Can protestants get forgiveness/reconciliation?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Isidore_AK
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Hi Isidore,
So unless we believe that only Catholics are held to a higher standard of repentance & reconciliation, it would be near impossible for most protestants to get to heaven.
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This is the theory, and it should make Protestants nervous, which is fine.
However, as I said earlier, God is bound by the sacraments, but not limited to them. It is possible that he can find, in particular cases, some other way for Protestant sinners.

Verbum
 
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Isidore_AK:
Here’s some answers for ya,
  1. Yes, a Catholic does have assurance of forgiveness if they use the Sacrament of Confession…and truly mean to confess their sins. Confession is not valid if the person has the intent to continue to commit the sin (at that point you are just lying to God).
  2. The act of contrition is a prayer said at the end of confession,
    it usually goes like this:
O My God,
I am heartily sorry for having offended Thee,
and I detest all my sins, because because of Thy just punishments, but most of all because they offend Thee, My God, Who art all good and deserving of all my love.
I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy Grace,
to sin no more and to avoid the near occassions of sin.
Amen.

A ‘Perfect Act of Contrition’ is this prayer (or similar) that is prayed with perfect sorrow and intent. To gain God’s forgiveness you must be sorrowfull for all of your mortal sins. To keep even one sin in your heart is to keep them all for punishment.

This means if you are sorry for all your sins…but still think that commiting adultery was fun (even though you would not do it again) you have no forgiveness as you are NOT truly sorry for your sins. You must also attempt to make reparation for those sins that have hurt others. If you have stolen, you must pay. If you have been uncharitable, do your best to make amends. If nothing else, do good works for charity. If a Catholic, you are still obligated to go to confession as soon as possible.

So you see, an Act of Perfect Contrition is very hard to make. It is VERY hard to be truly sorrowful for all of your mortal sins.

Hence my Wifes concern for her family. There are some that have lived imperfect lives since Baptism and she fears for their souls as they speak of their ‘party years’ as fond memories.================================================…
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Hi ISI, A perfect act of contrition is not reciting a certain prayer. A perfect act of contrition is getting on your knees with a repentent heart and crying out to the Lord For His Mercy and His forgiveness. It has to be sincere and from the heart.I know I am forgiven because I believe what He did for me on the cross. Thats His promise. God Bless
 
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SPOKENWORD:
Hi ISI, A perfect act of contrition is not reciting a certain prayer. **A perfect act of contrition is getting on your knees with a repentent heart and crying out to the Lord For His Mercy and His forgiveness. It has to be sincere and from the heart.**I know I am forgiven because I believe what He did for me on the cross. Thats His promise. God Bless
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Emphasis mine above.

The prayer that I posted above is the standard ‘Catholic’ prayer used in just such a situation. What you describe is a paraphrase of what I describe…I prefer a prayer that has been passed through the ages, you prefer one from your heart.

My point is not that it is the form of the prayer itself that matters, as much as** it is sorrow for your sins and true repentance that matter.** And to truly give up all of your sins (even the fun ones!) is a very difficult task.

The use of the Sacrament of Confession is God’s way of making it easier for us to repent of our sins.
 
  1. Yes, a Catholic does have assurance of forgiveness if they use the Sacrament of Confession…and truly mean to confess their sins. Confession is not valid if the person has the intent to continue to commit the sin (at that point you are just lying to God).
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Okay thanks. 🙂
O My God,
I am heartily sorry for having offended Thee,
and I detest all my sins, because because of Thy just punishments, but most of all because they offend Thee, My God, Who art all good and deserving of all my love.
I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy Grace,
to sin no more and to avoid the near occassions of sin.
Amen.
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That’s very pretty.
 
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Isidore_AK:
Emphasis mine above.

The prayer that I posted above is the standard ‘Catholic’ prayer used in just such a situation. What you describe is a paraphrase of what I describe…I prefer a prayer that has been passed through the ages, you prefer one from your heart.

My point is not that it is the form of the prayer itself that matters, as much as** it is sorrow for your sins and true repentance that matter.** And to truly give up all of your sins (even the fun ones!) is a very difficult task.

