Catholic priest whose style split NC mountain parish is leaving

  • Thread starter Thread starter kurtmasur
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Gee, perhaps the parishioners enjoyed participating in the Mass singing the hymns they knew and enjoyed, verses sitting silently listening to a poorly run choir singing sloppy Gregorian Chant ?

Don’t judge the parishioners, it’s their parish, not the priest who is there to serve, not be served.

The story has a ring to it as my parish is going something, not as extreme, but people feel like they lost their parish and it now belongs to the priest.

Jim
Not speaking of you, in particular, but these types of posts often come across one sided to me. If it’s the priest who is traditional and the laity who is liberal (in a still orthodox sense), it’s the priest who is rigid. But if it’s the priest who is liberal and the parish traditional, it’s those rigid laypersons who are the issue.

That said, I see the reverse from the other side, where the traditional side is always the hero.

I agree that the pastor does need to meet the needs of his parish. At the same time, the pastor has the rightful authority to conduct the liturgy in the orthodox manner he sees fit, in accordance with his bishop’s direction. The parishioners should submit themselves to the pastor’s decisions in this area, and focus on lifting their hearts to God, but focus on all the details they’d do differently.
 
Not speaking of you, in particular, but these types of posts often come across one sided to me. If it’s the priest who is traditional and the laity who is liberal (in a still orthodox sense), it’s the priest who is rigid. But if it’s the priest who is liberal and the parish traditional, it’s those rigid laypersons who are the issue.

.
If the parishioners are traditional in the sense they want Latin and the priest celebrating ad orientem, that’s the way the priest with permission from his Bishop will celebrate Mass.

It has nothing to do with being liberal or conservative, but how that parish desires to celebrate the liturgy and the priest which the Bishop assigns to that parish.

Again, the priest is there to serve, not be served.

Jim
 
billy

He gets the final say within the approval of his Bishop. The Bishop generally supports that parish in such matters, as obvious by the OP.
This was implied. That’s why the bishop installed that pastor there
Well being the priest is leaving, the Bishop wasn’t standing up for his position as much as you would like.
It would appear the bishop granted the priest’s request, not the other way around in this case with the priest acquiescing to the bishop’s directive, as pointed out by the secular newspaper. The following are Fr. Riehl’s exact words. Nowhere does he say that he is submitting to his bishop’s directive to resign:
It is with a heavy heart that I must inform you that** I have decided, of my own free will and my own instigation**, to resign my position here at St. John’s. I have found that I am worn out or burned out and for my own well being need to take a sabbatical. There was no incident or event, just a feeling that I need some time away from full parish ministry. I have absolutely no questions or doubts about my vocation to the Priesthood of Christ.
The bishop’s spokesman confirmed that this resignation was not prompted by Bishop Jugis:
[Diocesan spokesman David] Hains was also asked whether Jugis had directed Riehl to resign. “What (Riehl) has in the statement is self-explanatory,” Hains said.
[Gregorian chant] is encouraged to be preserved in the Catholic Church, but NOT necessarily in parish life.
Blessed Paul VI desired that the lay faithful be able to know basic chanting, as shown in Brendan’s recent post. This would imply that most parishes should be familiar with their Latin patrimony.
It’s not if the parish isn’t equipped or able to handle Gregorian Chant without being isolated from participation in the Mass. Female altar servers would trump in this case.
How does implementing chant isolate one from participation from the Mass? That’s ridiculous. We actually participate by uniting our prayers to the priest’s as the Sacrifice is made on the altar. How does implementing chant isolate one from doing that? And why in the world would female altar servers “trump” learning basic chant?
It’s not part of their culture and there isn’t an expertise present to bring the parish into that culture.
It’s a part of every Latin Catholic’s culture; it’s our patrimony and that can never be ignored. Obviously there was someone with expertise present in this parish as it was being done and taught for the last 3 years; it just so happens some people were so resistant to it, it was one of the deciding factors in them leaving the parish, or apostatizing to a Protestant community.
Either way, it’s not your parish, nor mine. The decision is theirs and their Bishop’s, alone.
Right on.
 
