Catholic Church Lacks Genuine Help For Rape Victims From Catholic Prospective

[centurionguard]

My apologies again, I really am at a lost at what you are not finding. If you are looking for a Catholic ministry dealing with rape victims, there are plenty. The Holy See has ethicists who deal with ethical treatment of rape victims as well.

I am a victim myself, I understand some of the issues, but I am not differant then any other victim. The Church has programs for this through various programs and charities.

Again what are you looking for?

No disrespect; but why is it you only make generalized remarks concerning the availability of possible Church programs for rape victims through various ministries and charities ? Are they available in every Catholic Diocese ? What I am looking for I obviously can not find, otherwise I would be able to specifically put a name to such resource.
Without generalizing can you make a long list of identifiable names to such Catholic ministries and charities for both female and male rape victims ?
It would be sincerely appreciated.

Believe me I have tried with some big Catholic Charities from an international level and with different echelon in administration only to be left dead in the water as if they were passing the buck to some subordinate who lacks information.

Peace

Chris

 

[centurionguard]

I am left a little stumped in all this. You would think that there is at least some remote person here in the Catholic Answers Forum, whether it be in the Administration, Moderators, or Clergy who have perhaps glanced at this thread and unable to offer any valued constructive (name removed by moderator)ut inside this thread.

 

[catharina]

cg, in regard to your last two posts, maybe you’re aiming too high for help?

In fact administrators at Catholic Charities are as likely to be clueless as most employees.

On the other hand, if you simply present yourself as a client (or patient) in need of services, then maybe you’ll be more likely to find such services. This requires a huge degree of humility since you’ll be more accurately served when you give the most issues of your situation. Since no one can do that easily, walking in off the street, it might be best to begin by saying you’ve been a victim of serious criminal violence and you’ve received no help since the attack. That might sum it up for the intake/triage worker with your own more personal details to follow. At this time, since you’ve mentioned suicide, I’d suggest heading for the closest Catholic hospital or medical center, one that offers psychiatric treatment since you seem to be in need of that. That “need” is not at all unusual considering what you’ve suffered.

Assistance for rape victims is not exactly advertised by the Church since the very word “rape” in the title of services would be enough to keep many victims away. However, I can promise that you’re not alone in your horrible misery. Despite what you said earliier, it’s my impression that a significant number of CA posters have been subjected to rape and other forms of violence. (Meaning, in the past, I’ve seen such posts.)

Since you are now both angry AND depressed, a psychiatric intervention could serve you very well. (Not a hospitalization, but a plan for very longterm counseling; maybe some meds too.) When a vicitm of violence sounds much angrier at those who seem to have failed to help him/her than at the actual perps, the problem has already escalated.

In your own diocesan offices, there must be a number of ministries:
ministry to families
ministry to adult singles
ministry to youth
ministry to the homebound
ministry to the disabled
etc…

Any one of these MIGHT know of a specialized service that can best help you.
However, I’d start with the Intake worker at the local Catholic Charities.
No special pulling strings, just “I’m here. Help me.”
CC could (SHOULD) refer you to a Catholic hospital.

If not, take yourself there; register for CLINIC services, psychiatric, as a victim of violence.
Stick with this approach until it works. Until you have something in place that will provide you with longterm treatment and oversight. The hospital might assign you a psychiatrist for assessment and any needs for medication. Also it will/should assign you a qualified THERAPIST (pychologist or social worker) who can guide and support you through the process of longterm healing (appts once or twice a week, for as long as needed).

Please recognize that allowing your sense of outraged neglect (by the Church) is only complicating the facts of the actual assault. Is there ANY priest in your life (or any nun) who could help you track through the resources you need? It’s imperative that you confide in such a person - for moral support, if nothing else. Is your family aware/supportive?

Again, you’re in my prayers.

 

[catharina]

Chris, hi again.
I opened your public profile and scanned back to your older posts.
Now I understand the actual history - and passage of years - in your situtation.
Realizing that, I offer sorrow and apologies that the Church has not yet been able to help.
It’s a long time to allow PTSD to take root and grow.

For now, any assistance you can find for yourself is worthwhile.
Locating a Pastoral Counselor might be wisest.
These men and women have earned master’s degree in pastoral care.
They provide care and support to any Catholic who needs it.
One might be easily located on campus of a reputable Catholic university or hospital.
At times too, they can be found in the Pastoral Care departments of Catholic hospitals.

Because you were silent for so long, now I better grasp the intensity of your situation.
Literally, ‘you lost your voice’ and couldn’t seek help for many years.
Find help NOW. Go straight to the nearest pastoral care worker in your vincinity.
They are equipped to give great guidance and care as you re-gain your strength.

It might help you to recall (as often as possible) that many others around the world, especially among persecuted Catholic populations, have suffered in similar - and even worse - ways. Despite your feeling of aloneness, you are NOT alone with sorrow.

I’m sorry re your mother’s illness and your brother’s issue with ALS. Yes, you are carrying tremendous burdens. Still I promise that the very best help for you is within the Church, within the Sacraments. Remember that no one can touch your soul. Rather, it is, as always and forever, safe in the hands of Our Lord. God bless you mightily.

