Catholic priests in Poland burn Harry Potter and Twilight books

  • Thread starter Thread starter _Abyssinia
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I wouldnt call it Christian, I wouldnt call it anti christian. I’d call it an amazingly superior story written by a mediocre author, nothing more nothing less.
 
Then again those who hate Christians are going to find reasons, good or bad, to hate Christians. That can’t determine the way you live.
 
The Christian symbolism is pretty blatant, especially in the 7th book. Rowling has confirmed that was intentional.

The article I read in the local paper claims the “Catholic Church in Poland” opposes Harry Potter… I doubt the bishops have officially come out against it… anyone know? I have yet to come across any anti-Potter arguments that wouldn’t also rule out LOTR or Narnia, when you actually break the elements down. I don’t get it.
 
Rowling says a lot lately. So much so that it is a joke on the internet. She has tarnished her legacy. But that is all beside the point. I generally agree they are harmless but there is a nagging twinge in the back of my mind that has to give a little credibility to those who know more than I do about such supernatural things in the Church. However, to say they are Christian is ridiculous. And to compare them in any sort of way or post with overtly Christian and literary masterpieces is literary blaspheme in my opinion. If your point is that fantasy is not inherently evil, and those are two examples, I agree. IF however your point is that she is a Christian author in the like of CS or JRR, or that even the content is allegorical in nature to a Christian setting, then I’m afraid you couldn’t be more wrong.
 
I remember reading a few years that Fr. Gabrielle Amorth (the Vatican’s chief exorcist) condemned Harry Potter books because they open the door to witchcraft. I also read recently that then-Cardinal Ratzinger condemned them, as well.

Those are some pretty knowledgeable people who condemn it, which is good enough for me.
 
Cardinal Ratzinger did not condemn them.

Fr Amorth was an exorcist for the Diocese of Rome. There is no Vatican Chief Exorcist.
 
Last edited:
Christian allegories of the caliber of LOTR or Narnia? No of course not. Yet Christian symbolism is deliberately drawn upon, Scripture is quoted within the text more than once, and Harry lays down his life for his friends, rises from the dead, and defeats the Dark Lord.

The only argument against them is appeal to authority: “Father so and so condemned them”. I have never come across actual arguments against the content of the books themselves (plenty of strawmen points that don’t actually apply to the text…).
-They use real spells… false. It’s Latin gibberish.

-They show kids that ordinary kids can use magic… false. Wizards in the fictional world of HP are born special. It’s a major plot point that Aunt Petunia abuses Harry because she can’t do magic and is jealous.

-It draws on Wicca and the Occult. Rowling has explicitly denied this while explicitly acknowledging the Christian symbolism.

So I don’t know… some priests defend it, but there’s always an army of Catholics quick to quote Father So and So that condemns them. If all these exorcists really are so sure, I would sincerely appreciate an actual sound argument (from someone/ anyone) other than appeal to authority.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, I’m not condemning the books on a religious or moral level. Just a literary one… LOL
 
twf said:
-They use real spells… false. It’s Latin gibberish.
Click to expand...
My child, a Latin teacher for several years, was asked by 3 SF authors we knew, more or less, to translate a sentence into Latin for a book each was considering. This was done. Two of the books never appeared. The third, a fantasy, did appear. With the phrase in English. The author told us the publisher feared that some folks would think it was an actual spell.

Harry failed my interest test. Never looked past the 1st volume.
 
Hoosier-Daddy said:
I’d call it an amazingly superior story written by a mediocre author, nothing more nothing less.
Click to expand...
I definitely would not describe it as such. More like a fun children’s series that rips off every major influence from fantasy literature published previously. There really isn’t much that’s unique in her writing.
 
As a result of your post, I looked at several other sources, and admit I’m confused. Here’s one that calls him the “chief exorcist,” but “of Rome,” not the Vatican. https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/fr.-gabriel-amorth-r.i.p

I have seen others with various titles given him. So help me out here. What’s the difference between “chief exorcist of Rome” and “chief exorcist of the Vatican”?

As for Cardinal Ratzinger, in a letter to sociologist Gabriele Kuby, who wrote a book in German entitled "Harry Potter–good or evil?“ He writes, "Thank you very much for the instructive book. It is good that you enlighten people about Harry Potter, because those are subtle seductions, which act unnoticed and by this deeply distort Christianity in the soul, before it can grow properly.” (Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, March 7, 2003) StudioObrien: “Pope Benedict and Harry Potter”

So, notwithstanding Fr. Amorth’s correct title, I still stand by my statement.
 
Well, Chief Exorcist of the Vatican would imply he had some sort of universal authority as a member of the Roman Curia, rather than working for the local diocese of Rome.

I’ve read different takes on Cardinal Ratzinger’s comments. There’s no evidence that he actually read and judged the HP books himself. He was simply responding to another’s criticism and acknowledging that promoting Occultic elements could be a subtle danger for young people.

Regardless, perhaps you can reply to my earlier post (a few up) and provide an actual argument against the books other than appeal to authority? I would sincerely appreciate it, because I’ve never seen one that deals with the actual content of the books themselves.
 
I’m still a little confused regarding the title, because, for instance, the Pope is the “Vicar of Rome,” but of course is the head of the entire Church. I don’t have time to look it up right now, but I wonder how much authority Amorth had. It was my understanding that he had some authority over all the exorcists of the Church (worldwide). Maybe he was the head of some exorcist organization or something. I don’t mean to belabor the point, but it’s important to me, because if what I’m understanding about his authority is true, his statements are much more important and credible than the exorcist of Podunk, Texas.

Regarding my appeal to authority as opposed to actually reading the books myself, I think appeal to authority is more important, and the personal experience of reading the books myself is therefore unnecessary (and perhaps dangerous to my own soul, or the soul of any reader). First, for me as a Catholic, the comments of a Pope (although Ratzinger wasn’t Pope at the time, of course) and a “chief exorcist” hold a LOT of weight. True, I don’t have to believe what Ratzinger said, since he wasn’t speaking ex-cathedra, but the fact that he eventually became Pope speaks highly of his spirituality and theological thoughts. Second, Satan can enter and influence our lives in many ways, so, given the first point, I don’t want to or have to examine something myself to know that it’s wrong. For example, I was once addicted to pornography. Had I followed the teachings of Jesus and the Church, I never would have started in the first place, would not have become addicted, and not have my life and soul so terribly wounded as a result. Jesus and the Church were right; pornography would damage me. I didn’t have to “experience it myself” to find out.
 
Last edited:
You make some valid points, but I don’t believe either of them read the books. The criticism is based solely on the assumption that they awaken an interest in real witchcraft in children, not based on an analysis of the actual books. Where or if that has happened, of course it was dangerous for those individuals…but I still haven’t seen an argument that deals with the actual stories themselves and why they are intrinsically evil.

The Pope is not the Vicar of Rome. That is a position that usually goes to a Cardinal who runs the day to day affairs of the Diocese of Rome. The Pope is the Vicar of Christ and Bishop of Rome.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top