Children of God and HPV Vaccine

[YinYangMom]

I simply cannot understand any reason not to vax. I’m just trying to but I can’t. (Other than because it’s still so new yet. That I can wrap my mind around.) But so many people are up in arms about it on the news because it’s normally “sexually transmitted”. Who cares?? I wouldn’t want my child to get the disease.period. Even if she supposidly knows the risk of sex. People slip up and I don’t want her to pay with her life.

Someone said that there are other diseases worse that are sexually transmitted. I say, if you’ve got a vax for HIV, bring it on! Herpes? That one too. Right now, the only one around is HPV. That’s the best protection we’ve got (besides abstinence, of course, which we all hope and pray is the path our children choose), the we should run with it, imo.

I gave both children all the required vaccinations.
I’m not anti-vaccine.
I’ve explained the numbers/odds rationale for being opposed to this particular vaccine.

The other vaccinations were for boys and girls and dealt with illnesses easily transmittable through air or sneezes/coughs.
STDs can be protected against with behavior modification by one individual. I can’t control whether or not other kids in class cover their mouths when they cough or wash their hands or use tissues or even stay home when they’re sick, even with chicken pox. But I can control when I allow a man to expose me to STDs.

Slip ups…that’s what I keep hearing…but look at the numbers.

If our children ‘slip up’ we’re looking at perhaps one or two partners before marriage. The odds that one of those two will have one or more of the 5 of at least 35 different types of HPV floating out there are slim.

If the child gets one of those five, science does not say she will definitely develop cervical cancer from it. Even if she did, because she knows she has that type of HPV in her system she will be more dilligent in her pap smears and can detect the development of CC early on and thus benefit from early treatment. Besides, she can still develop cervical cancer which is not related to HPV period. Heck breast cancer can strike as well.

With a vaccination you are 100% eintroducing an STD to a 9 year old girl she can, in all likelihood, avoid - even with an occasional ‘slip up’, and you don’t know what having that virus in her body for that long of a time will do to her other organs or how it increases her risk for other ailments (look at the side effects for the pill).

What are the chances a 9 year old will contract an STD? Let alone your 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 year old??? Sure, by the time they reach 15, one can start worrying…so if you really want to use the vaccine, use it then…or let the girl decide when she wants the shot contingent upon when she starts considering fooling around. That’s the time she needs to take into consideration **all **the risks of sexual activity - HIV, pregnancy, STDs and now, cervical cancer in the future. The vaccination is effective if used before the age of 25. Do not mandate it on 9-14 year olds. That’s my bigger gripe.

 

[Karin]

What are the chances a 9 year old will contract an STD? Let alone your 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 year old??? Sure, by the time they reach 15, one can start worrying…so if you really want to use the vaccine, use it then…or let the girl decide when she wants the shot contingent upon when she starts considering fooling around. That’s the time she needs to take into consideration **all **the risks of sexual activity - HIV, pregnancy, STDs and now, cervical cancer in the future. The vaccination is effective if used before the age of 25. Do not mandate it on 9-14 year olds. That’s my bigger gripe.

I think your living in a dream world if you think that a 9, 10,11 12,13 y/o cant get an STD…if they are having sex and many are…then they can get an STD

 

[Em_in_FL]

Do not mandate it on 9-14 year olds. That’s my bigger gripe.

But most states allow you to opt out of any vaccine for moral/religious reasons… if you don’t want it, you don’t HAVE to have it.
The “mandate” is the same as any other vaccine… and some choose to not vaccinate AT ALL…

I guess it’s not that big of a deal to me.

If it can help save some innocent lives (yes, innocent ones who have been raped or marry a man who carries the virus), then I don’t see a problem with prevention. The vaccine doesn’t force anyone into a promiscuous lifestyle.

 

[YinYangMom]

ahh so it is the advertising part that is throwing people into a tizzy!!! I mean if you go the CDC site that everyone likes to throw around as such a great authority they tell it like it is…
cdc.gov/std/hpv/STDFact-HPV-vaccine.htm#hpvvac2
and there should not be any confusion as to what it protects against, how it protects etc.

Interesting how it states it protects against 4 types of HPV instead of 5 that the other article stated.

“About 40 types of HPV can infect the genital areas of men and women. While most HPV types cause no symptoms and go away on their own, some types can cause cervical cancer in women.”

“Most of the time, HPV goes away on its own.”

So, there are 40 types of HPV out there, 4 of which are linked to cervical cancer…I still maintain the odds of my daughter contracting one of those 4 from an occasional ‘slip up’ are very, very slim. And, because she knows about the vaccine…if/when that slip up occurs - should it be under the age of 25, she can have the vaccination at that time.