Chant does have pride of place in the Church – that does not mean it needs be employed in parishes. What Sacrosanctum Concilium changed, from the way we used to do music, went far beyond chant. There is not a day that I do not thank God for the so very welcomed reform and renewal of the liturgy.
Yes, Father, we agree chant has pride of place. But the letter cited in post #74 shows how Bl. Pope Paul VI truly desired that Latin be preserved by as many people as possible. One way in doing that, would be to have the average parish learn the basic chant provided in Voluntati Obsequens. To quote from that letter again:
Our congregation has prepared a booklet entitled, “Jubilate Deo”, which contains a minimum selection of sacred chants. This was done in response to a desire which the Holy Father had frequently expressed, that all the faithful should know at least some Latin Gregorian chants, such as, for example, the “Gloria”, the “Credo”, the “Sanctus”, and the “Agnus Dei”.
The unity of faith, on the other hand, stands out in a marked manner through the use of Latin and Gregorian chant. This, as we all well know, has through the ages been the accompaniment for the liturgy of the Roman Rite;*** it has nurtured faith and devotion; it has achieved such perfection that the Church rightly regards it as a special heritage of incomparable excellence***; finally, it has been acknowledged by Vatican Council II as ‘the chant distinctive of the Roman liturgy’.
Pope Paul VI on several recent occasions has expressed the desire that Gregorian chant accompany the eucharistic celebrations of the people of God and lend its strong support to these celebrations with its pleasing music and also that the voice of the faithful be heard in both Gregorian and vernacular singing
I am, to this day, very thankful for Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI’s Summorum pontificum, as it renewed in me a deeper appreciation of the Mass, and first exposed me to the beauties of Gregorian chant, which was largely absent from my parishes growing up. It opened the door for my former pastor to have the Extraordinary Form said every Sunday, sandwiched in between two Spanish Masses and two English Masses in the Ordinary Form. That EF Mass certainly brought together two parts of the congregation that up until that time, sadly, had hardly ever interacted; and that was very beautiful to see. Unfortunately, I’ve since moved, but am happy to see my current pastor giving Gregorian chant pride of place during special seasons of the year in the OF of the Mass.

But it was in the EF, thanks to Pope Benedict’s action, that I was able to see the true beauty of chant in the Latin Rite. I had seen it often in the Byzantine Rite as I grew up, whenever I would attend Divine Liturgy on special occasions with my maternal grandmother’s side of the family… and as a child, I always wondered why we didn’t have anything comparable to their polyphonic chant in the Latin Rite. My childhood parish only sang out of the Breaking Bread hymnal. But the EF, where it seems Gregorian chant has not been pushed to the periphery as it has in many OF parishes in the United States, was where I came to know that the Latin Rite has a beautiful tradition all its own that perfectly mirrors that of the polyphonic tradition in the Byzantine Rite. I just wish I could’ve seen that as a child. That’s why I desire that Bl. Paul VI’s desire comes to fruition; so that my own young children can have the opportunity to learn and appreciate their Latin patrimony, whereas I did not in this case.
 
He serves the parish, not himself. He should not force his style onto the parish and must be opened to the needs and desires of the parishioners.
How about this.

If a priest conducts a Liturgy according to the liturgical guidelines published by his particular Church for the Rite or Form for which he is entitled to celebrate, including all the required elements as provided for by the same, and leveraging only those options which have been duly provided for; that the parishioners involved simply thank Father for a wonderful Mass\Divine Liturgy, and then continue on their merry way.

How does that sound?
 
How about this.

If a priest conducts a Liturgy according to the liturgical guidelines published by his particular Church for the Rite or Form for which he is entitled to celebrate, including all the required elements as provided for by the same, and leveraging only those options which have been duly provided for; that the parishioners involved simply thank Father for a wonderful Mass\Divine Liturgy, and then continue on their merry way.

How does that sound?
The priest serves the parish according to the instruction given by his Bishop.

