Cardinal Dolan finds common ground with Obama on guns

[Ender]

Catholics in the UK really struggle to reconcile civilian gun ownership with the teachings of the Church.

Whatever Brits may think of civilian gun ownership the church has no problem with it.

Ender

 

[Cor_Cordis]

Q: Would you support or oppose a law requiring background checks on people buying guns at gun shows?

91% approve

Q: Would you support or oppose a law making illegal gun sales a federal crime?

82% approve

Q: Would you support or oppose a law requiring nationwide ban on the sale of assault weapons?

57% approve

That’s really insightful since background checks at gun shows is already the law. The stupid public is just so willfully stupid.

The Next Vital Poll: 91% favor gravity!

 

[scipio337]

For this reason our founding fathers designed a constitutional republic and NOT a democracy. This is the reason Jim Crow laws in the South were struck down. Back then maybe 60% of Southerners were in favor of Jim Crow laws. I am just throwing out that 60% figure. Popular demand brought Roe V Wade to SCOTUS.

In theory a constitutional republic prevents the majority from taking away rights of the minority. What if out of fear of terrorism, people give into their fear and emotions and in Gallup polls 85% of the people want to do away with the 4th amendment and allow the police to kick down your door and search your house and person whenever they want?

I’m not sure what the source of the poll was. Online? Interesting to see it on the same page as polls regarding Catholic views on Priests marrying, etc.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

I really struggle to get my ahead around the American obsession with guns.

It isn’t a left/right issue. Here in the UK the overwhelming majority of people strongly disagree with American gun legislation. This is something that applies to people on the furthest reaches of the left and right.

Catholics in the UK really struggle to reconcile civilian gun ownership with the teachings of the Church.

Just check out the rates of firearm deaths in the world.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

The rate of gun deaths in the US is 40 times higher than that in the UK. Countries the likes of Paraguay, Nicaragua and Serbia have lower rates than the US.

I really struggle getting my head around the British in general:

Thomas Sowell: Gun Control Still Won’t Work

"The few counter-examples offered by gun control zealots do not stand up under scrutiny. Perhaps their strongest talking point is that Britain has stronger gun control laws than the United States and lower murder rates.

But,** if you look back through history, you will find that Britain has had a lower murder rate than the United States for more than two centuries — and, for most of that time, the British had no more stringent gun control laws than the United States.** Indeed, neither country had stringent gun control for most of that time.

In the middle of the 20th century, you could buy a shotgun in London with no questions asked. New York, which at that time had had the stringent Sullivan Law restricting gun ownership since 1911, still had several times the gun murder rate of London, as well as several times the London murder rate with other weapons.

Neither guns nor gun control was the reason for the difference in murder rates. People were the difference.

Yet many of the most zealous advocates of gun control laws, on both sides of the Atlantic, have also been advocates of leniency toward criminals.

In Britain, such people have been so successful that legal gun ownership has been reduced almost to the vanishing point, while even most convicted felons in Britain are not put behind bars. The crime rate, including the rate of crimes committed with guns, is far higher in Britain now than it was back in the days when there were few restrictions on Britons buying firearms.

In 1954, there were only a dozen armed robberies in London but, by the 1990s — after decades of ever tightening gun ownership restrictions — there were more than a hundred times as many armed robberies.

Gun control zealots’ choice of Britain for comparison with the United States has been wholly tendentious, not only because it ignored the history of the two countries, but also because it ignored other countries with stronger gun control laws than the United States, such as Russia, Brazil and Mexico. All of these countries have higher murder rates than the United States.

You could compare other sets of countries and get similar results. Gun ownership has been three times as high in Switzerland as in Germany, but the Swiss have had lower murder rates. Other countries with high rates of gun ownership and low murder rates include Israel, New Zealand, and Finland.

Guns are not the problem. People are the problem — including people who are determined to push gun control laws, either in ignorance of the facts or in defiance of the facts."

 

[msokeefe]

I really struggle to get my ahead around the American obsession with guns.

It isn’t a left/right issue. Here in the UK the overwhelming majority of people strongly disagree with American gun legislation. This is something that applies to people on the furthest reaches of the left and right.

Catholics in the UK really struggle to reconcile civilian gun ownership with the teachings of the Church.

Just check out the rates of firearm deaths in the world.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

The rate of gun deaths in the US is 40 times higher than that in the UK. Countries the likes of Paraguay, Nicaragua and Serbia have lower rates than the US.

It really does not matter what people in the UK think. The UK certainly loved our 2nd amendment during WWII. Fearing a German invasion, they begged Americans with 2nd amendment right for hand guns and rifles. We donated thousands of them.

We deal with a large border, where the UK does not. At our southern border we have a problem with drugs coming into the Country. If we ban guns our southern neighbors will have a new criminal enterprise, guns. So, you mention guns and the teachings of the Catholic Church. Have your forgotten about the Swiss Guard? How about the armed executive protection of the Pope?

americanthinker.com/2013/01/im_british_and_piers_morgan_is_damn_wrong.html

 

[Cor_Cordis]

I really struggle to get my ahead around the American obsession with guns.

…Catholics in the UK really struggle to reconcile civilian gun ownership with the teachings of the Church.

Meanwhile in the U.K.

Christianity ‘Under Attack’ in Britain

telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/4623783/Christianity-in-schools-why-were-losing-our-religion.html

britishfreedom.org/unholy-war-christians-under-attack-in-britain/

UK: “Fast Growing Islamic Community” Seeks More Influence On…. Everything!

