Cardinal Burke and Grand Master Festing defied wishes of Pope Francis by sacking Grand Chancellor

[RCinMT]

I has several points of logic and grammar. First, I do not know that something can be both subjective and untrue. Second, opinions need not be subjective. A scientific opinion, for example, can rely on evidence and be a theory. It may eventually be valid or invalid, but at the time, not true or untrue.

The intent was clear. The commentary on the value of subjective opinions was not helpful. However, I will play: something can certainly be subjective and untrue. Opinions are always subjective to the person to whom they belong. Things that aren’t opinions are, generally, called facts…which are inherently true. Further, of all opinions, scientific opinions are certainly either true or untrue.

Finally, I did not prognosticate, or suggest anyone should. If you look back at my post, notice I spoke only in the present tense. I agree we should not be counting on the future. If something changes, as you suggest, then that is like new data coming in that might change our opinions, hopefully. That is why I too did not like conjecture on what may have to Cardinal Burke. It is totally uncalled for. I should have added this to make it clear there was but one point I was addressing and not the whole post.

Great, so you agree that nobody has the ability to make definitive statements about where the Spirit is leading the Church. All this just to agree?

But I agree that no one needs to be telling bishops what to think. I will even say that almost no one, no one here anyway, should be second-guessing them. This includes Cardinal Burke. I most certainly includes our Holy Father.

Hmmm…Cardinal Burke hasn’t told the bishops what to think, he has asked the pope questions. Plus, Cardinal Burke doesn’t have the authority to dismiss or reassign. All though he did show himself somewhat savvy with regard to exploiting the media in order to signal that the dubia were not being addressed. Seems as if the pope didn’t appreciate Cardinal Burke using the media that way.

It’s quite unfortunate that the Magesterium doesn’t have more of a spirit of collegiality and dialogue, a willingness to address and discuss questions in a friendly and open manner. Somebody really should advocate for dialogue.

 

[pnewton]

The intent was clear. The commentary on the value of subjective opinions was not helpful. However, I will play: something can certainly be subjective and untrue.

I don’t know. I don’t see it. I do not consider truth subjective. Therefore, untruth cannot be subjective. If an opinion is contrary to truth, it is not a subjective opinion, but an objective lie or ignorance.

Great, so you agree that nobody has the ability to make definitive statements about where the Spirit is leading the Church. All this just to agree?

Well, you had quoted me and said we should be telling the future, as the poster below you did. I wanted to clarify I wrote in the present tense. So, yes.

Cardinal Burke hasn’t told the bishops what to think, he has asked the pope questions.

I did not say he did. That was people here that spend a lot of time with very strong opinions about that which they know little. Cardinal Burke has been a target. I do no know why he talked to the media. How can I really have an informed opinion? I know even less about this situation. He has been unfairly second-guessed at every turn. AB Cupich likewise has been castigated and second-guessed for his statements. Posters think he was even wrong for stating trying to teach what he thought he needed to teach, much less for the actual statements he made.

Then this goes double for the Pope, again, by posters here.

 

[RCinMT]

I don’t know. I don’t see it. I do not consider truth subjective. Therefore, untruth cannot be subjective. If an opinion is contrary to truth, it is not a subjective opinion, but an objective lie or ignorance.

Opinion: God exists
Empirical evidence: none to prove or disprove

Classification of opinion: subjective

Is this subjective opinion either true or false? Yes, it’s one or the other. It’s not neither just because there isn’t physical evidence at hand that provides absolute proof one way or the other.

 

[pnewton]

Opinion: God exists
Empirical evidence: none to prove or disprove

Classification of opinion: subjective
.

I do not consider this an area of subjective opinion. Our perspective does nothing to alter reality.

 

[robertmidwest]

catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=30956

 

[unafraid]

catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=30956

Our Holy Father is an exceptionally patient man. He has great confidence in his pontificate, and allows those openly opposed to him to do so unencumbered. It is highly commendable, but for the vast majority of Catholics who love and support him it can be frustrating. This particular agent provocateur has become quite tiresome.

 

[Ginny89]

catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=30956

From the article:

“He observed that Cardinal Burke has recently reiterated that any Catholic official who is involved in distributing condoms should resign.”

So IS he distributing them or not? If not why does he have a problem with what the Cardinal says there? Is he not aware of Catholic teaching on the matter?

 

[twf]

Our Holy Father is an exceptionally patient man. He has great confidence in his pontificate, and allows those openly opposed to him to do so unencumbered. It is highly commendable, but for the vast majority of Catholics who love and support him it can be frustrating. This particular agent provocateur has become quite tiresome.

It is not your place to label a cardinal of the Holy Roman Church a “agent provocateur”. That’s pretty harsh.
There were many bishops who openly disagreed with and/or defied St. John Paul II and Benedict on various teachings / matters. They were also very patient with their brothers who held differing opinions. In fact, many of the more “progressive” Cardinals were elevated by these two popes, despite their reputation as “archconservatives”.