“There is no treatment for HPV. But there are treatments for the health problems that HPV can cause, such as genital warts, cervical cell changes, and cancers of the cervix, vulva, vagina and anus.”

Which means, if my daughter does not have the vaccination, and she slips up, and she contracts HPV there are treatments she can avail herself of at that time for the manifestations of the virus in her body. It is not a death sentence. It is not a certainty that the HPV she has is one of the 4 which is linked to cervical cancer, and even if it is, there are ways to monitor her cervix over her lifetime to treat the cancer should it appear.

Keep in mind the CDC also promotes literature which state birth control pills as safe, effective, affordable and useful, too, despite the links between pill use and breast cancer.

 

[YinYangMom]

But most states allow you to opt out of any vaccine for moral/religious reasons… if you don’t want it, you don’t HAVE to have it.
The “mandate” is the same as any other vaccine… and some choose to not vaccinate AT ALL…

That doesn’t help with the public school system, and getting one of those religious outs isn’t as simple as it appears, as several parents here can verify.

I’m totally ok with keeping the vaccination optional, but there are organizations who are pressing for legislation to make it mandatory. I am opposed to that.

Each parent should be free to choose whether or not to use this vaccination on their child, especially since the virus it protects against is not transmittable by air or saliva. This is not the same as chicken pox, measles and the others. It is a virus which is transmittable through willfull behavior, not happenstance.

 

[YinYangMom]

I think your living in a dream world if you think that a 9, 10,11 12,13 y/o cant get an STD…if they are having sex and many are…then they can get an STD

I’m not discussing most 9-13 year olds.

I’m talking about the 9-13 year old children of the parents of this forum. The young women who are being raised to respect God, to respect their bodies, who may or may not ‘slip-up’ one day. The young women who are being home-schooled or attending private schools. The odds of them contracting on of the 4 of 40 types of HPV linked to cervical cancer are very slim, and if they should happen to get the virus and the cancer, both are manageable through medical treatment so it is not a death sentence.

Certainly children of parents who are too busy or too self-centered to care about what their teens are doing would benefit from this vaccination, but it’s my impression from reading and posting here over time, that the people here are very active in their children’s lives. I’m simply stating that they should not be so quick to jump on the vaccination bandwagon because they have more influence over their child’s development and thus the opportunity to mnimize the risk of their exposure to this particular virus.

I also maintain STDs are a natural consequence of the decision to engage in sexual relations. The child, young adult, adult who believes they are ready to make such a decision should have all the information about the risks of that behavior before making the decision. As responsible parents, I am assuming the children of people on this board are being well informed by their parents of the risks of promiscuous behavior. Once they decide to take that risk, the consequences are theirs and theirs alone. Science has come up with all sorts of solutions for these consequences…they can avail themselves of the treatments at that time.

 

[YinYangMom]

Does this vaccine contain thimerosal or mercury?
No. There is no thimerosal or mercury in the HPV vaccine. It is made up of proteins from the outer coat of the virus (HPV). There is no infectious material in this vaccine.
cdc.gov/std/hpv/STDFact-HPV-vaccine.htm#hpvvac2

Well that’s good news, I think.

Did you see this section?:

There are three reasons why women will still need regular cervical cancer screening. First, the vaccine will NOT protect against all types of HPV that cause cervical cancer, so vaccinated women will still be at risk for some cancers. Second, some women may not get all required doses of the vaccine (or they may not get them at the right times), so they may not get the vaccine’s full benefits. Third, women may not get the full benefit of the vaccine if they receive it after they’ve already acquired one of the four HPV types.

That last part’s interesting to me, since I’m an advocate for getting the vaccine when one needs it but not before…still, there is that “may not” which also means they ‘may’ still get full benefit. And even then, as my daughter stated, she’ll deal with the condition through medical treatments available at that time. Who knows what else will be developed in the cancer field or STD field by then?

I really do trust in God and in the relationship I’ve helped my children develop with Him. I guess I don’t understand why other good, active parents guided by the Church would consider their children at equal risk for risky behavior as the others all the media and health organizations are writing about. Our kids are different from those statistics. Maybe that’s where I’m living in a dream world - believing that good, faithful, active parenting can protect a child as well as, if not better, than what this vaccine has to offer?

 

[Karin]

I’m not discussing most 9-13 year olds.

I’m talking about the 9-13 year old children of the parents of this forum. The young women who are being raised to respect God, to respect their bodies, who may or may not ‘slip-up’ one day. The young women who are being home-schooled or attending private schools. The odds of them contracting on of the 4 of 40 types of HPV linked to cervical cancer are very slim, and if they should happen to get the virus and the cancer, both are manageable through medical treatment so it is not a death sentence.

