Chaput: No unity among US bishops on sanctions for abortion support

[gakroeger]

We are fast approaching another election cycle in the United States, and I dread the renewed rationalizations that will undoubtedly catch fire again regarding Catholics supporting political parties and candidates that support abortion and other immoral activities clearly identified by the Catholic Church as intrinsically evil.

In the last presidential election it was reported that 54% of Catholics voted for the most pro-abortion president we have ever had run for that office in spite of numerous documents issued by the Church explaining the duty of every Catholic to vote according to a WELL FORMED conscience and that abortion was the highest moral evil we were facing. In spite of this I heard numerous people who were voting for the pro-abortion president use rationalizations like;

1. The war in Iraq was more important than abortion in the United States.
2. Because the party that does not have a pro-abortion platform had been in the White House for 8 years and abortion is still legal so what difference does it make?
3. Poverty is a bigger problem than abortion.
4. Other social issues are more important than abortion.
5. Etc. etc. etc. etc. rationalization after rationalization

In the linked article below Archbishop Chaput speaks openly about the disunity among Catholic Bishops which he believes is the cause for the disunity among Catholics. Not on the evil of abortion, but on the actions the Bishops should be taking to address Catholic politicians who are leading other Catholics in the opposition to Catholic teaching.

Link to article

 

[TMC]

I think that the bishops are pretty much united on this issue - its just that the majority of them disagree with Archbishop Chaput.

 

[ANNE_2]

This was already posted by on CA by Catholic Press at 8:am this morning. And has posted responses. This was mine
.

" There is unity among the bishops about abortion always being wrong, and that you can’t be a Catholic and be in favor of abortion – the bishops all agree to that
– but there’s just an inability among the bishops together to speak clearly on this matter and even to say that if you’re Catholic and you’re pro-choice, you can’t receive holy Communion. " Archbishop Chaput said.

Abp’s statement in quotes above is absolutely true.

Mortal sins to pick from:
Supporting abortion,
Scandal,
Sacrilege (receiving Holy Communion while in state of Mortal sin),
heresy,
schism,
voting for pro-abortion politicians (when a pro-life candidate is available).

While there are a few good Bishops taking their primary responsibility seriously - teaching the Faith - where are the rest of them?

 

[TMC]

This was already posted by on CA by Catholic Press at 8:am this morning. And has posted responses. This was mine
.

" There is unity among the bishops about abortion always being wrong, and that you can’t be a Catholic and be in favor of abortion – the bishops all agree to that
– but there’s just an inability among the bishops together to speak clearly on this matter and even to say that if you’re Catholic and you’re pro-choice, you can’t receive holy Communion. " Archbishop Chaput said.

Abp’s statement in quotes above is absolutely true.

Mortal sins to pick from:
Supporting abortion,
Scandal,
Sacrilege (receiving Holy Communion while in state of Mortal sin),
heresy,
schism,
voting for pro-abortion politicians (when a pro-life candidate is available).

While there are a few good Bishops taking their primary responsibility seriously - teaching the Faith - where are the rest of them?

I disagree with your suggestion that most bishops are not taking their responsibilities seriously. What possible basis do you have for making such a serious accusation?

 

[markomalley]

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=552199

I’ll put my comments on the other thread.

 

[ANNE_2]

I disagree with your suggestion that most bishops are not taking their responsibilities seriously. What possible basis do you have for making such a serious accusation?

The same as Abp Chaput’s, and that some but not all Bishops are correcting pro-abortion supporters who cause SCANDAL - public support of abortion.
There should be a UNIFIED, voted upon Statement from the USCCB as well as same statement from all individual Diocese Bishops.

 

[Barbkw]

I disagree with your suggestion that most bishops are not taking their responsibilities seriously. What possible basis do you have for making such a serious accusation?

Catholic pro-abortion politicians who haven’t even been publicly warned concerning their disobedience.

 

[TMC]

The same as Abp Chaput’s, and that some but not all Bishops are correcting pro-abortion supporters who cause SCANDAL - public support of abortion.
There should be a UNIFIED, voted upon Statement from the USCCB as well as all individual Diocese Bishops.

In other words, none. The vast majority of bishops are in unity with the Pope on this issue. There are only a few bishops that choose to the Eucharist as a weapon against politicians they disagree with. That most bishops see their pastoral duties differently than Archbishop Chaput is no reason to defame them.

