Catholic husband decides he’s a woman

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But there is distress proportionate to destroying healthy reproductive organs?
 
I’m back - minus the banned idea I expressed.

But I think I can still say the following:

If these feelings are the result of hormonal imbalance, wouldn’t it make more sense to treat it with hormones rather than amputation of healthy organs?

If it’s truly a physical, hormonal condition why not give a physical test (like a blood test) rather than having a policy that anyone who claims to be a woman can go into female-only spaces?

The fact that males who “come out” as women remain sexually attracted to women suggests that this is a case of autogynephilia. Likewise the fact that their idea of what a woman is is a caricature of womanhood.

Finally, for your argument from hormone deficiency to work, you would have to account for all the different genders people can feel like. You seem to only be considering the male who wants to be female. But last I looked it up, there were over fifty different genders and there seem to be more each day.

Also, I would like to restate something I said before and feel strongy about: Having a mental disorder doesn’t make a person unintelligent. Saying a person is highly intelligent doesn’t prove that that person is not delusional about unrelated non-academic things. Look at Isaac Newton (scientist), John Nash (mathematician). Delusional doesn’t equal dumb.
 
SugarMagnolia said:
If it’s truly a physical, hormonal condition why not give a physical test (like a blood test) rather than having a policy that anyone who claims to be a woman can go into female-only spaces?
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Because the current research shows that the hormonal issue occurs with testosterone take-up by the brain at 17 weeks or so gestation, when the phenotypically female embryo, including brain, becomes phenotypically male in boys.

Because the brain does not properly respond to testosterone at that point, it continues it’s development with an essentially feminine structure. You can’t restructure the brain after that point, at least not with the current state of the science.

Transgendered individuals in fact largely, for the most part, have normal hormone levels. It is the ability to process them that is faulty. In transgendered individuals, it seems to be at the formation of the brain in utero. With AIS, the entire body’s ability to process testosterone is faulty, and these individuals develop as phenotypically female, or in less severe cases as boys with genitalia that is from mildly to severely deformed.

Challenge to the Church, and Catholics: study and understand the science first, before lobbing accusations of delusions, agendas or “gender ideology”. Once the science is understood, only then can we be in a position to study the morality of various treatments that help the patient, without stigmatizing them.

Caveat: I am speaking here of male-to-female individuals, as that is the situation most familiar with. I’ll leave it to others to discuss female-to-male transgenderism.
 
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Yes.

Life is an ultimate good, better even than reproductive organs. If a person feels like ending their life, then the reproductive organs could be sacrificed *since we currently know of no other way to relieve that distress.

We are able to help most suicidal people with psychology or medications.
 
OraLabora said:
Caveat: I am speaking here of male-to-female individuals, as that is the situation most familiar with. I’ll leave it to others to discuss female-to-male transgenderism.
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… and the other fifty or more genders. I understand that you are chiefly concerned with male-to-female since that is the one that personally affects you, but any scientific theory that purports to explain this as a physical condition will have to account for all genders. I’m no scientist, but I’m skeptical that there are enough different kinds of human hormones to account for 52 or more genders. In the meantime, I’m expected to change my clothes along side of males with fully functional phalli and a sexual interest in females.

You speak of the brain not responding to testosterone, which presumably means there are medical tests that can show a person has his condition, yet all a male has to do to enter female-only spaces is say the magic phrase “I’m a woman.” At that point, any woman who speaks up for her safety, modesty, or privacy is branded a transphobe, threatened with violence, and sued into penury.
 
That view goes against Catholic teaching. Sterilization is never permitted. Even when a woman would die from another pregnancy, she is still not permitted to be sterilized.
 
SugarMagnolia said:
That view goes against Catholic teaching. Sterilization is never permitted. Even when a woman would die from another pregnancy, she is still not permitted to be sterilized.
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The purpose of the sex change operation or hormone use is unrelated to reproduction. To do anything for the purpose of impeding the sexual act’s reproductive capacity is morally wrong, as you say.

However, the sex change operation does not have that end. To be sure, those of us with little contact with transgender people have a lot of trouble getting it, but there are those TG people for whom the series of procedures is very important, and the lack thereof leads to great depression and we have no other answer to give them.

To me, the more important question is what we do socially. Right now, we celebrate transgenderism and this is not the opposite of refraining for bullying or demeaning TG people. It is the opposite extreme, and I think that that along with developing philosophies and uprooting normal behavior is going way, way, way too far.
 
Actually the main issue is what God thinks about it. This is self evident in His creation of one man and one woman, complementary to each other in a nuptial communion of persons, a communion completed in the vertical dimension, with Christ.

None of this is possible in a relationship involving the “transitioned” individual.
 
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SugarMagnolia said:
I understand that you are chiefly concerned with male-to-female since that is the one that personally affects you,
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I am concerned with what has been medically documented, and for which the individual is receiving professional care according to WPATH standards of care. It does cover the spectrum but does not advocate surgery or hormones for every case. Please read the Standards, it would be beneficial to your understanding of the medical and psychological aspects of the conditions, and the means of adequately treating them.
 
Two of my replies have been reported, so there’s no way I can continue our spirited debate. Everything I say is offensive. 🙊
 
God determines what He thinks. And He has spoken through His prophets, through the Church Fathers, and most of all through His Son. There are two genders, and they are immutable. Period.

As far as the rest, I’m addressing the spurious comparisons made with married couples past childbearing age. Those comparisons were made. The end.
 
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CatholicELATeacher said:
God determines what He thinks. And He has spoken through His prophets, through the Church Fathers, and most of all through His Son.
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And the Church says that transgenderism is a type of ill condition. No further determination can be made about it until science understands the situation better.

In the meantime, if being TG with no physical change causes suicidalness, then ETA: physical changes can be initiated or carried out.

Your bellowing and concluding with period and the end isn’t going to change the fact that transgender people are genuinely suffering, altho we do not understand the condition or its genesis. The fact that we do not understand it does not mean they are acting.

My concern is that the way society in general is handling this will cause us to overlook a cure or preventative measure.
 
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CatholicELATeacher said:
I’m addressing the spurious comparisons made with married couples past childbearing age
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This has not been mentioned in this thread nor by you in your earlier replies, except for one brief mention to which I already replied.
 
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CatholicELATeacher said:
None of this is possible in a relationship involving the “transitioned” individual.
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Nor with any of the documented and proved genetic intersex condition. Oops. I guess God let some mistakes slip through… and Man and Woman He did not all create them.

You don’t suppose transgenderism is maybe just another anomaly on the same spectrum for which we have not yet fully discovered the cause?
 
Looks like that Mary Shelley knew what she was talking about in her “mad scientist” novel.

Tree of Knowledge, Tower of Babel …

" we CAN do it … so why DON’T we?" :roll_eyes:
 
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