If the Bishop assigns a priest to a particular parish to celebrate the TLM, fine, if that’s what that parish has requested.

However, according to the OP story such was not the case.

The priest was trying to change the style of worship to his own desires rather than that which the parish desired of which was in accord with Church teaching and according to the norms set by the Bishop.

If you believe that this particular parish was celebrating Mass improperly, please provide the evidence which shows this.

Jim
 
The priest serves the parish according to the instruction given by his Bishop.
I agree. I have seen nothing that indicated Mass was not being said according the instructions of the Church or the bishop, either prior to Fr Reihl’s arrival nor afterward.
However, according to the OP story such was not the case.
THe OP did not state that the priest was introducing the EF Mass.
The priest was trying to change the style of worship to his own desires rather than that which the parish desired of which was in accord with Church teaching and according to the norms set by the Bishop.
Was the style of worship being conducted NOT in accord with the norms of the Church or the particular law set forth by the bishop? I have seen no indication that it was not.
If you believe that this particular parish was celebrating Mass improperly, please provide the evidence which shows this.
I don’t believe that the parish was celebrating Mass improperly, either before or after the arrival of Fr Reihl. It is because that I do not feel that Mass was being said improperly that I feel that the faithful had no cause for complaint.
 
Ladies and Gentlemen :

I read this article a few days ago since Yahoo News circulated the article from The Charlotte Observer. Fr. Riehl sounds like a great priest. I did some research on him, and maybe he will be reassigned after his sabattical to a parish in his home diocese which is Knoxville.

The article says sabattical. This means Fr. Riehl has asked for a leave of absence. Fr. Riehl is not leaving the priesthood (there is confusion when sabattical is granted). I hope and pray that a year from now Fr. Riehl will be saying Mass and hearing confessions. It also sounds like Fr. Riehl is in the eyes of the chancery in "good standing ", since Bishop Jugis didn’t remove him - Fr. Riehl’s leave is voluntary.

I talked to a friend of mine who attends a TLM parish regularly in the Charlotte Diocese - it’s not far from Belmont Abbey. He told me that Western North Carolina (particularly near Asheville not far from where Fr. Riehl was assigned) has become a popular retirement community, and many northeasterners have moved there. Many are 65 or older, and are very liberal (i.e. CINOs from New Jersey, New York, and the New England States who loved Clinton and Obama…go figure). It sounds like a faction of these clowns gave Fr. Riehl such a hard time that even though Fr. Riehl stuck to his guns, and other parishioners welcomed him, he got really burned out by the actions of the liberal faction.

BTW, the National Catholic Reporter is often called the Distorter or the Fishwrap. The National Catholic Register is a much better paper.

I hope and pray Fr. Riehl is able to return soon. He is still a priest.
 
It is a little silly if the priest was wearing a barrera.

A cassock is fine but the biretta takes it too far.
 
I agree. I have seen nothing that indicated Mass was not being said according the instructions of the Church or the bishop, either prior to Fr Reihl’s arrival nor afterward.

THe OP did not state that the priest was introducing the EF Mass.

Was the style of worship being conducted NOT in accord with the norms of the Church or the particular law set forth by the bishop? I have seen no indication that it was not.

.
Part of it, according to the article;
According to the National Catholic Reporter article, Riehl threw out popular hymns and replaced them with the ancient Gregorian chant. When the music director was relieved of her duties, the article said, most of the choir resigned.
In other words, he threw out what the parishioners wanted and were able to participate in the Mass, and tried to replace the hymns with Gregorian Chant. Even the music director resigned, probably because she had no expertise in such music and decided to move on.

Yeah, Gregorian Chant is held in high regard in “The Catholic Church,” but it can not be forced onto parishioners as seems to be the case from the OP article.

As I stated before, Gregorian Chant done well is beautiful. Done poorly, it’s a train-wreck and the distance between beautiful to lousy is not far apart.

I have even heard Gregorian Chant done at the local Benedictine Monastery, and it’s done poorly. The nuns and monks struggle with the Latin and they’d be better off going to English translations of the hymns and parts of the Mass, which are available.