 

[centurionguard]

cg, in regard to your last two posts, maybe you’re aiming too high for help?

In fact administrators at Catholic Charities are as likely to be clueless as most employees.

On the other hand, if you simply present yourself as a client (or patient) in need of services, then maybe you’ll be more likely to find such services. This requires a huge degree of humility since you’ll be more accurately served when you give the most issues of your situation. Since no one can do that easily, walking in off the street, it might be best to begin by saying you’ve been a victim of serious criminal violence and you’ve received no help since the attack. That might sum it up for the intake/triage worker with your own more personal details to follow. At this time, since you’ve mentioned suicide, I’d suggest heading for the closest Catholic hospital or medical center, one that offers psychiatric treatment since you seem to be in need of that. That “need” is not at all unusual considering what you’ve suffered.

Assistance for rape victims is not exactly advertised by the Church since the very word “rape” in the title of services would be enough to keep many victims away. However, I can promise that you’re not alone in your horrible misery. Despite what you said earliier, it’s my impression that a significant number of CA posters have been subjected to rape and other forms of violence. (Meaning, in the past, I’ve seen such posts.)

Since you are now both angry AND depressed, a psychiatric intervention could serve you very well. (Not a hospitalization, but a plan for very longterm counseling; maybe some meds too.) When a vicitm of violence sounds much angrier at those who seem to have failed to help him/her than at the actual perps, the problem has already escalated.

In your own diocesan offices, there must be a number of ministries:
ministry to families
ministry to adult singles
ministry to youth
ministry to the homebound
ministry to the disabled
etc…

Any one of these MIGHT know of a specialized service that can best help you.
However, I’d start with the Intake worker at the local Catholic Charities.
No special pulling strings, just “I’m here. Help me.”
CC could (SHOULD) refer you to a Catholic hospital.

If not, take yourself there; register for CLINIC services, psychiatric, as a victim of violence.
Stick with this approach until it works. Until you have something in place that will provide you with longterm treatment and oversight. The hospital might assign you a psychiatrist for assessment and any needs for medication. Also it will/should assign you a qualified THERAPIST (pychologist or social worker) who can guide and support you through the process of longterm healing (appts once or twice a week, for as long as needed).

Please recognize that allowing your sense of outraged neglect (by the Church) is only complicating the facts of the actual assault. Is there ANY priest in your life (or any nun) who could help you track through the resources you need? It’s imperative that you confide in such a person - for moral support, if nothing else. Is your family aware/supportive?

Again, you’re in my prayers.

Hi Catharina;

Thank you for adding some heartfelt sincerity in this thread. Trust me it’s well received.
I wish I could say in all seemliness and humility that I am not in some respect angered at the Church. I can only hope to claim in some manner with all candidness and candor that I do not blame God or the church for my gang-rape past. I have in earnest and with the greatest politeness tried to come out of my vulnerability and have made a few connections with lay people and priests in the Church. I suppose I expected more than just a one time sympathetic ear. I do feel that for the most part that my Catholic faith is growing stronger if not besieged by the undulating tide of continuous horrific memories of my gang-rape at gunpoint by two men and one woman along with two other male rape victims, with one who committed suicide one week after the rape. I will spare you all the horrific, demoralizing, and heart-wrenching details. Suffice to say that my soul was cast into the neither world thirty years ago. Despite my perpetrators robbing me of my soul and leaving me with permanent physical injuries along with mental scars and virtual cognitive death. It’s taken me thirty years to get where I am today. For twenty-three years due to self blame, shame and guilt I managed to keep my past to myself telling nobody even my family; that is until a major nervous breakdown six years ago that put me in a psychiatric unit for two months. In these last six years I have been in psychotherapy with very slow recovery. But I have been suicide-free for two years. So perhaps God is working in me.
But I still feel that I am a victim and not a survivor due to the great pain I carry in my heart.
Rape affliction is like a cancer that relentlessly eats away. Just when I think that I have beaten my affliction I am tormented and haunted inside again. There are Times when I wish my perpetrators would have shot and killed me thirty years ago. But most times thankfully I do not think this way, pursuing in hope, faith, prayer, love of God, and humanity. It is one hell of a struggle though when such hope wanes in the distance. Regrettably; I do get caught up in emotionality. I can only apologize when I try to reach out for more hope in my human weakness. It is not my intention bring pain or resentment with anyone. Life is a learning experience even when we are in our weakest hour.
Catharina; I don’t think everything said in this thread will bring closure in my continued search for authentic resources in the Catholic Church for (“ALL”) female and male rape victims. Being a “heterosexual” man forced to live with a great cross is not easy by any means. But I do want to reiterate my appreciation for your kind (name removed by moderator)ut.