Dear British Spiritual “Physician”: Heal thyself first, please.

Remove that beam in your eye, brother, so that you may help us remove our speck.

Thank you.:crutches:

 

[msokeefe]

twinbuttebunch.org/index.php?fuseaction=misc.sendguns

 

[Spudbynight]

It really does not matter what people in the UK think. The UK certainly loved our 2nd amendment during WWII. Fearing a German invasion, they begged Americans with 2nd amendment right for hand guns and rifles. We donated thousands of them.

We deal with a large border, where the UK does not. At our southern border we have a problem with drugs coming into the Country. If we ban guns our southern neighbors will have a new criminal enterprise, guns. So, you mention guns and the teachings of the Catholic Church. Have your forgotten about the Swiss Guard? How about the armed executive protection of the Pope?

americanthinker.com/2013/01/im_british_and_piers_morgan_is_damn_wrong.html

Did American civilians fight during WWII? Do American civilians patrol the Mexican border?

I am sorry to burst your bubble but “not caring what the people in the UK think” is an incredible narrow minded viewpoint.

I haven’t forgotten about the Swiss guard - how does that have any bearing on the teaching of the Church and gun ownership?

 

[Spudbynight]

Meanwhile in the U.K.

Christianity ‘Under Attack’ in Britain

telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/4623783/Christianity-in-schools-why-were-losing-our-religion.html

britishfreedom.org/unholy-war-christians-under-attack-in-britain/

UK: “Fast Growing Islamic Community” Seeks More Influence On…. Everything!

Dear British Spiritual “Physician”: Heal thyself first, please.

Remove that beam in your eye, brother, so that you may help us remove our speck.

Thank you.:crutches:

Seriously? How is ANY of that in any way relevant to the issue at hand?

(I assume you are not suggesting the the answer to the rise of secularism in the UK is give the people guns)

 

[Spudbynight]

I really struggle getting my head around the British in general:

Well that is your failing.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

Q: Would you support or oppose a law requiring background checks on people buying guns at gun shows?

91% approve

Q: Would you support or oppose a law making illegal gun sales a federal crime?

82% approve

Q: Would you support or oppose a law requiring nationwide ban on the sale of assault weapons?

57% approve

So does this poll of uninformed people make you and them “Good” Catholics compared to us dissenting “Bad” Catholics, in your estimation?

Are we advocates of our Constitutional 2nd Amendment Rights, just contributing to the “Culture Of Death” in our uncharitable selfishness, in your opinion?

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Well that is your failing.

It’s not all in the US.

 

[Spudbynight]

It’s not all in the US.

I know, the UK is probably the second most hated country in the world. (Behind the US)

 

[Cor_Cordis]

Seriously? How is ANY of that in any way relevant to the issue at hand?

You implied a morally superior understanding of Catholic teaching in Britain.

But alas, your glass house is in dire risk of boomeranging stones.

 

[Spudbynight]

You implied a morally superior understanding of Catholic teaching in Britain.

But alas, your glass house is in dire risk of boomeranging stones.

I implied no such thing.

Can you try and respond to the point in question rather than deflecting.

 

[msokeefe]

It is not “narrow minded” Should I give up my Roman Catholic beliefs because people like you call me "narrow minded’?

 

[Cor_Cordis]

Well that is your failing.

Ah yes. Mea Culpa.

Such humility on your part.

BTW did you catch this?

Thomas Sowell: Gun Control Still Won’t Work

"But, if you look back through history, you will find that Britain has had a lower murder rate than the United States for more than two centuries — and, for most of that time, the British had no more stringent gun control laws than the United States. Indeed, neither country had stringent gun control for most of that time.

In the middle of the 20th century, you could buy a shotgun in London with no questions asked. New York, which at that time had had the stringent Sullivan Law restricting gun ownership since 1911, still had several times the gun murder rate of London, as well as several times the London murder rate with other weapons.

Neither guns nor gun control was the reason for the difference in murder rates. People were the difference.

Yet many of the most zealous advocates of gun control laws, on both sides of the Atlantic, have also been advocates of leniency toward criminals.

In Britain, such people have been so successful that legal gun ownership has been reduced almost to the vanishing point, while even most convicted felons in Britain are not put behind bars. The crime rate, including the rate of crimes committed with guns, is far higher in Britain now than it was back in the days when there were few restrictions on Britons buying firearms.

In 1954, there were only a dozen armed robberies in London but, by the 1990s — after decades of ever tightening gun ownership restrictions — there were more than a hundred times as many armed robberies.

Gun control zealots’ choice of Britain for comparison with the United States has been wholly tendentious, not only because it ignored the history of the two countries, but also because it ignored other countries with stronger gun control laws than the United States, such as Russia, Brazil and Mexico. All of these countries have higher murder rates than the United States.

You could compare other sets of countries and get similar results. Gun ownership has been three times as high in Switzerland as in Germany, but the Swiss have had lower murder rates. Other countries with high rates of gun ownership and low murder rates include Israel, New Zealand, and Finland."

 

[Cor_Cordis]

It’s not all in the US.

Yes. Some are more righteous.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

I implied no such thing.

Can you try and respond to the point in question rather than deflecting.

I did respond to it.

You don’t seem to understand the deeper implications of your own questions.

 

[Spudbynight]

Ah yes. Mea Culpa.

Such humility on your part.

BTW did you catch this?

I did catch it - I thought I was on **Catholic **Answers.

I don’t see any point discussing this topic on here - certainly not with people who resort to veiled ad hominem attacks and borderline racism.

Enjoy your guns.