The use of the Sacrament of Confession is God’s way of making it easier for us to repent of our sins.
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Hi Isidore, And which prayer do you think God prefers? Personally I believe He wants the one from the HEART. 👍 God Bless.
 
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Isidore_AK:
This is one of the things that greatly concerns my Wife. She is a convert to the faith, and all of her family are fundamentalists.

If a protestant is in a state of mortal sin, and is not capable of making a perfect act of conritition, what hope do they have?

They have rejected the Sacrament of Reconciliation, and I can find no other way (beyond ‘perfect’ contrition, which I believe would be imposible for most) to have their mortal sins forgiven…perhaps this is why they believe in adult baptism only? So they can sin as they please while they are young…?
I am not saying that protestants cannot get to heaven, only that they may not have a way of gaining forgiveness for mortal sins…therefore they would have to live a ‘perfect’ Christian life after baptism…
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Don’t discount the mercy of God, along with His justice. Your prayers and sacrifices for these people can do great things for them. Protestants are ‘invincibly ignorant’ of the Catholic understanding of the forgiveness of sins. You can have hope that God will judge them (and all of us) based on the light that we have. Help them all that you can by your prayers and silent witness, invoke St. Monica’s help for their conversion, and trust in God’s mercy.
 
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dennisknapp:
I would totally go along with you Ozzie if you could show me that what you believe is not a 16th century innovation. If not, then you are just asking us to accept “tradtions of men” which our Lord prohibits.Peace
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So can you show me even on instance in the N.T. Scriptures where the Apostles personally absolved a person’s sins? Where even one person came to them to have their sins forgiven? If not, then yours is the “tradition of men,” not Apostolic. In order to be Apostolic the Apostles themselves would have to have done it. Right?

ACTS 10:43 “Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins.”

ACTS 13:38 “Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through Him forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you.”

You can believe God’s Word, Dennis. Such *belief *actually honors Him and produces salvation.
 
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Mary3:
Protestants are ‘invincibly ignorant’ of the Catholic understanding of the forgiveness of sins.
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Or maybe those who truly understand the Catholic teaching on the forgiveness of sins flat out reject it, because they know, based on God’s written Word that:

"Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins." (Acts 10:43).
You can have hope that God will judge them (and all of us) based on the light that we have.
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You have the truth revealed in God’s written Word, Mary. And yet you refuse to believe that through faith in Christ, and Christ alone, you “receive forgiveness of sins.” In respect to judgment Christ Himself said:

JOHN 5:24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.”
Help them all that you can by your prayers and silent witness, invoke St. Monica’s help for their conversion, and trust in God’s mercy.
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Or you could turn to the Word of God and by faith accept the mercy God has already shown you through the sacrificial death, burial and bodily resurrection of His Son. In Him is life.
 
Hi Isidore, And which prayer do you think God prefers? Personally I believe He wants the one from the HEART. 👍 God Bless.
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So, can’t a written out prayer be from the heart? Of course it can. I think what you mean is spontaneous prayer. You think God likes spontaneous prayer better, and spontaneous doesn’t automatically mean ‘from the heart.’
 
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Curious:
So, can’t a written out prayer be from the heart? Of course it can. I think what you mean is spontaneous prayer. You think God likes spontaneous prayer better, and spontaneous doesn’t automatically mean ‘from the heart.’
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Hi Curious,Yes I mean spontanious prayers from the heart. Yes, the Holy Spirit will help you in this area of prayer. 👍 God Bless
 
Spoken Word, I am posting rhetoric. I posted some rhetoric about Ishtar worship and hot cross buns on the “Are Protestants Christian?” thread. There is some other silly rhetoric I posted as well.
Spoken word, I am a Protestant as well.
 
