Cardinal Dolan finds common ground with Obama on guns

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Frank_Drebin said:
Said the same thing about voter IDs, see the case in the state of Indiana.
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That’s really another topic, but the objections, if I remember correctly, were around the timing of requiring the voter IDs. Now, way in advance of any elections, is the time to make the requirements, so that all have an opportunity to gain the legitimately required ID. Is anyone out there that would object to that?

Now there are suggestions to change the way electoral votes are assigned, because what has been determined to be a solution to the way the election turned out. That would override the popular vote, and would cause the disenfranchisement of many voters. Would that be acceptable?

We have people who would work on the infringement of other people’s rights, as long as it is in their own interest. That doesn’t guarantee a right to life, liberty or the pursuit of happiness for all.

The controls being suggested, in this topic, are because of people losing their right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, permanently. Remember, these are controls, and yes some guns are being considered for banning. It’s not an all or nothing as it’s presented.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
That’s really another topic, but the objections, if I remember correctly, were around the timing of requiring the voter IDs. Now, way in advance of any elections, is the time to make the requirements, so that all have an opportunity to gain the legitimately required ID. Is anyone out there that would object to that?

Now there are suggestions to change the way electoral votes are assigned, because what has been determined to be a solution to the way the election turned out. That would override the popular vote, and would cause the disenfranchisement of many voters. Would that be acceptable?

We have people who would work on the infringement of other people’s rights, as long as it is in their own interest. That doesn’t guarantee a right to life, liberty or the pursuit of happiness for all.

The controls being suggested, in this topic, are because of people losing their right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, permanently. Remember, these are controls, and yes some guns are being considered for banning. It’s not an all or nothing as it’s presented.
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Regarding the voter IDs, that was the Pennsylvania case that got held up until after the election.

And yes, many on the left do object to voter IDs, even years out from an election. Look at the topics on this board. Quotes of “any disenfranchisement of a constitutionally protected right to vote is wrong” were abundant.
 
BigBlueCane said:
In this case photo ids were free. In the cases in 2012 they were not and in fact the process to acquire them were almost impossible.
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And who said you had to pay for an ID? hile I find the excuse laughable, many states pay for them outright.

Cost is rarely the objection from the left. They don’t agree with the Indiana case, which was zero cost.
 
The Supreme Court has also ruled that a woman has a right to destroy her unborn baby. :mad:

I can’t have an assault weapon because I might go crazy with it but a woman can get an abortion countless times and that is fine with everyone? DISGUSTING. That very same day those 20 kids dropped dead, 4,000 abortions occurred. What the heck don’t people get? 20 vs. 4,000. 4,000 is way worse than 20. The morality and selective rage in this country is pathetic.

The entire world is upside down. This is Satan’s Century. I am beginning to think that modern society deserves Satan’s Reign and maybe that is why God has allowed it. :mad:
 
Frank_Drebin said:
The problem is without a precise definition in this sort of thing, you won’t get the results you want per se. Banning guns “just because I see no real need” is not the goal, so we are told.

I am far from an expert, so generally I stay out, but the whole genesis of the discussion is :what is the root cause of these mass killings, and what can we do to most effectively prevent mass killings?"

Somehow, and quite disingenuosly I believe, we went from those questions, which are noble on their face, to deciding on banning assault weapons, whatever they are.

Did anyone take the time to study and answer the first question, and then the second, before deciding that gun bans (whil not being effective in the past) are the answer to both, and specifically, assualt weapons (which presumes these are the weapons most responsible).

It just seems again, disingenuous, to claim to want to solve a serious problem we all recognize, but insert a predetrmined solution someone’s been dying to find an excuse for that may or may not have any real impact on the problem we are trying to solve.

And shouldn’t it be a muti-tiered approach? As Catholics, we should all recognize that the most effective way to eliminate all sin is to turn our hearts and minds back to God.Living our lives the way we are meant - serving Him, which would entail whole families raising children properly, not glorifying violence but glorifying Christ, spending time in prayer, and promoting a Good Samaritan approach.

But if that message is heard, it is maybe for a brief second, and then it is onto other issues that are not even close to the root cause of the problem.