Sincere Kind Regards
Chris

 

[Dori1]

Hi Catharina;

Thank you for adding some heartfelt sincerity in this thread. Trust me it’s well received.
I wish I could say in all seemliness and humility that I am not in some respect angered at the Church. I can only hope to claim in some manner with all candidness and candor that I do not blame God or the church for my gang-rape past. I have in earnest and with the greatest politeness tried to come out of my vulnerability and have made a few connections with lay people and priests in the Church. I suppose I expected more than just a one time sympathetic ear. I do feel that for the most part that my Catholic faith is growing stronger if not besieged by the undulating tide of continuous horrific memories of my gang-rape at gunpoint by two men and one woman along with two other male rape victims, with one who committed suicide one week after the rape. I will spare you all the horrific, demoralizing, and heart-wrenching details. Suffice to say that my soul was cast into the neither world thirty years ago. Despite my perpetrators robbing me of my soul and leaving me with permanent physical injuries along with mental scars and virtual cognitive death. It’s taken me thirty years to get where I am today. For twenty-three years due to self blame, shame and guilt I managed to keep my past to myself telling nobody even my family; that is until a major nervous breakdown six years ago that put me in a psychiatric unit for two months. In these last six years I have been in psychotherapy with very slow recovery. But I have been suicide-free for two years. So perhaps God is working in me.
But I still feel that I am a victim and not a survivor due to the great pain I carry in my heart.
Rape affliction is like a cancer that relentlessly eats away. Just when I think that I have beaten my affliction I am tormented and haunted inside again. There are Times when I wish my perpetrators would have shot and killed me thirty years ago. But most times thankfully I do not think this way, pursuing in hope, faith, prayer, love of God, and humanity. It is one hell of a struggle though when such hope wanes in the distance. Regrettably; I do get caught up in emotionality. I can only apologize when I try to reach out for more hope in my human weakness. It is not my intention bring pain or resentment with anyone. Life is a learning experience even when we are in our weakest hour.
Catharina; I don’t think everything said in this thread will bring closure in my continued search for authentic resources in the Catholic Church for (“ALL”) female and male rape victims. Being a “heterosexual” man forced to live with a great cross is not easy by any means. But I do want to reiterate my appreciation for your kind (name removed by moderator)ut.

Sincere Kind Regards
Chris

Chris;

I apologize for interjecting in the middle of this discussion. I felt, though, that I needed to. Your posts demonstrate a lot of pain and anger regarding your past experience and I wanted to share some hope with you from my personal experience. I was the victim of a particularly violent rape 20 years ago. I could not keep it secret from those around me because I had to spend two weeks in the hospital due to the magnitude of the injuries associated with this stranger-based attack. 20 years ago there was a very poor understanding of how to approach the spiritual and psychological needs of the victims of such horrific crimes. There were those, even in the medical community who implied, by their actions, words and demeanor, that they suspected that all women who were raped had somehow brought it upon themselves. This attack was a home invasion and while my husband was away, my three very young children were in the house, in bed while it occurred. I, too, have permanent scars, and will soon have to have a surgery to reconstruct the repair that was done following that attack due to inadequate tissue matching and persistent problems.

I have undertaken counseling on a number of occasions over the years and have not found a lot of help in this venue. Some, however, find great assistance this way. I can tell you from personal experience and from my hundreds upon hundreds of clients; that feeling pain does not mean you can’t classify yourself as a survivor rather than a victim. It is not negative or fatalistic to say that you will always have some level of pain associated with the memory of such an experience. The healing comes when you understand that God can make something good come of such horror. When you realize what you can do with the experience, it stops feeling like someone is stabbing you in the heart all the time, and you simply, occasionally, feel a throbbing memory.

After my experience, my marriage fell apart and my husband left because I was unwilling to participate in an “open marriage.” This was something that had never even been brought up until I was “damaged goods.” I was left alone with a lot of pain, three children and no education. I decided that I was somehow going to see to it that I could make a difference in the lives of at least some. I did my undergraduate work in Biochemistry, went to medical school, did a residency and then went to work in a small rural community with the highest teen pregnancy rate in the state. (It no longer holds that awful title). I was the only female physician doing obstetrics in a 3 county radius and so became the “go-to” person for sexual assault. The police blotter never noted any assaults, but the young girls were being victimized frequently. I started a local sexual assault response team and got several nurses trained as sexual assault nurse examiners (SANEs). When my new husband’s disease (I remarried in medical school) became worse and he needed me home at more regular times, I faced a new challenge. God has been calling me to demonstrate my forgiveness and dedication by placing me in charge of the medical providers giving care to the maximum security inmates in a men’s institution. In this position, I have been able to give God my entire life and truly complete my healing process by forgiving those who commit such crimes and treating them with compassion as a physician.

This long missive is meant, simply, to provide you with hope. Healing is there. God, however, requires that you actively reach out for it. Time is important, but is not enough. Find what you can do with your experience. Use it to help someone else, whatever you are able to do. It will be a start. My prayers are with you; and I have faith that the Lord, in Christ will show you your, personal way to healing.

In his love,

 

[catharina]

Chris, thanks for your response.
I hope you saw my additional post too: Post # 24.
Then’s there now one from Dori1 also: Post # 26.

