Catholic priest Pennsylvania scandal

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I am unaware that Luther had anything to say about pedophilia in the Catholic church.

I am not a Catholic and I could not imagine attacking the Catholic church because of this. It causes me immense sadness, frankly. It does, however, make me wonder about the whole history of the Church. When did all this start? It must have been with the church from sometime in the Roman period. Similarly, what about Buddhist monasteries that had young men as recruits, what about schools and teachers?

This is not a Catholic problem, it is a human condition. The problem for the Catholic church is to show that it is above the human condition that allows this. In this, it has, to date, failed.

Are there any members of the hierarchy that are not complicit in this?

And…as an Episcopalian, I can name at least a few of our priests and bishops whose bad behavior rivals that alleged against Catholic priests. One case that I witnessed. So no suggestion that we are somehow superior.
 
It’s become much harder to gain access to potential victims. Predators don’t want to be caught. The roadblocks deter them. Not just background checks, but actually calling references. When I got my clearances, every single person I had listed on my application was called, and from them they got other references who were also called. That’s a good way to weed out creeps.
 
theCardinalbird said:
True, we cant judge by appearance. What is the age group of those who were assaulted? Also what if I wanted to speak to a member of the clergy alone because I need guidance? Are you saying that someone should be there?
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Not if you’re an adult.
 
It’s important to weed out the corruption at the top as well. if there are STILL Bishops who would harbor and protect abuser priests, they need to be outed and removed.

That’s not something we can do though (for the sake of Christian charity we can’t go around accepting every accusation as truth without considerable examination, which is not something we, as laity, can do).

The Church has ALWAYS been a bit slow. And it can be VERY frustrating in times like this.
 
I was making a generalization about priests, not the general population. The generalization is well founded when applied to priests of the last 50 years.
 
rondirect said:
Jack, since the early 2000s, the church is trying to do better.
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Have you read the report just released yesterday? Known sexual predators, who were moved from parish to parish, continued in this practice. The latest I read was in 2014! Others who are old enough were retired as a means to get them out of parishes, and have to this day, pensions, insurance and other expenses paid for by their diocese.

One priest was convicted, spent time in prison, and on his release keeps demanding the diocese pay him more, and if they would, he’d name other priest abusers. And they paid him more. He was explicitly directed by the courts to stay away from children, and the diocese finds, in his retirement, he’s volunteering at a parish! They told him to stop immediately, but never, not once, did the dioceses warn the parishes about any of these sexual assaulting priests.

I read only a fraction of the 1300 page report and it is horrific. My rage and sorrow have no expression. I was in tears.

At Mass for the Assumption today, all my prayer intentions were for the victims.

A Father on social media, asked seriously, why are you (the General you) still Catholic? As in 2007 when more and more reports and statistics were released, I always come back to John 6.

67Jesus then said to the Twelve, “Do you also want to leave?”68Simon Peter answered him, “Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.69We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God.” 70Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you twelve? Yet is not one of you a devil?”71He was referring to Judas, son of Simon the Iscariot; it was he who would betray him, one of the Twelve.
We have been betrayed, by monstrous men, and by men who put the welfare of criminals above victims.

I stay, because where else would I go?

To the OP, your best response is to offer no excuses. Callit what it is. Horrific.
 
ConstantLearner said:
Adults, sure, I already said that, but not children. We don’t let children make autonomous decisions.
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What if the adult sees it as ok for their son or daughter (say 17 years old) to see a priest for a private audience?
 
theCardinalbird said:
What if the adult sees it as ok for their son or daughter (say 17 years old) to see a priest for a private audience?
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Given what’s happened, if I were a priest - I’m a woman, so that would never be - I would have a policy of not seeing anyone under eighteen alone, and even then, I’d be very cautious. Innocent people are sometimes accused.
 
Yes, I have never seen a school district open the records of accused abusers from the past seventy years.
 