Certainly children of parents who are too busy or too self-centered to care about what their teens are doing would benefit from this vaccination, but it’s my impression from reading and posting here over time, that the people here are very active in their children’s lives. I’m simply stating that they should not be so quick to jump on the vaccination bandwagon because they have more influence over their child’s development and thus the opportunity to mnimize the risk of their exposure to this particular virus.

I also maintain STDs are a natural consequence of the decision to engage in sexual relations. The child, young adult, adult who believes they are ready to make such a decision should have all the information about the risks of that behavior before making the decision. As responsible parents, I am assuming the children of people on this board are being well informed by their parents of the risks of promiscuous behavior. Once they decide to take that risk, the consequences are theirs and theirs alone. Science has come up with all sorts of solutions for these consequences…they can avail themselves of the treatments at that time.

yes.but let us not lump all sexual activity into a choice…some sexual activites are not made by the person but by the person forcing themselves on you.

 

[estesbob]

Please support this group. American Life League (ALL) states that they are taking on the task of trying to stop the HPV vaccine being made mandatory and apart of the regular vacination program. Apparently it will be done state by state in legislation.

Fr. Thomas Euteneuer of Human Life International named new Spiritual Director.

cogforlife.org/

Why would I or anyone for that matter, oppose a vaccine that will save lives???

 

[estesbob]

Fr. Thomas Euteneuer is a pro-life catholic priest who stands up there with the best priests of our time.

Excpet fr the fact he evidently believes in the death penalty for a young girl who commits the sin of pre-marital sex or engages in heavy petting with her boyfriend.

 

[YinYangMom]

yes.but let us not lump all sexual activity into a choice…some sexual activites are not made by the person but by the person forcing themselves on you.

I already addressed that…rape, date rape…yes, those are real risks, but even date rape is something manageable (don’t go to parties withough adults present and with alcohol present…don’t go to parties which start after 11pm and run into 3am…don’t accept drinks from anyone at any party or restaurant, always serve your own and if you walk away from your beverage order a new one when you return - yes, I’ve taught my teens that one)…

Rape is not a valid reason to vaccinate a 9 year old for STDs. It’s a scare tactic used to get parents to pay the money to the pharmaceutical companies. Period. The same tactic used to defend a woman’s right to an abortion - even late term. The same tactic used to promote the morning-after pill. If you don’t buy into those arguments, then why buy into it for this STD vaccine?

The victim of rape has many other more life-threatening issues to contend with before cervical cancer from the HPV she contracts from the perpetrator ever surfaces - if at all. HIV is one of those. Post traumatic stress for a lifetime is another.

My daughter views rape and all other violent crimes a cross to bear. Because she would be a victim, she associates it with Christ being the victim of unjust execution. Yes, it will be horrible. Yes, there will be consequences, some life threatening…but should she survive the attack, with God, her church, her family, therapy and medicines, she can carry that cross. She knows this, not because we’ve taught her that, but because she has read the stories of survivors of such crimes. As horrible as it is, it is not the end of the world and much good can come of it for God and the souls in purgatory.

 

[Karin]

I already addressed that…rape, date rape…yes, those are real risks, but even date rape is something manageable (don’t go to parties withough adults present and with alcohol present…don’t go to parties which start after 11pm and run into 3am…don’t accept drinks from anyone at any party or restaurant, always serve your own and if you walk away from your beverage order a new one when you return - yes, I’ve taught my teens that one)…

Rape is not a valid reason to vaccinate a 9 year old for STDs. It’s a scare tactic used to get parents to pay the money to the pharmaceutical companies. Period. The same tactic used to defend a woman’s right to an abortion - even late term. The same tactic used to promote the morning-after pill. If you don’t buy into those arguments, then why buy into it for this STD vaccine?

The victim of rape has many other more life-threatening issues to contend with before cervical cancer from the HPV she contracts from the perpetrator ever surfaces - if at all. HIV is one of those. Post traumatic stress for a lifetime is another.

My daughter views rape and all other violent crimes a cross to bear. Because she would be a victim, she associates it with Christ being the victim of unjust execution. Yes, it will be horrible. Yes, there will be consequences, some life threatening…but should she survive the attack, with God, her church, her family, therapy and medicines, she can carry that cross. She knows this, not because we’ve taught her that, but because she has read the stories of survivors of such crimes. As horrible as it is, it is not the end of the world and much good can come of it for God and the souls in purgatory.