As Dori1 pointed out there were few helpful resources available for anyone 20-30-40 yrs ago - in the Church or outside the Church. Over time, there’s been progress. Do not ever give up NO ONE can touch your soul.

 

[Jermosh]

What I am looking for I obviously can not find, otherwise I would be able to specifically put a name to such resource.

Then that’s the problem. The Church is not a civil authority, most priests are in no way capable of how to emotionally deal with a rape victim, or a abused child, or a whole host of other victims. They have a secular education and are trained on morality, and priestly dealings including dealing with grief. They should be able to help and console and send you to the proper help though, but they should not be able to help you. You are talking about very selective an precise training here, its not something that all priests could do.

I am a sufferer of PTSD myself, although not from my rape but from the dramatic loss of my child in a drowning accident. I used to have horrible panic attacks and have had successful treatments using Eye movement desensitization and reprocessing(EMDR). I really do not see anyone in the Church but a few who could offer such treatment, or the medication that goes with it.

 

[centurionguard]

Chris;

I apologize for interjecting in the middle of this discussion. I felt, though, that I needed to. Your posts demonstrate a lot of pain and anger regarding your past experience and I wanted to share some hope with you from my personal experience. I was the victim of a particularly violent rape 20 years ago. I could not keep it secret from those around me because I had to spend two weeks in the hospital due to the magnitude of the injuries associated with this stranger-based attack. 20 years ago there was a very poor understanding of how to approach the spiritual and psychological needs of the victims of such horrific crimes. There were those, even in the medical community who implied, by their actions, words and demeanor, that they suspected that all women who were raped had somehow brought it upon themselves. This attack was a home invasion and while my husband was away, my three very young children were in the house, in bed while it occurred. I, too, have permanent scars, and will soon have to have a surgery to reconstruct the repair that was done following that attack due to inadequate tissue matching and persistent problems.

I have undertaken counseling on a number of occasions over the years and have not found a lot of help in this venue. Some, however, find great assistance this way. I can tell you from personal experience and from my hundreds upon hundreds of clients; that feeling pain does not mean you can’t classify yourself as a survivor rather than a victim. It is not negative or fatalistic to say that you will always have some level of pain associated with the memory of such an experience. The healing comes when you understand that God can make something good come of such horror. When you realize what you can do with the experience, it stops feeling like someone is stabbing you in the heart all the time, and you simply, occasionally, feel a throbbing memory.

After my experience, my marriage fell apart and my husband left because I was unwilling to participate in an “open marriage.” This was something that had never even been brought up until I was “damaged goods.” I was left alone with a lot of pain, three children and no education. I decided that I was somehow going to see to it that I could make a difference in the lives of at least some. I did my undergraduate work in Biochemistry, went to medical school, did a residency and then went to work in a small rural community with the highest teen pregnancy rate in the state. (It no longer holds that awful title). I was the only female physician doing obstetrics in a 3 county radius and so became the “go-to” person for sexual assault. The police blotter never noted any assaults, but the young girls were being victimized frequently. I started a local sexual assault response team and got several nurses trained as sexual assault nurse examiners (SANEs). When my new husband’s disease (I remarried in medical school) became worse and he needed me home at more regular times, I faced a new challenge. God has been calling me to demonstrate my forgiveness and dedication by placing me in charge of the medical providers giving care to the maximum security inmates in a men’s institution. In this position, I have been able to give God my entire life and truly complete my healing process by forgiving those who commit such crimes and treating them with compassion as a physician.

This long missive is meant, simply, to provide you with hope. Healing is there. God, however, requires that you actively reach out for it. Time is important, but is not enough. Find what you can do with your experience. Use it to help someone else, whatever you are able to do. It will be a start. My prayers are with you; and I have faith that the Lord, in Christ will show you your, personal way to healing.

In his love,

Dori;

Thank you for taking the time to share some of your most distressing moments and vulnerability. You have given me much to think about in ways to strengthen my heart.
Please allow me to express for a moment my deepest empathies in what you experienced. But I see that you have turned it into a strength which helps me envision new found hope. Though I have never been married, there was a special woman in my life for two years whom I was very much in love hoping to marry. Perhaps she left me for similar reasons your former husband left you. I don’t know; was it my emotional baggage, a lack of compassionate understanding on her part. In truthful hindsight I do not really blame her. Ever since I was a kid I knew that God blessed me as being very empathic towards others. Some men might identify that as a weakness. But I do sometimes think that if I had a victimized wife, I would have tried in earnest to stick it out for better or worse, in sickness and health. Regrettably some situations in life do not allow us to change the past. You had mentioned (“SANE”) nurses and physicians. Such a program only started in most hospitals in the eastern Maritime provinces in Canada seven years ago. I never had much luck with such medical professionals. Being a “heterosexual” male rape victim I’ve only confronted disdain, indifference, and disbelief. These are not just my biased perceptions. Of course; this is not to say that I haven’t met (“some”) compassionate nurses and doctors. Hospital emergency trauma areas can often be a hell hole where rape victims are least to find true compassion in an emotionally charged trauma scene. Far greater if you happen to be a male rape victim. Forgive me for straying away from the main theme of your discussion which I do honor and appreciate.