I often go to the Trappist monastery nearby and they’ve translated their hymns from Latin to English and it sounds beautiful.

Jim
 
I talked to a friend of mine who attends a TLM parish regularly in the Charlotte Diocese - it’s not far from Belmont Abbey. He told me that Western North Carolina (particularly near Asheville not far from where Fr. Riehl was assigned) has become a popular retirement community, and many northeasterners have moved there. Many are 65 or older, and are very liberal (i.e. CINOs from New Jersey, New York, and the New England States who loved Clinton and Obama…go figure). It sounds like a faction of these clowns gave Fr. Riehl such a hard time that even though Fr. Riehl stuck to his guns, and other parishioners welcomed him, he got really burned out by the actions of the liberal faction.
The mountains, especially Asheville, are suffering exactly as you say. Personally I don’t care much for Asheville. Nor do I care for the attitude so many transplants have. They often want to turn where they arrive into the same place they fled. This could include a place of moribund faith.
It is a little silly if the priest was wearing a barrera.

A cassock is fine but the biretta takes it too far.
There is nothing silly about a biretta. If there is then you could say all liturgical dress is silly.
 
Firstly everyone keep in mind the source, the “National Catholic Reporter” is a left leaning organization whose orthodoxy is very much in doubt.

Secondly sounds like that Priest should come to my parish. I would welcome him with open arms. I love how the article says the parish wanted to institute a Vatican 2 worship style and then rails against Gregorian chant which Vatican 2 indicates is the official music of the Church…

I pray for this parish and parish’s like this. What happened to Obedience to your priest? I would bet this parish will be a lifeless husk in 50 years while a parish that does embrace revenant liturgy will be growing exponentially for another hundred years or more.
Excellent point about the continuing authorization of Gregorian chant. It’s magnificent, but people don’t want to make the effort.
 
Part of it, according to the article;

In other words, he threw out what the parishioners wanted and were able to participate in the Mass, and tried to replace the hymns with Gregorian Chant. Even the music director resigned, probably because she had no expertise in such music and decided to move on.
Again, what part of this was contrary to liturgical law of the Church? If there was nothing contrary, why should any of the faithful complain?

If such an issue inspires harassment of a priest, let alone one duly appointed by their bishop, it would seem to be a variety of liturgical rigidity, and thus should be avoided.
 
Brendan
Again, what part of this was contrary to liturgical law of the Church?
Nothing, but then, what was contrary to liturgical law which he thought he had to throw out the hymns the people of the parish loved and were use to ?
If there was nothing contrary, why should any of the faithful complain?
Because it’s their parish and they desire to keep the Mass celebrated as they had been celebrating it.

Again, the priest doesn’t dictate to the parish which style of liturgy they must use, especially when what they were using was perfectly legal and approved by their Bishop.
If such an issue inspires harassment of a priest, let alone one duly appointed by their bishop, it would seem to be a variety of liturgical rigidity, and thus should be avoided.
They didn’t harass the priest, but after his rigid attitude toward the parishioners, they sent a petition to their Bishop to have him removed.

Again, the priest serves the people and gets to know them before dropping liturgical changes which they are unable to participate in.

Jim
 
Brendan

Nothing, but then, what was contrary to liturgical law which he thought he had to throw out the hymns the people of the parish loved and were use to ?
No and I never claimed that it was
Because it’s their parish and they desire to keep the Mass celebrated as they had been celebrating it.
Says who? The Church gives certain choices to the bishop, and the bishop enables his priests to use certain options.