 

[JHow]

I think that the bishops are pretty much united on this issue - its just that the majority of them disagree with Archbishop Chaput.

Well, it doesn’t seem like unity if some bishops, like Chaput, disagree.

 

[TMC]

Well, it doesn’t seem like unity if some bishops, like Chaput, disagree.

If unity means 100%, I agree. But there are only a few bishops that share his view. Most bishops, most Cardinals and the Pope have all declined to use excommunication as a political tool.

 

[Barbkw]

There are only a few bishops that choose to the Eucharist as a weapon against politicians they disagree with.

The Eucharist isn’t a weapon.

These pro abortion Catholic politicians are using their “catholic” position to influence nominal and fallen away Catholics and other Christians toward sin for votes.

These men are leaders for our faith.

An appropriate way to deal with these pro abortion Catholics has been demonstrated in the way that Archbishop Naumann dealt with Kathleen Sebelius’ disobedience.

He didn’t excommunicate her, instead he told her to not present herself for Eucharist until she had made a public change of position on abortion.

 

[TMC]

The Eucharist isn’t a weapon.

These pro abortion Catholic politicians are using their “catholic” position to influence nominal and fallen away Catholics and other Christians toward sin for votes.

These men are leaders for our faith.

An appropriate way to deal with these pro abortion Catholics has been demonstrated in the way that Archbishop Naumann dealt with Kathleen Sebelius’ disobedience.

He didn’t excommunicate her, instead he told her to not present herself for Eucharist until she had made a public change of position on abortion.

That is your opinion, and apparently Archbishop Chaput’s opinion. It is not the way the majority of bishops see it. I don’t think it is appropriate to suggest (as some have) that they are shirking their duties or cowardly because they do not see that particular tactic as appropriate.

 

[Barbkw]

I don’t think it is appropriate to suggest (as some have) that they are shirking their duties or cowardly because they do not see that particular tactic as appropriate.

Tactic?

It’s an act of charity to privately counsel and if need be publicly inform these pro abotion Catholic politicians that they are heading for an eternity in hell.

 

[TMC]

Tactic?

It’s an act of charity to privately counsel and if need be publicly inform these pro abotion Catholic politicians that they are heading for an eternity in hell.

Would you find it to be an act of charity for your bishop to publicly proclaim your sins? The majority of bishops agree with you on private counseling, but not on the tactic of turning their pastoral duties into a public denunciation. That is a poltical tactic, not a pastoral action - or at least that is how most bishops see it.

 

[Barbkw]

That is a poltical tactic, not a pastoral action - or at least that is how most bishops see it.

What about that Catholic activism to change the ills of society?

What is that Catholic mandate called?

Social justice?

We’re not talking about money after all, we’re discussing the killing of human beings.

 

[JHow]

How would we know if a bishop hadn’t already gone to a politician in his diocese and counseled him / her to refrain from communion or re-think his / her position on abortion?

It’s not like anyone is really keeping tabs on Nancy Pelosi. Did she attend mass last Sunday? Did she receive communion? It’s not my turn to watch that Baba Yaga

I would guess that some Bishops in fact pursue a direct approach and don’t consider it our business to know one way or the other.

 

[estesbob]

Let’s make sure that we do not fall into the trap of believing that because not all bishops believe you should withholdCommunion from pro-abortion politicians means we can vote for them.

 

[Barbkw]

catholicculture.org/commentary/blog.cfm?id=236

Archbishop Naumann: No Communion for Governor Sebelius

By Dr. Jeff Mirus | May 12, 2008 4:02 PM

Archbishop Joseph Naumann has instructed Kansas Governor Kathleen Sebelius to refrain from receiving communion until she repents for her support of abortion. Though the order was given in August of last year, Archbishop Naumann made the matter public in a column in the diocesan newspaper on May 9th. The public disclosure was prompted by Sebelius’ veto of the Comprehensive Abortion Reform Act.

Archbishop Naumann said he had met several times with Governor Sebelius to convince her that her support of abortion was contrary to God’s law.

Sebelius, who claims to be a Catholic, had vetoed several other efforts by the Kansas legislature to more effectively regulate abortion, making the State something of a haven for late-term abortions. She has also accepted campaign contributions from George Tiller, described by the Archbishop as “perhaps the most notorious late-term abortionist in the nation”, and she has benefitted from Tiller’s political action committee.