This long missive is meant, simply, to provide you with hope. Healing is there. God, however, requires that you actively reach out for it. Time is important, but is not enough. Find what you can do with your experience. Use it to help someone else, whatever you are able to do. It will be a start. My prayers are with you; and I have faith that the Lord, in Christ will show you your, personal way to healing.

Dori; you have given my heart much to contemplate. Thank you…Sincerely !

 

[centurionguard]

Then that’s the problem. The Church is not a civil authority, most priests are in no way capable of how to emotionally deal with a rape victim, or a abused child, or a whole host of other victims. They have a secular education and are trained on morality, and priestly dealings including dealing with grief. They should be able to help and console and send you to the proper help though, but they should not be able to help you. You are talking about very selective an precise training here, its not something that all priests could do.

I am a sufferer of PTSD myself, although not from my rape but from the dramatic loss of my child in a drowning accident. I used to have horrible panic attacks and have had successful treatments using Eye movement desensitization and reprocessing(EMDR). I really do not see anyone in the Church but a few who could offer such treatment, or the medication that goes with it.

Hello Jermosh;

I can verily commiserate with the loss of your child and the burden of your past sexual assault. You do have some valued viewpoints which I do not ignore lightly.
Given the fact that the U.S. is much larger in population than Canada I have done much research over the years even writing to various U.S. federal government departments disclosing briefly my past and in search of statistics. Here are some shocking disclosures.
Between 1985-2007 (“Eighteen Million Women”) in the U.S. have been raped. (“250,000”) reported cases of men who have been raped. These statistics only take into partial account a huge and vast number of rape and incest victims who (do “not”) choose to report such crimes. A number of professionals working in psychiatric and psychotherapy circles claim that of those victimized men due to societal biased judgment and stigma who do not come forward and seek professional help were to actually be accounted for; such statistics would reflect not too far off from the amount of women who are raped every year. This is extremely hard to believe by most in society. It seems to me that if the Catholic Church being the largest Christian organization can not place itself in a stronger position to reach out instead of being sometimes partial and suspicious of rape victims. Perhaps just maybe more rape victims than as already present would trust the motives of the Church. As I said in a earlier post. I do not speak of only female rape victims considering abortion issues, nor am I trying to denounce such issues. Maybe I’m just a voiced windbag speaking about unimportant relevance. All I can do is press on one day at a time and hopefully heal myself first before addressing a global problem I have no power to fix. Maybe you are right in stating

The Church is not a civil authority, most priests are in no way capable of how to emotionally deal with a rape victim, or a abused child, or a whole host of other victims. They have a secular education and are trained on morality, and priestly dealings including dealing with grief. They should be able to help and console and send you to the proper help though, but they should not be able to help you. You are talking about very selective an precise training here, its not something that all priests could do.

Kind Regards
Chris

 

[BiologyBrain]

I may not have a leg to stand on since I’ve not been the victim of rape or anything, but I felt the need to comment anyway. My apologies if I speak out of place.

I think the Church offers some support for victims of all crimes, but there is probably not one centralized source for such support. As Jermosh pointed out, dealing w/ a victim’s state of mind is not what priests and lay ministers of the Church are trained for. That’s not to say that they should not lend a compassionate ear to the victim. However, if they sincerely feel that it is over their heads & they may do more harm than good, I’d say they are doing their job to the best of their ability. It is truly a misfortune to be rejected counsel I’m sure - especially as Martha phrased her priest’s dismissal. However, I’m inclined to give the benefit of the doubt to all - including those who phrase things wrong in bad situations.

I know my diocese has a special program (I actually think its nation-wide in the US) where priests go for training to speak out about victimization (especially w/n the Church, but really of all types of sexual victimization) and to learn more about dealing with this very sensitive issue. One of our local priests in particular was very vocal and active in this area since he’d been victimized as a young boy. I can’t off the top of my head recall the name of the group, but I do know that it was affiliated w/ the US Catholic Church.

I feel horribly for those who have been victimized, although I do not truly understand. However, I would probably lend a compassionate ear, but be unable to offer valuable insight to a victim. Therefore, I, personally, would be most comfortable directing the victim to someone - even a secular organization - for counselling and/or a vent session. I may be a coward for taking this ‘easy’ way out, but I would rather offer no advice than offer bad advice. Anyway, that’s just my opinion - take it for what it is. You all have my sincere condolences & prayers for the horrible victimization you faced. I congratulate you on making it this far to where you can tell complete strangers (even on internet) of your story. That truly takes courage and strength that I’m not 100% sure I’d have.