If the priest is using options that were provided for by the Church and the bishop, then the faithful have no cause to complain.
Again, the priest doesn’t dictate to the parish which style of liturgy they must use, especially when what they were using was perfectly legal and approved by their Bishop.
I would say that you have that backwards, the faithful do not dictate what style of liturgy the priest may use, as long as what the priest is doing is legal and approved by the local Bishop
They didn’t harass the priest, but after his rigid attitude toward the parishioners, they sent a petition to their Bishop to have him removed.
And did the bishop remove him? Where did the bishop decry this supposed rigidity?
Again, the priest serves the people and gets to know them before dropping liturgical changes which they are unable to participate in.
How were they unable to participate? Could they not listen attentively to Word proclaimed and the homily? Could they not offer themselves and their intentions as members of the common priesthood along with the Sacrifice of the Altar being offered by the Ministerial Priest? Did the priest deny Holy Communion to any who were able to receive under the law of the Church?
 
Brendan;
Says who? The Church gives certain choices to the bishop, and the bishop enables his priests to use certain options.
The Bishop assigns a priest to a parish to serve the parish, not himself.

Throwing out all the music the people where using and replacing it with Gergorian Chant, which they had no expertise in, was the priest serving himself in his desire on what style of music he wanted.
If the priest is using options that were provided for by the Church and the bishop, then the faithful have no cause to complain.
Again, the priest has to serve the parish and allow them to participate fully in the Mass. Throwing out their hymns and going with Gregorian Chant, excluded them.

Heck, they signed a petition to have to priest removed and apparently they were heard.
I would say that you have that backwards, the faithful do not dictate what style of liturgy the priest may use, as long as what the priest is doing is legal and approved by the local Bishop
Actually the faithful do dictate the style of liturgy to be used, providing it’s a format approved by the Church and the Bishop.

Recall that if a group wanted to have the TLM celebrated, the Bishop and Pastor of that parish had to work to meet their request.
And did the bishop remove him? Where did the bishop decry this supposed rigidity?
We don’t have the full story, do we. But the fact remains, he only served 3 years and is now on sabbatical, after parishioners sent a petition to the Bishop.
How were they unable to participate? Could they not listen attentively to Word proclaimed and the homily? Could they not offer themselves and their intentions as members of the common priesthood along with the Sacrifice of the Altar being offered by the Ministerial Priest? Did the priest deny Holy Communion to any who were able to receive under the law of the Church?
This is the opposite of what the Constitution of the Sacred Liturgy from Vatican II called for, but you have your own agenda on this, so it isn’t worth continuing the debate.

Fact remains, the priest only served three years and the music director had resigned and the parishioners signed a petition to have him removed.

It’s up to their Bishop on how to handle it, which apparently was done.

Jim
 
Brendan;

The Bishop assigns a priest to a parish to serve the parish, not himself.
I have seen nothing to state that the priest was NOT serving the parish. In fact, it was specifically stated that he was saying Mass, which is itself a service.
Throwing out all the music the people where using and replacing it with Gergorian Chant, which they had no expertise in, was the priest serving himself in his desire on what style of music he wanted.
Teaching the Chant is, of itself a service. Once again, here is a document prepared by Pope St Paul VI that accompanied the selections of Chants that the Pope desired the faithful to know.
adoremus.org/2007/12/31/Voluntati-Obsequens/

I doubt that any of us here would question that Pope’s commitment to active participation in the Liturgy.

This paragraph is of particular note
In effect, when the faithful gather together for prayer they manifest at once the diversity of a people drawn "from every tribe, language and nation (Ap. 5:9) and its unity in faith and charity. Their diversity is manifested in the present multiplicity of liturgical languages and in the vernacular chants which, in the context of one shared faith, give expression to each people’s religious sentiment in music drawn from its culture and traditions. On the other hand, their unity finds particularly apt and even sensible expression through the use of Latin Gregorian chant.
The congregation clearly had a beauty of expression in the music of their culture and tradition, but the Pope desired more of the faithful, a common unity expressed in Latin Gregorian chant.

The priest was simply calling them to a sense of unity, not just with their particular parish community, but the Church as a whole. That is a mode of service.

Vatican II made that clear in Sacrosanctum Concillium
Nevertheless steps should be taken so that the faithful may also be able to say or to sing together in Latin those parts of the Ordinary of the Mass which pertain to them
.

