Can Catholics Vote Democrat?

[Jeanne_S]

Well, we can agree here. But I see no reason to not allow parents to choose what school their children go to. I don’t understand the vehement opposition to school choice.

No doubt this is a rhetorical question…
The loss of control and$$$$$$ is the reason for the Dems objection to school choice.The don’t give one whit about the"children"

 

[qui_est_ce]

The idea of tax breaks for different activities is really a liberal notion at its heart. It is based on the idea that people cannot be trusted to manage their own affairs, but that they need the heavy hand of government to guide them. Given that government does almost everything poorly, it is surprising that anyone actually believes that anymore.

I don’t like the idea of the government picking winners and deciding “favorable” behaviors.

I also don’t see why people who have enough money to buy a home should get tax breaks. And I do use the mortgage interest deduction.

 

[sallybutler]

I don’t like the idea of the government picking winners and deciding “favorable” behaviors.

I also don’t see why people who have enough money to buy a home should get tax breaks. And I do use the mortgage interest deduction.

In order to get the federal mortgage interest deduction, you have to give the bank 3 or 4 dollars for every dollar you ‘save’ in taxes. Plus, as you point out, the government is deciding “favorable” behaviors. In addition, those people who hate government handouts but are taking the deduction, are getting a government handout, whether they admit it or not.

 

[Path_Finder]

I see no reason why Catholics should find it hard to oppose a party that supports intrinsic evils. Only the Dem party does that. There is little likelihood that some will find any party to their personal tastes, as your post illustrates. But for me, it isn’t a matter of that. It’s a matter of “being counted” when it comes to opposing intrinsic evils. Political nihilism does not do that.

Exactly, the DemocratIC party agenda is repugnant. Redefining marriage for less than 2% of the population, being a servant for the abortion industry, supporting Terrorist Fundamentalists in Syria, a total disaster as well. Healthcare and so on. One can’t even be sure the Democrats are not being honest in election voting as well.

 

[estesbob]

In order to get the federal mortgage interest deduction, you have to give the bank 3 or 4 dollars for every dollar you ‘save’ in taxes. Plus, as you point out, the government is deciding “favorable” behaviors. In addition, those people who hate government handouts are getting one, wether they admit it or not.

No They are not getting govt handouts.It is their money. The fact a deduction allows them to keep more of it is not a handout.

A handout would be the Earned Income Tax credit or the refundable portion of the Child credit.

 

[LeafByNiggle]

The idea of tax breaks for different activities is really a liberal notion at its heart. It is based on the idea that people cannot be trusted to manage their own affairs, but that they need the heavy hand of government to guide them. Given that government does almost everything poorly, it is surprising that anyone actually believes that anymore.

It is an intellectual shortcut to evaluate an idea by first placing it in a cubby hole (liberal, in this case) and then passing judgement based on everything else that shares the same label. Much more honest would be to evaluate the idea on its own merits regardless of what cubby you want to put it in. I’m trying to agree with you that the mortgage interest tax deduction is a bad idea. But apparently you won’t be satisfied unless I say it is a bad idea because it is a liberal idea, and that I cannot do for the reason I just outlined.

As for the general principle of encouraging certain behaviors through tax law, if you are so set against it in general, then I suppose you are also opposed to deductions for donations to the Church. Or, if we don’t want tax law to preferentially encourage churches, we should treat churches just like any for-profit corporation and tax them the same as General Motors. The atheists would love to see that. Is that what you want?

 

[sallybutler]

No They are not getting govt handouts.It is their money. The fact a deduction allows them to keep more of it is not a handout.

A handout would be the Earned Income Tax credit or the refundable portion of the Child credit.

If you pay a lower tax than someone else with the exact same income, why isn’t that a ‘handout’. Just because you paid less initially instead of paying the full amount and getting a refund does not change the result, just what you call it.

 

[estesbob]

If you pay a lower tax than someone else with the exact same income, why isn’t that a ‘handout’. Just because you paid less initially instead of paying the full amount and getting a refund does not change the result, just what you call it.

YOU can’t give someone a handout with their own money.

 

[stinkcat_14]

It is an intellectual shortcut to evaluate an idea by first placing it in a cubby hole (liberal, in this case) and then passing judgement based on everything else that shares the same label. Much more honest would be to evaluate the idea on its own merits regardless of what cubby you want to put it in. I’m trying to agree with you that the mortgage interest tax deduction is a bad idea. But apparently you won’t be satisfied unless I say it is a bad idea because it is a liberal idea, and that I cannot do for the reason I just outlined.

I was describing the problem with the mortgage interest deduction. The fact that it is a liberal idea or a conservative idea has no bearing on whether or not it is a good idea.

As for the general principle of encouraging certain behaviors through tax law, if you are so set against it in general, then I suppose you are also opposed to deductions for donations to the Church. Or, if we don’t want tax law to preferentially encourage churches, we should treat churches just like any for-profit corporation and tax them the same as General Motors. The atheists would love to see that. Is that what you want?