 

[marthagreys]

Brian,
In response to your last sentence about talking about this on the internet, I have to say that I’m not sure if it takes courage or desparation - a level of desparation that there’s not a strong enough word in the English language to describe. I’ve taken to talking about in online because there’s not anyone else who cares - inc my priest. And feel free to defend his callousness if you feel you must - I see it a little differently. I wasn’t asking him to be a therapist or counselor - I was asking him to do his job as a priest, and frankly, I don’t think it’s asking that much. Hey - my child was hurt by a member of the parish while she was on her way to Mass and the priest, while willing to visit this pig in jail each week won’t even give us 5min for a prayer. Do you really not see something wrong with this picture? I wouldn’t expect a priest to be able to deal with a situation like this in depth, but I don’t think it’s pushing the limit to hope for an occasional (even once) shoulder to cry on.
Just so we’re on the same page, I’m not discussing this on this forum because of courage, I’m here because there’s not another person in the world who cares whether we live or die, or whether we cry ourselves to sleep, or can’t sleep. We have, however, had several people in the parish harrass us with cruel, vicious comments about the whole thing - inc despicable rumors that he was my boyfriend, my daughter got pregnant by him, etc. We’ve been revictimized time and again by the very people who should be our best support system. So please understand when I’m not real tolerant and gracious about a priest who wont give us even the smallest show of support but comes up with the time to serve communion and collect the weekly tithe check from the pervert in jail. I think it’s real messed up when the sex offender gets more acknowledgement than the victims - and I don’t apologize for saying so.

 

[centurionguard]

Brian,
In response to your last sentence about talking about this on the internet, I have to say that I’m not sure if it takes courage or desparation - a level of desparation that there’s not a strong enough word in the English language to describe. I’ve taken to talking about in online because there’s not anyone else who cares - inc my priest. And feel free to defend his callousness if you feel you must - I see it a little differently. I wasn’t asking him to be a therapist or counselor - I was asking him to do his job as a priest, and frankly, I don’t think it’s asking that much. Hey - my child was hurt by a member of the parish while she was on her way to Mass and the priest, while willing to visit this pig in jail each week won’t even give us 5min for a prayer. Do you really not see something wrong with this picture? I wouldn’t expect a priest to be able to deal with a situation like this in depth, but I don’t think it’s pushing the limit to hope for an occasional (even once) shoulder to cry on.
Just so we’re on the same page, I’m not discussing this on this forum because of courage, I’m here because there’s not another person in the world who cares whether we live or die, or whether we cry ourselves to sleep, or can’t sleep. We have, however, had several people in the parish harrass us with cruel, vicious comments about the whole thing - inc despicable rumors that he was my boyfriend, my daughter got pregnant by him, etc. We’ve been revictimized time and again by the very people who should be our best support system. So please understand when I’m not real tolerant and gracious about a priest who wont give us even the smallest show of support but comes up with the time to serve communion and collect the weekly tithe check from the pervert in jail. I think it’s real messed up when the sex offender gets more acknowledgement than the victims - and I don’t apologize for saying so.

Hi Martha;

Just want you to know that I support your thinking and troubled heart in every way once again. Being a rape victim myself I can feel what your daughter is feeling and what you as her mother must be feeling. As you being a mother who loves your daughter very much you have gone past the point of being an outsider who can only empathize. What you have done is placed your heart inside the same sacred vulnerable space as your daughters broken heart. So in that same exacting manner you feel what your daughter feels as if you yourself were a rape victim yourself. I must tell you that few people understanding rape from an outside are capable doing what you are doing with your heart.

The demeanor of that priest and how his actions shrugged you and your daughter away was wrong even if the remote possibility existed that the priest didn’t understand the full scope of what he was doing. What you have tried to convey in this thread is one example of how the Catholic Church (“sometimes”) fails in her mission to fully embrace rape victims who are hidden in vast numbers of her congregations. If the Catholic Church does not make herself vulnerable and open enough with greater efforts to embrace ALL rape victims then I fear that God’s Word alone (“without actions of love”) will leave many rape victims by the wayside. I think what I state here is very much a valid statement, even if some reading this will see it as a generalized phrase. Perhaps some here might even judge my statement as cold. But then again they are not rape victims.

 

[centurionguard]

I may not have a leg to stand on since I’ve not been the victim of rape or anything, but I felt the need to comment anyway. My apologies if I speak out of place.

I think the Church offers some support for victims of all crimes, but there is probably not one centralized source for such support. As Jermosh pointed out, dealing w/ a victim’s state of mind is not what priests and lay ministers of the Church are trained for. That’s not to say that they should not lend a compassionate ear to the victim. However, if they sincerely feel that it is over their heads & they may do more harm than good, I’d say they are doing their job to the best of their ability. It is truly a misfortune to be rejected counsel I’m sure - especially as Martha phrased her priest’s dismissal. However, I’m inclined to give the benefit of the doubt to all - including those who phrase things wrong in bad situations.

I know my diocese has a special program (I actually think its nation-wide in the US) where priests go for training to speak out about victimization (especially w/n the Church, but really of all types of sexual victimization) and to learn more about dealing with this very sensitive issue. One of our local priests in particular was very vocal and active in this area since he’d been victimized as a young boy. I can’t off the top of my head recall the name of the group, but I do know that it was affiliated w/ the US Catholic Church.