That was echoed by Pope Benedict, in his exhortation on the Eucharist,* Sacramentum Caritatis
*
nor should we forget that the faithful can be taught to recite the more common prayers in Latin, and also to sing parts of the liturgy to Gregorian chant.
So it was clearly that they could be taught Latin chant, and that they should be taught.

Other forms may certainly be used in the liturgy, but if the priest found this parish to be deficient in their knowledge of Latin chant, it would certainly be an act of service to have them learn.
Again, the priest has to serve the parish and allow them to participate fully in the Mass. Throwing out their hymns and going with Gregorian Chant, excluded them.
The is of chant does not exclude full participation. If it did, the Church would not promote it or even use it at all.
Heck, they signed a petition to have to priest removed and apparently they were heard.
Heard how, the bishop did nothing. The priest, on his own initiative, took a sabbatical. All of the statements from the Bishop were supportive of the priest.
Actually the faithful do dictate the style of liturgy to be used, providing it’s a format approved by the Church and the Bishop.
Could you provide any documents of the Church that support your position?
Recall that if a group wanted to have the TLM celebrated, the Bishop and Pastor of that parish had to work to meet their request.
None of which was happening here. This was a Mass said in the Ordinary Form according to the legitimate options provided for by the Church and the bishop.
We don’t have the full story, do we. But the fact remains, he only served 3 years and is now on sabbatical, after parishioners sent a petition to the Bishop.
And, once again, it was the priest himself, of his own initiative, who requested the sabbatical.
This is the opposite of what the Constitution of the Sacred Liturgy from Vatican II called for, but you have your own agenda on this, so it isn’t worth continuing the debate.
I’ll quote it again for you
In Masses which are celebrated with the people, a suitable place may be allotted to their mother tongue. This is to apply in the first place to the readings and “the common prayer,” but also, as local conditions may warrant, to those parts which pertain to the people, according to the norm laid down in Art. 36 of this Constitution.
Nevertheless steps should be taken so that the faithful may also be able to say or to sing together in Latin those parts of the Ordinary of the Mass which pertain to them.
. If the readings and responses were in the vernacular and, which it seem they were, every indication is that the priest was obeying the directives of S.C.

In addition, his actions seem to be in accord with the wishes of Pope Paul VI himself
This was done in response to a desire which the Holy Father had frequently expressed, that all the faithful should know at least some Latin Gregorian chants, such as, for example, the “Gloria”, the “Credo”, the “Sanctus”, and the “Agnus Dei”
  • Voluntati Obsequens
 
Brendan;
I have seen nothing to state that the priest was NOT serving the parish. In fact, it was specifically stated that he was saying Mass, which is itself a service.
He was not open to their desires to retain the hymns they loved and trying to force his own taste on them.
Teaching the Chant is, of itself a service. Once again, here is a document prepared by Pope St Paul VI that accompanied the selections of Chants that the Pope desired the faithful to know.
adoremus.org/2007/12/31/Voluntati-Obsequens/
Yeah, a translation of a 1974 letter sent to the Bishops, from the Sacred Congregation for Divine Worship. Much has changed since them.

Here’s what CONSTITUTION ON THE SACRED LITURGY
SACROSANCTUM CONCILIUM Stated.
Wherefore, in the revision of the liturgy, the following general norms should be observed:
  1. The rites should be distinguished by a noble simplicity; they should be short, clear, and unencumbered by useless repetitions; they should be within the people’s powers of comprehension, and normally should not require much explanation. vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19631204_sacrosanctum-concilium_en.html
I doubt that any of us here would question that Pope’s commitment to active participation in the Liturgy.
Wasn’t the Pope, but the head of the head of the Sacred Congregation for Divine Worship
The congregation clearly had a beauty of expression in the music of their culture and tradition, but the Pope desired more of the faithful, a common unity expressed in Latin Gregorian chant.
Again, not from Vatican II Sacrosanctum Concilium.
The priest was simply calling them to a sense of unity, not just with their particular parish community, but the Church as a whole. That is a mode of service.
He wasn’t making it simple or unifying the parish, but causing division, otherwise they congregation would’ve grasped it, the music director wouldn’t have resigned.