I just find it hard to take people seriously who claim to want to solve a serious problem, but don;t want to do address the hard work and tough issues in order to solve that problem. To me, that implies the people in question may not really want to truly solve the problem.
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There are weapons that are the weapon of choice, or so it seems to be playing out in these mass shootings.

Shouldn’t society seek the simplest solution? That would be controls. We don’t know when a person will become mentally unstable, or when a person will go ‘criminal’. The hard work would be monitoring all people.

Those unstable, or criminally inclined, are going for weapons to create a ‘mass killing’. The weapon of choice is that gun identified by the majority of people as an assault weapon.
 
jay29 said:
The Supreme Court has also ruled that a woman has a right to destroy her unborn baby. :mad:

I can’t have an assault weapon because I might go crazy with it but a woman can get an abortion countless times and that is fine with everyone? DISGUSTING. That very same day those 20 kids dropped dead, 4,000 abortions occurred. What the heck don’t people get? 20 vs. 4,000. 4,000 is way worse than 20. The morality and selective rage in this country is pathetic.

The entire world is upside down. This is Satan’s Century. I am beginning to think that modern society deserves Satan’s Reign and maybe that is why God has allowed it. :mad:
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Satans reign includes unlimited guns for everyone.
 
jay29 said:
Bull ****. A gun by itself is meaningless, just like a scalpel and vacuum is meaningless. What don’t you get? 🤷
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What you don’t get is that I can’t kill 30 people within minutes using a scalpel.
 
jay29 said:
The Supreme Court has also ruled that a woman has a right to destroy her unborn baby. :mad:

I can’t have an assault weapon because I might go crazy with it but a woman can get an abortion countless times and that is fine with everyone? DISGUSTING. That very same day those 20 kids dropped dead, 4,000 abortions occurred. What the heck don’t people get? 20 vs. 4,000. 4,000 is way worse than 20. The morality and selective rage in this country is pathetic.

The entire world is upside down. This is Satan’s Century. I am beginning to think that modern society deserves Satan’s Reign and maybe that is why God has allowed it. :mad:
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Cardinal Dolan expressed it clearly, in my opinion.
For me, regulating and controlling guns is part of building a Culture of Life, of doing what we can to protect and defend human life. The easy access to guns, including assault weapons, that exists in our nation has contributed towards a Culture of Death, where human life and dignity are cheapened by the threat of violence.
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The ‘cheapening’ of life contributes to the culture of death, which comes in many forms in present times.
 
jay29 said:
If you don’t have a record and you are over 18, you have a right to a gun.
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Thats fine. We just want to make sure when you are over 18 you get a background check, can only buy magazines that hold a certain amount and can’t have access to assault weapons thats all.
 
Bill_Martin said:
:rolleyes:

I was unaware that Satan preferred resistance to evil rather than disarmed surrender.
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Many liberals have a bleeding heart for criminals just like they had for rapists. Remember how the liberals wanted women just to endure a rape rather than to fight against it? I remember that foolishness…Terrible.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Cardinal Dolan expressed it clearly, in my opinion.

The ‘cheapening’ of life contributes to the culture of death, which comes in many forms in present times.
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Self defense is absolutely Christian. Everyone has a right to life including the victims of crime.
 
jay29 said:
Many liberals have a bleeding heart for criminals just like they had for rapists. Remember how the liberals wanted women just to endure a rape rather than to fight against it? I remember that foolishness…Terrible.
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I think it’s a fear that people will be reliant on themselves rather than the government. It terrifies those in power and it shocks those who are afraid to admit that nobody else is assigned the task of personally protecting them.
 
BigBlueCane said:
Thats fine. We just want to make sure when you are over 18 you get a background check, can only buy magazines that hold a certain amount and can’t have access to assault weapons thats all.
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Good luck with that. Too bad criminals laugh in your face and the victims faces.
 
Bill_Martin said:
I think it’s a fear that people will be reliant on themselves rather than the government. It terrifies those in power and it shocks those who are afraid to admit that nobody else is assigned the task of personally protecting them.
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Maybe we should suspend police forces for 6 months and see how people think then.
 
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