I feel horribly for those who have been victimized, although I do not truly understand. However, I would probably lend a compassionate ear, but be unable to offer valuable insight to a victim. Therefore, I, personally, would be most comfortable directing the victim to someone - even a secular organization - for counselling and/or a vent session. I may be a coward for taking this ‘easy’ way out, but I would rather offer no advice than offer bad advice. Anyway, that’s just my opinion - take it for what it is. You all have my sincere condolences & prayers for the horrible victimization you faced. I congratulate you on making it this far to where you can tell complete strangers (even on internet) of your story. That truly takes courage and strength that I’m not 100% sure I’d have.

Hi Brian;

Respectfully; I’m not really sure if you and Jermosh have a solid point here.

I think the Church offers some support for victims of all crimes, but there is probably not one centralized source for such support. As Jermosh pointed out, dealing w/ a victim’s state of mind is not what priests and lay ministers of the Church are trained for.

When a novitiate goes into a seminary to undertake studies to become priest, his curriculum does involve psychology, as well as philosophy, and theological studies. Perhaps such studies in psychology are not in depth as secular psychiatrists or psychologists but nevertheless are involved in the understanding of the human psyche insofar as to how the human spirit reacts in times of despair, and very traumatic instances. Every priest who is consecrated before God and the Church and receives the Holy Sacrament of Holy Orders is empowered by the Holy Spirit and conferred as a shepherd to lead and speak to the vulnerable hearts of his sheepfold whether in a congregation or on a one to one basis. One hundred and forty-five years ago the secular Father of Psychiatry (“Freud”) didn’t exist. What makes a priest any less capable today to speak one on one with his traumatized mentally injured sheep than 145 years ago ?
I would say that a priest is far more qualified than the secular humanistic and pluralistic sciences of psychiatry and psychologist and their theoretical relativism’s on the human psyche. Although I have sought the services of a number of Shrinks I find their science seriously flawed and often opposed to Spiritual Theology in the Catholic Church.
I would in no way underscore the great importance of a blessed priest. I have had the earnest humble privilege of working along side a few of them for a number of years and can tell you that most priest work a 14-16 hour day on call 24-hours a day. Surely though they have time in their week schedule to listen with their heart to a rape victim with a shattered soul that needs tenderness helping the victim put their soul back in an appreciable state of peace, enabling them to press on in hope. Is that not too much to ask for ? Brian; my friend. You say you have a difficult time understanding what a rape victim is subjected to. As for you being an outsider all I can say it is far much more than just physical injuries. It takes humility, commitment, and love to understand. Something that is greatly (“lacking”) in society and even in the Church.

 

[marthagreys]

QUOTE:The Church is not a civil authority, most priests are in no way capable of how to emotionally deal with a rape victim, or a abused child, or a whole host of other victims. They have a secular education and are trained on morality, and priestly dealings including dealing with grief. They should be able to help and console and send you to the proper help though, but they should not be able to help you. You are talking about very selective an precise training here, its not something that all priests could do.

I have to add something here. I don’t think any of us are asking the Church to act as a civil authority or are asking individual priests to provide in-depth psychoanalysis. All I wanted was a safe church environment for my daughter and some compassion/sensitivity and spiritual direction while we were going through all of this - a therapist can’t give a blessing or absolution. It doesn’t require a degree in psychiatric medicine or in law to provide these things - it only requires that someone cares. I never had a stillborn baby, but I knew enough to send a condolance card to a neighbor who had one. I’ve never lost my house to a fire, but I donated money/food to a local family who’s house went up in flames. I’ve never had cancer, but I take a meal to a friend’s family each week after her chemo. No, I couldn’t counsel the grieving mother, I couldn’t rebuild the house, and I can’t provide cancer treatment - I’m not qualified, but in each of these instances the people know that I care, because I’ve done what I am qualified to do. Caring, and helping within one’s limits, doesn’t require precise training - it requires compassion - something that I’ve found to be severely lacking.

 

[Jermosh]

I have to add something here. I don’t think any of us are asking the Church to act as a civil authority or are asking individual priests to provide in-depth psychoanalysis. All I wanted was a safe church environment for my daughter and some compassion/sensitivity and spiritual direction while we were going through all of this - a therapist can’t give a blessing or absolution. It doesn’t require a degree in psychiatric medicine or in law to provide these things - it only requires that someone cares. I never had a stillborn baby, but I knew enough to send a condolance card to a neighbor who had one. I’ve never lost my house to a fire, but I donated money/food to a local family who’s house went up in flames. I’ve never had cancer, but I take a meal to a friend’s family each week after her chemo. No, I couldn’t counsel the grieving mother, I couldn’t rebuild the house, and I can’t provide cancer treatment - I’m not qualified, but in each of these instances the people know that I care, because I’ve done what I am qualified to do. Caring, and helping within one’s limits, doesn’t require precise training - it requires compassion - something that I’ve found to be severely lacking.

