isn’t going away (not anytime soon). S/he should feel confident that if you feel led back you’ll be able to return. Until then s/he should wish you well and be happy that you’re following the dictates of your own conscience.

You can analogize it to the pioneer spirit. You’re taking up your handcart and risking everything to do what you feel is right, despite the fact that some don’t agree with you. Mormons should learn to respect this, rather than join the mob.

zerinus is only doing what he is done from the first day I started posting, on which day, he told me that I would never find God because I left mormonism, therefore, the Holy Spirit has left me.

This is the illness of mormonism in a nutshell. Their false god is one mf bastard.

No, what zerinus and whyme both try to do is to silence me. They think they have the holy special priesthood and can silence me by the power of their false god.

 

[LaMar]

zerinus is only doing what he is done from the first day I started posting, on which day, he told me that I would never find God because I left mormonism, therefore, the Holy Spirit has left me.

This is the illness of mormonism in a nutshell. Their false god is one mf bastard.

No, what zerinus and whyme both try to do is to silence me. They think they have the holy special priesthood and can silence me by the power of their false god.

Well, if that’s the case then Zerinus and Why Me are practicing unrighteous dominion. They should see D&C 121 before going and talking to their bishops.

If I really believed in a literal reading of Mormonism, I would not want this sort of thing on my conscience. I will pray for Zerinus and Why Me, as I’m sure you will. It’s sad that Mormons, who were driven from place to place by howling, hateful mobs, would turn to the tar-and-feathers themselves when they see someone who simply disagrees with them, all while excusing the vandalism of a Catholic shrine by Mormon missionaries.

 

[J_C]

It’s sad that Mormons, who were driven from place to place by howling, hateful mobs, would turn to the tar-and-feathers themselves when they see someone who simply disagrees with them, all while excusing the vandalism of a Catholic shrine by Mormon missionaries.

i take a little different view of z, he reminds me of some religious fundamentalists I’ve known, and even some who have come here from time to time. heck there are even some Catholic fundamentalists. my definition of fundamentalist may be a little offbase, I don’t know. I define it as anyone who is absolutely convinced that his own or some other small group of people’s interpretations of religious truth is from God, and that everyone else who disagrees in even small things is evil.

personally i feel a kindred closeness to fundamentalists, because i also have a tendency to be that way. I have to struggle against it. I believe all religions have adherents that are like this. They are the extremists, and are found among the terrorists. not that z is a terrorist, or anything like that, but i do believe that his fervency is of the type that leads people to become kamikazi.

 

[LaMar]

My definition of fundamentalist may be a little offbase, I don’t know. I define it as anyone who is absolutely convinced that his own or some other small group of people’s interpretations of religious truth is from God, and that everyone else who disagrees in even small things is evil.

I think that’s a fair definition. I don’t know enough about how Catholics see literalists/fundamentalists, but it seems like it’s pretty popular in that tradition.

In our tradition, it is made very clear that accusing someone of apostasy is apostasy in itself, and persecuting people who are peacefully following the dictates of conscience is wrong.

For example: We have a well known story which describes events in the pre-existence. After God created all his children (you and I were there too) he held a council and asked for ideas as to how to grant individuals salvation. The first person to pipe up was none other than Lucifer. Satan proposed a plan of salvation in which people were forced through a process by which they would gain a body and be exalted to the last man and woman. No one would be left behind.

Among those who objected was Jesus Christ. Christ pointed out that people ought to be able to choose, through deeds, whether they wanted to be exalted, and proposed a series of tests.

God, in his wisdom, rejected Satan’s plan with prejudice. Satan got angry, and led 1/3 of the children in an insurrection.

By persecuting people like Rebecca, by condemning them and attempting to coerce them into doing what the self-righteous imagine will lead her to salvation, they are damning themselves. People like these, while they might have good intentions, are in fact following Satan’s plan, and rejecting Jesus Christ. They would like to browbeat and harass people into following what they feel is the correct plan, rather than allowing each individual the agency to come to his or her own conclusions.

It is clear to every Mormon that people who would persecute someone like Rebecca, or anyone else of good conscience who is making an honest attempt to commune with the divine, is in fact not practicing Mormonism. These people are practicing Satanism, and are in danger of meeting the same fate as Satan and his other followers.

Best,

LaMar

 

[PaulDupre]

No, what zerinus and whyme both try to do is to silence me. They think they have the holy special priesthood and can silence me by the power of their false god.

Brothers and sisters, put on your aprons.

 

[PaulDupre]

I think that’s a fair definition. I don’t know enough about how Catholics see literalists/fundamentalists, but it seems like it’s pretty popular in that tradition.

Catholicism has its share of those who think they are “more Catholic than the pope”. Reasonable Catholics who understand history and tradition are annoyed by them. I certainly am. These are the types who think mass in the vernacular is heresy, even though among the earliest Christians mass was always celebrated in the vernacular - hence the many surviving 2nd/3rd-century Catholic mass liturgies in Aramaic, Syriac, Arabic, Greek, and many other languages. The self-styled uber-traditionalists are not really traditional at all. They are Luddites, frozen at one arbitrary point in time (Council of Trent or Vatican 1 or some other point) that their particular clique has decided was “real” Catholicism. They injure the body of Christ, and I don’t like that.

God bless you,
Paul

 

[J_C]

my internal sensor has been set to measure anger. years ago, when I subscribed to a very ultra conservative Catholic newspaper, i began to notice that whenever i read the weekly issue I would get mad at all the liberals who were supposedly tearing down the Church. I also noticed it when I read certain types of mailings, usually from organizations trying to raise money based on some fear mongering.

Eventually I used the anger guide to determine whether something is really worth reading or thinking about. If it makes me mad at someone or some group, or it makes me overly fearful that the sky is falling, then I just throw it in the trash.

 

[PaulDupre]

J_C,
That seems a very good method of discernment.

Paul