I am not in favor of tax breaks for any particular activity, outside of business expenses. If people want to give to charity they should, if they don’t they shouldn’t. The government has no business encouraging it one way or another.

Also, there is no economic reason why nonprofits should be exempt from taxes.

 

[Dawnia]

If you pay a lower tax than someone else with the exact same income, why isn’t that a ‘handout’. Just because you paid less initially instead of paying the full amount and getting a refund does not change the result, just what you call it.

That only works if you start from the false premise that all money belongs to the government and that the credit/deductions aren’t “payment” for doing something the government wants you to do.

 

[Mulligan2]

Many of the responses on this thread have reinforced the notion that this is not necessarily a forum for ‘Catholics’, but rather a forum for ‘Republicans who happen to be Catholic’. Frankly, this denigrating of one’s political opponents is tired. Regrettably, it seems to come up again and again, especially in election years. Very sad. I’ll follow Pope Francis’s 10 tips for happiness instead.

 

[sallybutler]

YOU can’t give someone a handout with their own money.

in other words, there should be zero taxes. Well, that isn’t going to happen anytime soon, no matter who you vote for.

Since I don’t take the mortgage deduction, that means my federal taxes are helping to make up for those who do.

 

[stinkcat_14]

in other words, there should be zero taxes. Well, that isn’t going to happen anytime soon, no matter who you vote for.

Since I don’t take the mortgage deduction, that means my federal taxes are helping to make up for those who do.

It is the ultimate in silliness on the part of the government to decide that people who don’t have mortgages should pay more in taxes than people who do. There is no rational basis for such a system.

 

[ringil]

In many people’s views, its more like, “I want my kids to go to school with high test scores”, or “I want my kids to go to a good reputation for academic achievement”. Not everything is racial.

From Wikipedia

Upon desegregation in 1957 in Baltimore, Maryland, the Clifton Park Junior High School had 2,023 white students and 34 black students; ten years later, it had twelve white students and 2,037 black students. In northwest Baltimore, Garrison Junior High School’s student body declined from 2,504 whites and twelve blacks to 297 whites and 1,263 blacks in that period.[33] At the same time, the city’s working class population declined because of the loss of industrial jobs as heavy industry restructured.

Hey, maybe the whites just wanted a better school for their kids and all decided so in one year.

 

[Dawnia]

It is the ultimate in silliness on the part of the government to decide that people who don’t have mortgages should pay more in taxes than people who do. There is no rational basis for such a system.

Do you realize that you have to itemize in order to take that deduction? People with mortgages don’t necessarily pay less in taxes than those who take the standard deduction.

 

[Dawnia]

From Wikipedia

Upon desegregation in 1957 in Baltimore, Maryland, the Clifton Park Junior High School had 2,023 white students and 34 black students; ten years later, it had twelve white students and 2,037 black students. In northwest Baltimore, Garrison Junior High School’s student body declined from 2,504 whites and twelve blacks to 297 whites and 1,263 blacks in that period.[33] At the same time, the city’s working class population declined because of the loss of industrial jobs as heavy industry restructured.

Hey, maybe the whites just wanted a better school for their kids and all decided so in one year.

Don’t you mean in 10 years? A lot can happen in 10 years.

 

[markomalley]

From Wikipedia

Upon desegregation in 1957 in Baltimore, Maryland, the Clifton Park Junior High School had 2,023 white students and 34 black students; ten years later, it had twelve white students and 2,037 black students. In northwest Baltimore, Garrison Junior High School’s student body declined from 2,504 whites and twelve blacks to 297 whites and 1,263 blacks in that period.[33] At the same time, the city’s working class population declined because of the loss of industrial jobs as heavy industry restructured.

Hey, maybe the whites just wanted a better school for their kids and all decided so in one year.

Hate to tell you this, but the demographics of Baltimore City had been shifting since before WWII.

the nail in the coffin was busing.

 

[shockerfan]

From Wikipedia

Upon desegregation in 1957 in Baltimore, Maryland, the Clifton Park Junior High School had 2,023 white students and 34 black students; ten years later, it had twelve white students and 2,037 black students. In northwest Baltimore, Garrison Junior High School’s student body declined from 2,504 whites and twelve blacks to 297 whites and 1,263 blacks in that period.[33] At the same time, the city’s working class population declined because of the loss of industrial jobs as heavy industry restructured.

Hey, maybe the whites just wanted a better school for their kids and all decided so in one year.

My comment is based on 1997-2011 (when I was making schooling decisions for my kids)…not 1957.

 

[freeRadical]

It seems like a reasonable role for the government to me.

Promoting a educated citizenry, yes, a proper role of government. But I see no reason why the need to administer the schools.

 

[freeRadical]

Salaries in 20s starting out or 30s with significant experience is pretty poorly paid for having a bachelors degree, IMO.

Supply and demand. You sound like the liberal arts professors at my college who say it isn’t fair that they get paid $40,000 a year why the business professors get paid $100,000.