Martha,

I am not quite sure what to say to this. You may have a bad priest, or there may be things that are involved more then you don’t know. Every priest I knew of would have seen you and attempted to consule you and your daughter, they would have also turned in the rapist. But they would have also directed you to a professional therapist for treatment. Maybe that therapist was a preist as it was very possible in Mass since there was so many Religous schools in the area. But a priest is not trained to be a pychologist for the mind, but of the soul. Those 2 should be one in the same, but not always.

 

[Jermosh]

What makes a priest any less capable today to speak one on one with his traumatized mentally injured sheep than 145 years ago ?

Rape or any sexual crime was never spoke of 145 years ago. It happened of course, but the victim usually went on through life bearing the cross. Fortunately this is not the case today. We also used to treat ailments with bleeding, or think that drinking radiated water was good for health.

I would say that a priest is far more qualified than the secular humanistic and pluralistic sciences of psychiatry and psychologist and their theoretical relativism’s on the human psyche. Although I have sought the services of a number of Shrinks I find their science seriously flawed and often opposed to Spiritual Theology in the Catholic Church.

Then you need to find one who is in communion with the Church.

I would in no way underscore the great importance of a blessed priest. I have had the earnest humble privilege of working along side a few of them for a number of years and can tell you that most priest work a 14-16 hour day on call 24-hours a day. Surely though they have time in their week schedule to listen with their heart to a rape victim with a shattered soul that needs tenderness helping the victim put their soul back in an appreciable state of peace, enabling them to press on in hope. Is that not too much to ask for ?

Every priest that I knew of would have done this and have. But this is in no way a treatment for PTSD, which is a serious mental illness that needs serious medical and psychological help. Would you go to a priest if you had cancer, or a stab wound? Priests used to take care of the sick at one time as well, but most are not medical doctors today by any stretch.

 

[Lainey63]

I’m sorry to hear that help is hard to find. I am returning to counseling at my parish and one of the issues I will be tackling will be my rape & childhood sexual abuse. The counselor is trained & licensed and I have met with her before she is good. So I will be getting some good psychological healing along with spiritual healing. The pastor helps with the spiritual healing. I am very fortunate. If you like some more information to see if you can get the same type of services available let me know and I can give you the number of my parish and you can get more information.

 

[centurionguard]

Rape or any sexual crime was never spoke of 145 years ago. It happened of course, but the victim usually went on through life bearing the cross. Fortunately this is not the case today. We also used to treat ailments with bleeding, or think that drinking radiated water was good for health.

Then you need to find one who is in communion with the Church.

Every priest that I knew of would have done this and have. But this is in no way a treatment for PTSD, which is a serious mental illness that needs serious medical and psychological help. Would you go to a priest if you had cancer, or a stab wound? Priests used to take care of the sick at one time as well, but most are not medical doctors today by any stretch.

Jermosh;

Rape or any sexual crime was never spoke of 145 years ago.

I don’t think in all honesty that you or I can unequivocally say that rape crimes were (“never”) spoken about in media scripts 145 years ago compared to the grand scale it is today. To boldly claim that rape or sexual crimes were (“never”) publicly recorded is somewhat assuming.

We also used to treat ailments with bleeding, or think that drinking radiated water was good for health.

Not sure how you attribute your statement about past ailments with bleeding and drinking radiated water compared to the treatment of any victimized person confronted with rape affliction

Every priest that I knew of would have done this and have.

Every priest that you or I ("might have Known) that spiritually counseled a rape victim in their life time would most probably be less than the fingers on your two hands.
By what route would you find a statistical account of this surmise actually happening.

But this is in no way a treatment for PTSD, which is a serious mental illness that needs serious medical and psychological help.

I am not alluding that a priest should give psychological/psychotherapy help to any rape victim. What would benefit the rape victim who is shattered inside is a form of spiritual counseling help that they they would not normally receive otherwise from a homily, or a Mass. Most Catholics who are rape victims respect the idea that a priest is holy and that a kind endearing spiritual prayer and a personal blessing from the priest or even the sacrament of the sick would be beneficial to most rape victims if such actions were done in proper faith and tactfulness.

Would you go to a priest if you had cancer, or a stab wound? Priests used to take care of the sick at one time as well, but most are not medical doctors today by any stretch

It is the obligatory duty of every priest to visit and comfort the sick to the best of their abilities without reservations. You are correct in saying that a priest is not a medical doctor. However; due to the Holy supernatural blessing brought to bear upon a priest’s human soul he does in fact under the Holy Spirit reflect the semblance of a Spiritual Doctor with Gods supernatural gifts of healing.

Then you need to find one who is in communion with the Church.

Find a Shrink who is in communion with the Catholic Church…and teaches psychotherapy from a Catholic Spiritual prospective. Good Luck !

 

[Jermosh]

Find a Shrink who is in communion with the Catholic Church…and teaches psychotherapy from a Catholic Spiritual prospective. Good Luck !

I had no problem with this, in fact my priest was the one who helped me find one, as is the obligation of all priests. I think in the end you do not really know what you want, until that point comes, I really see no further need for this conversation. I certainly dislike being insinuated as being insensitive with this manner in that is not my intent or others. Good luck with you journey and I pray that you find proper treatment.