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Lilyofthevalley:
Spoken Word, I am posting rhetoric. I posted some rhetoric about Ishtar worship and hot cross buns on the “Are Protestants Christian?” thread. There is some other silly rhetoric I posted as well.
Spoken word, I am a Protestant as well.
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Hi Lily, You fooled me. I thought you were catholic. 😃 I would have become catholic until I meet one. 😃 God Bless
 
I think it’s safe to say that the act of sincere confession and repentance by the sinner is the most important part of this.

Catholics confess to a priest, but they know that they are facing God with the issue, and there is certainly direct prayer to God involved. The act of also telling an actual person whom they revere creates added accountability that they are not going to commit the sin again.

Protestants go straight to God with contrition, but this doesn’t mean that God doesn’t forgive them, for He knows whether any heart is sincere, Catholic, Protestant, or neither. I also know that some Protestant churches now have Accountability Groups (small groups of 2-5 people) formed to help members stick to their convictions.

Either way, the act of the sinner is what God is responding to, and forgiveness is not conditional according to whether or not another person is in the room. We are all taken care of on this issue.

Just my two cents. God bless.
 
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Ozzie:
So can you show me even on instance in the N.T. Scriptures where the Apostles personally absolved a person’s sins? Where even one person came to them to have their sins forgiven? If not, then yours is the “tradition of men,” not Apostolic. In order to be Apostolic the Apostles themselves would have to have done it. Right?

ACTS 10:43 "Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins."

ACTS 13:38 "Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through Him forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you."

You can believe God’s Word, Dennis. Such *belief *actually honors Him and produces salvation.
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Catholics believe God’s word when Jesus breathed on the Apostles and said: “Receive the Holy Spirit: whose sins you forgive, they are forgiven; whose sins you retain, they are retained.”

You can’t be a Bible Christian and say you believe that Scripture is your rule of faith, and then turn your back on Jesus’ direct provision for the primary way in which we are to accept forgiveness of sins.
 

Hi Lily, You fooled me. I thought you were catholic. I would have become catholic until I meet one. God Bless​

I was baptized Catholic, however my parents ended the Catholic teaching there. I attend a Protestant Church and was re-baptized in a Protestant church.​

I don’t think all Catholics believe Protestants are disobedient heretics who are going to hell.
There are some, but you have Protestants who believe Catholics get venerating Mary from Ishtar worship and some other nonsense about dead children under Catholic alters. Or something like that.
 
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SPOKENWORD:
Hi Isidore, And which prayer do you think God prefers? Personally I believe He wants the one from the HEART. 👍 God Bless.
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If the traditional prayer is from the heart than I think it is best.

You seem to believe your prayer is better than the prayers and traditions we recieve from the apostles.

That smacks of pride. Be careful you’r not committing a new sin as you are confessing your previous ones.
 
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Ozzie:
So can you show me even on instance in the N.T. Scriptures where the Apostles personally absolved a person’s sins? Where even one person came to them to have their sins forgiven? If not, then yours is the “tradition of men,” not Apostolic. In order to be Apostolic the Apostles themselves would have to have done it. Right?
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I believe, the N.T. was never ment to be a complete account of everythng the apostoles said and did in their lifetimes. That’s why it’s important to read history and listen to the teachings and traditions passed down direclty from the Twleve through the Catholic Chruch.

Your suspicion of inovations is healthy and has been shared by the Catholic church. That’s is one reason you can trust it.
 
First of all Jn. 20:21-23 says nothing about “priests,” or sacraments. Christ is speaking directly to His Apostles. You cannot just lift Jn. 20:21-23 out of the context of all N.T. revelation regarding sin and forgiveness. It is VERY clear in the N. T. Scriptures that the basis of forgiveness is the substitutionary sacrifice of God the Son through personal faith in Him. Jesus is not giving His Apostles the “power” to forgive sins in this passage, and certainly not the power to refuse forgiveness of sins. Jesus here commits to the Apostles the right, authoritatively, to declare, in His name, that there is forgiveness of sins, and by what conditions the sins will be forgiven.
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But Ozzie that’s not what it says. It doesn’t say “Receive ye the holy ghost, I give you the authority to declare there is forgiveness of sins.” It sounds like you’re trying to make the Bible say something it doesn’t say.
 
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