**
Contarini:
I do not accept the divine inspiration of the Qur’an. That should be obvious from my posts and from my declared affiliation (unless you are one of those paranoid maniacs who thinks that anyone who is slighly fair to Islam is a Muslim in disguise). The dependence of Muhammad on prior ideas is certainly relevant in refuting the Muslim claim that the Qur’an is a miracle and can only have been produced by direct divine inspiration. But it is also relevant in refuting your claim that Islam is really just repackaged paganism.
No, I don’t think you’re a Muslim in disguise, but you do have a hard on for them. What happen some Persian girl dump you and all your books you read on Islam to impress her went to waste so you’re using it here as a quasi-Muslim apologetic? I kid and I apologize, but for a white guy (I’m assuming your white) in America, you have to realize how Christians under Islamic rule feel and we could care less what you say, we’ve experienced Muslim treatment first hand, and your books aren’t going to change any of that.
Here’s your dilemma: if you argue that Muhammad’s roots are primarily pagan, you strengthen the Islamic case, because most of us are going to be very impressed that a pagan could come up with something so close to Biblical religion. But if you argue that his ideas were largely “stolen” from Biblical religion and grafted onto pagan roots (which is clearly true, I think), you no longer have a case for Allah being a “different god.” In fact, you have no such case however you argue it. The evidence is squarely against you either way.
I argue the latter and how is it I or anyone else can no longer have a case for Allah being a different god? Lets put it this way, I am well trained and versed in Judaism and Christianity, I know that my culture believes in various pagan gods, chief among them is Tatu, we use Tatu as a generic term for the god, but he is the chief god among all gods. To convert my people to my beliefs and use them effectively to dominate a continent, I claim that Tatu’s angel came to me and gave me this book called the Klips and in the Klips I have taken verses and themes from the Bible and added my own parts about sleeping with 9 year old girls and killing or subjugating people who don’t believe and accept Tatu (your so called truths!). As I conquer many lands my language and terminology, especially Tatu being used as God, come to be the primary source of communication. And the hardest part to do all this was taking a chief pagan god and transforming him or it into a monotheistic god.
Thousands of years pass and with my made up religion millions are murdered and oppressed and a white man named Edwin fights tirelessly and with conviction defending my lies. Thank you, Edwin, the Prophet MoMo (peace be upon me thanks you), you shall have your 84 virgins! Praise be to Tatu.
On a side note, I am dying laughing at how ridiculously stupid my made up religion is, it’d be a real laugh riot if it wasn’t an actual religion.
And Edwin, if you are defending truths found in Islam, don’t forget that those truths come from Judaism and Christianity, the elements lifted from the Bible. I would like you to defend the other “truths” that are exclusive to Islam, you know the ones, that you see on the front cover of the New York Times and the main story on Al Jazzera.
I’m interested in refuting your blasphemous and heretical claims about Allah not being our God. I am of course on your side with regard to the issue of whether the Qur’an is divinely inspired as Muslims claim. But they are two separate issues.I have not at any point suggested that Islam was true. I do not believe Islam to be true over against Christianity and Judaism. (Obviously it contains elements of truth.)Your anti-Islamic polemic would be more credible if you would refrain from accusing anyone who disagrees with you of being a Muslim. I have no interested in defending the truth *of *Islam, but I have every interest in defending the truth *in *Islam and the truth *about *Islam.
Edwin
And it’s not blasphemy or heretical for claiming Allah is not my God. How is this for heresy, Christ is True God, Allah is a pagan god turned into a monotheistic god based on the Judeo-Christian tradition by the creative imagination of a camel jockey (at least I think that was his job, oh wait it was marrying older rich woman and taking their money and using it to build up and army to spread his peaceful religion). You get your carpet out Edwin and worship Allah, I’ll stick to worshiping Jesus Christ and proclaiming Him the only True God rather than kissing Islam’s ***, get your chap stick and pucker up. **