As Archbishop Naumann put it: “The governor has spoken to me on more than one occasion about her obligation to uphold state and federal laws and court decisions. I have asked her to show a similar sense of obligation to honor divine law and the laws, teaching and legitimate authority within the Church.”

Archbishop Naumann stated that he had hoped through their discussions that the Governor would grow to understand her obligation to take the “necessary moral step” of “repudiating her past actions in support of legalized abortion” so that in the future she “would use her exceptional leadership abilities to develop public policies extending the maximum legal protection possible to the unborn children of Kansas.”

Unfortunately, when Archbishop Naumann arrived home after meeting with Benedict XVI in Washington on April 21st, he learned that Governor Sebelius had vetoed the Comprehensive Abortion Reform Act because, in Sebelius’ words, “ the people of Kansas have asked their elected officials to move beyond legislative debates on issues like abortion.”

Archbishop Naumann had this to say about the veto:

From her veto message, I received the impression the governor considered it a waste of the Legislature’s time to pass a statute that attempts to protect some women by making certain they have the opportunity to be well-informed:

1. about the development of their unborn child; and

1. about abortion alternatives available to them.

Evidently, the governor does not approve of legislators devoting energy to protecting children and women by making it possible to enforce existing Kansas laws regulating late-term abortion.

In consequence, Archbishop Naumann made it public that last August, after consulting with the other bishops of Kansas, he had written to Governor Sabelius “requesting that she refrain from presenting herself for reception of the Eucharist until she had acknowledged the error of her past positions, made a worthy sacramental confession and taken the necessary steps for amendment of her life.”

The Archbishop said this would have to “include a public repudiation of her previous efforts and actions in support of laws and policies sanctioning abortion.”

After recently learning that Sebelius had received Communion at one of the parishes in his diocese, he wrote to her again insisting that she “respect my previous request and not require from me any additional pastoral actions.”

Archbishop Naumann has asked the Catholics of Kansas to pray for Governor Sebelius, and I hope that they will also pray for their bishop. It is now necessary to enforce the matter on the parish level in the hope, as Archbishop Naumann has expressed it, that this will cause Governor Sabelius “to reconsider the serious spiritual and moral consequences of her past and present actions.”

 

[JHow]

Let’s make sure that we do not fall into the trap of believing that because not all bishops believe you should withholdCommunion from pro-abortion politicians means we can vote for them.

No worries there! I voted pro-life long before I was Catholic. Cardinal Mahony marching with Villaraigosa didn’t earn him a vote.

 

[ANNE_2]

TMC ,
Excommunication should never be used as a ‘political tool’. Excommunication is to be used as a correction regarding the Catholic Faith, and only when the person remains obstinate in the heresy, schism, or sin.

Where did you get your idea that this article or the Abp’s statement or my post on this thread was about 'excommunication ? ? ?
It is about not receving Holy Communion while in a State of Mortal Sin.
Go back and read the article.

Please provide a link to the Pope’s statement that even hints Catholics in the State of Mortal Sin should or can receive Holy Communion.
I really want to see where you are coming from on this thread - in misquoting our Pope.

I gave a list of Mortal Sins -
Mortal sins to pick from:
Supporting abortion,
Scandal,
Sacrilege (receiving Holy Communion while in state of Mortal sin),
heresy,
schism,
voting for pro-abortion politicians (when a pro-life candidate is available).

Do you disagree that these are mortal sins?

This is the quote from Abp Chaput in the article:
“There is unity among the bishops about abortion always being wrong, and that you can’t be a Catholic and be in favor of abortion – the bishops all agree to that – but there’s just an inability among the bishops together to speak clearly on this matter and even to say that if you’re Catholic and you’re pro-choice, you can’t receive holy Communion,” Archbishop Chaput said.

When was the last time you heard from your specific Bishop (there are a few exceptions)** not to receive Holy Communion if you are pro-abortion ?
**Remember your Parish Priests work for the Bishop, and if he asks them to put forth a message, they must do so.

Excommunication is to be used as a correction regarding the Catholic Faith.

In addition it would also stop SCANDAL which leads to the killing of additional babies.