ConstantLearner said:
Given what’s happened, if I were a priest - I’m a woman, so that would never be - I would have a policy of not seeing anyone under eighteen alone, and even then, I’d be very cautious. Innocent people are sometimes accused.
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Ok that’s a fair policy
 
You said this:

> It is easier than saying “what goes around comes around” and everybody understands this as commonplace experience of life without having to be Buddhist yes?

What did you mean? That they caused innocent people will suffer, so now they will suffer? Many of these priests and bishops “got away with it.” Retired, with a pension, were protected by others, etc. Others can’t be prosecuted because the statute of limitations has run.

I’m just not a believer in karma myself.
 
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Elf01 said:
Why not seek out adults if that was true?
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It’s a matter of the dynamics of sexual perversity. These people surely have sought out many adults, and are looking for something different. There are a variety of different reasons they might turn to pubescents. One of these is that teenagers’ bodies are, frankly, sexualized and idealized in this culture. We can pretend that isn’t the case, but it is the case.
 
Here’s an article about the Vatican symposium on child sexual abuse held in 2003:

http://natcath.org/NCR_Online/archives2/2003b/041803/041803n.htm

It deals with the issue of homosexuality as a risk factor. It was controversial at the time. It’s worth a look.

Also, no one has mentioned this: the scandal at Regensburger Domspatzen – a choir school at Regensburg Cathedral. Boys only. An independent report found that 547 students had been abused (physically or sexually) between 1945 and 2015. Gee, I wonder who was the head of the choir? Georg Ratzinger. Yes, Joseph’s brother. He was the head of the choir between 1964-94, 30 years. He only admits slapping students once in a while… however, I personally find it hard to believe that over a 30 year period he didn’t hear or see things. If he didn’t know, he should have. And, since we know the two brothers got together all the time, I find it hard to believe Georg would tell his brother Joseph what was going on. And Joseph did precisely nothing. What did the students say? “Many of them called the time there as the worst of their lives which was marked by violence, fear and helplessness.” “Victims … described the institution as a prison, hell and a concentration camp." Here’s a link to the Reuter’s story, but of course there are many other stories: German abuse victims say Catholic choir school was like hell | Reuters

And of course no one has mentioned last September’s case: a Vatican (!) priest, part of the Vatican’s mission in Washington, was charged with violating child pornography laws. The Vatican recalled him, but did not relinquish his diplomatic immunity so he could be tried in the US, and would not release his name. Complicity?

And one of my favorites, although I can’t find a link, is a priest in Virginia who had pornography delivered to his rectory!!! Another priest living there thought this was a bit naughty, so he told the bishop. Guess which priest was suspended? Yes–the priest who informed the bishop about the pornography was suspended. Makes sense, right?

I am frankly appalled at some of the comments here. Would any reasonable person say something like “Well, Ted Bundy wasn’t the WORST serial killer in the last 50 years, we’ve had worse” or “The killings at Sandy Hook weren’t as bad as the killings at …” Come on. Stop trying to rank atrocities. An atrocity is an atrocity. And those who turned a blind eye, or worse, enabled it, are JUST AS GUILTY–maybe MORE guilty because their actions affected hundreds, or even thousands of victims.
 
ConstantLearner said:
Given what’s happened, if I were a priest - I’m a woman, so that would never be - I would have a policy of not seeing anyone under eighteen alone, and even then, I’d be very cautious. Innocent people are sometimes accused.
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Why would this policy change with an adult? Harassment is not something that merely happens to children.

Perhaps the problem – and a problem evident with McCarrick – is that the Church has intense and strict polices about relating to children, but insanely lax policies about sexual harassment of adults. I’m open to being corrected, but that is my observation.
 
My objections to people who are appalled at this is often they seem to blame the entire Church. I don’t believe this is an entire Church problem. I believe we have corruption, yes, but there are still good Bishops, good priests and good men within the Church. Things have been changing and will continue to change.

Yes, this doesn’t erase the atrocities, but we cannot lay this on the ‘Church’, only on those who acted in the wrong.
 
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