.
That was echoed by Pope Benedict, in his exhortation on the Eucharist,* Sacramentum Caritatis
*
So it was clearly that they could be taught Latin chant, and that they should be taught.
Other forms may certainly be used in the liturgy, but if the priest found this parish to be deficient in their knowledge of Latin chant, it would certainly be an act of service to have them learn.
Not mandated on the Parish level but within the Catholic Church in general.

The Bishop’s still have the authority to set the norms for the parishes in their dioceses.
None that I know of, are mandating Gregorian Chant for all of their parishes.
The is of chant does not exclude full participation. If it did, the Church would not promote it or even use it at all.
Oh, but it does exclude participation when the people can not sing the hymns and say the parts of the Mass without merely mimicking the Latin words they manage to read off a card or in a missal.
Heard how, the bishop did nothing. The priest, on his own initiative, took a sabbatical. All of the statements from the Bishop were supportive of the priest.
He would not have taken a sabbatical without the Bishop’s permission. It was the way to leave the parish without losing face.
Could you provide any documents of the Church that support your position?
Once again;
  1. The rites should be distinguished by a noble simplicity; they should be short, clear, and unencumbered by useless repetitions; they should be within the people’s powers of comprehension, and normally should not require much explanation. vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19631204_sacrosanctum-concilium_en.html
Also, take not of this statement;
  1. To ensure that adaptations may be made with all the circumspection which they demand, the Apostolic See will grant power to this same territorial ecclesiastical authority to permit and to direct, as the case requires, the necessary preliminary experiments over a determined period of time among certain groups suited for the purpose. vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19631204_sacrosanctum-concilium_en.html
The Bishops themselves were amazed at how quickly the parishes in their dioceses converted their celebration of the Mass to the vernacular and as it happened, it became the norm where Latin became the extraordinary form.
None of which was happening here. This was a Mass said in the Ordinary Form according to the legitimate options provided for by the Church and the bishop.
Again, the priest serves the people of the parish and can not ignore their desires on the style of liturgy they want, when that liturgy is the norm set by the Bishop decades ago.
And, once again, it was the priest himself, of his own initiative, who requested the sabbatical.
And the Bishop granted it, which is an easy out for removing a priest.

Did this priest get replaced with another like him, who sought to continue with Gregorian Chant rather than the traditional hymns the people of the parish wanted ?

At this point, we’re both on opposite sides of the issue.

This isn’t our parish, so we’re not affected by it.

If a priest tried to do the same in my parish, there would be a major revolt as the parish wasn’t established until after Vatican II, and the people have little if any experience with Latin. They young people especially, do not know any Latin, unless they happened to take the extra initiative to learn some.

Jim
 
The priest has primacy in the parish and canon law allows him to effectively do what he wants as long as it’s within the legal limitations of the canons. The laity must follow the priest as long what he does is not against the faith but serves the tradition we have received .

This priest did nothing wrong and actually did the right thing. The only criticism is that he should have done it gradually.
 
The priest has primacy in the parish and canon law allows him to effectively do what he wants as long as it’s within the legal limitations of the canons. The laity must follow the priest as long what he does is not against the faith but serves the tradition we have received .

This priest did nothing wrong and actually did the right thing. The only criticism is that he should have done it gradually.
So if a group of parishioners request the extraordinary Mass, the TLM, the priest can refuse their request ?

Contradicts what Pope Benedict XVI stated in Apostolic Letter “Summorum Pontificum” issued Motu Proprio
Art. 5. § 1 In parishes, where there is a stable group of faithful who adhere to the earlier liturgical tradition, the pastor should willingly accept their requests to celebrate the Mass according to the rite of the Roman Missal published in 1962, and ensure that the welfare of these faithful harmonises with the ordinary pastoral care of the parish, under the guidance of the bishop in accordance with canon 392, avoiding discord and favouring the unity of the whole Church.
If the priest has primacy over the format and style of worship, how is it he loses it when a group requests the TLM ?

Jim
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top