Each their own…if I had daughters I would be getting them this vaccine…perhaps not at 9y/o but they would get it.
Being a victim of a violent crime is not what I want for any of my kids…but if I can give them something that might prevent further suffering I will …

 

[T1Catholic]

When are people going to stop thinking this vaccine has something to do with promoting sexual activity? I know way too many women who have contracted HPV and have had to get the pre-cancerous cells removed and then go for testing every three to six months for the rest of their lives. Some were sexually active as teens and others received HPV from husbands after marriage. To me, the arguement against the HPV vaccine is the same as the JW’s who refuse blood transfusions to save their lives. Argh!!! I find this so fustrating! PS: I have no issue withone someone who is opposed to the vaccine because they oppose vaccines in general. It’s the people who see this in the same light as contraception that drives me nuts.

 

[Karin]

When are people going to stop thinking this vaccine has something to do with promoting sexual activity? I know way too many women who have contracted HPV and have had to get the pre-cancerous cells removed and then go for testing every three to six months for the rest of their lives. Some were sexually active as teens and others received HPV from husbands after marriage. To me, the arguement against the HPV vaccine is the same as the JW’s who refuse blood transfusions to save their lives. Argh!!! I find this so fustrating! PS: I have no issue withone someone who is opposed to the vaccine because they oppose vaccines in general. It’s the people who see this in the same light as contraception that drives me nuts.

 

[YinYangMom]

Well the reason I took the time to post was to answer the question about why anyone should consider supporting an organization seeking to oppose legislation mandating the vaccination on children 9-18.

There are legitimate reasons for opposing the position of mandated vaccination. I have stated several, and none of them were stating the vaccine promotes promiscuity.

I have stated the marketing of the vaccination uses the same tactics as those used by the industry to promote birth control pills (which carry an increased risk of developing breast cancer, doesn’t reduce the risk like this one does with cervical cancer), condoms, and the right to abortion.

 

[estesbob]

Well the reason I took the time to post was to answer the question about why anyone should consider supporting an organization seeking to oppose legislation mandating the vaccination on children 9-18.

There are legitimate reasons for opposing the position of mandated vaccination. I have stated several, and none of them were stating the vaccine promotes promiscuity.

I have stated the marketing of the vaccination uses the same tactics as those used by the industry to promote birth control pills (which carry an increased risk of developing breast cancer, doesn’t reduce the risk like this one does with cervical cancer), condoms, and the right to abortion.

Sorry-I didnt catchthe “mandated part” I would not like to see this vaccine mandated.

 

[astegallrnc]

If the fiance has HPV and my daughter is under the age of 25 she can request the vaccine at that time if the strain of HPV the male has is one of those which lead to cervical cancer. If it isn’t one of those strains then my daughter would not benefit from the vaccine and she was wise to not introduce it into her body unnecessarily.

Just keep in mind there is no testing for high-risk strains of HPV in men. If a man has it, chances are that he doesn’t know it.

A this time, testing for HPV is limited to specific strains and only in women.

I guess I don’t understand why other good, active parents guided by the Church would consider their children at equal risk for risky behavior as the others all the media and health organizations are writing about. Our kids are different from those statistics.

I suppose my answer is that I consider the staggering statistics and am realisitc about the odds that my child will marry someone who is “different from those statistics”.

Where’s the vaccine for the men carrying HPV? Where’s the research in that area? If the women are contracting the virus from the men, which then puts her at risk for cervical cancer, why not go after the source of the virus so that men no longer put the women at risk?

Cost-effectiveness. Vaccinating boys/men is not out of the question. I’ve read this is being considered.

The vaccine protects against 2 of the strains of HPV linked to 70% of cervical cancers. It also protects against 2 of the strains that cause 90% of genital warts. I think the vaccine is promising but there is health education that should accompany use of the vaccine. With that said, I don’t support mandatory immunization.

Autumn

 

[YinYangMom]

Just keep in mind there is no testing for high-risk strains of HPV in men. If a man has it, chances are that he doesn’t know it.

A this time, testing for HPV is limited to specific strains and only in women.

Well, that’s a disappointment. You’d think the industry would put money into that diagnostic tool if their real motivation was to eliminate the spread of HPV…but HPV isn’t causing cancer in men…yet.

I suppose my answer is that I consider the staggering statistics and am realisitc about the odds that my child will marry someone who is “different from those statistics”.

That’s one of the things which prompted my having the conversation with my teens. There was a huge write up in the paper about the vaccine which cited those staggering statistics, and the three of us just looked a bit dazed at each other. We all recognized what those statistics meant for them in the future when God sends them their mate (if that is their calling).

The discussion which followed was quite uplifting for me, as a parent, because they both openly conceded they would trust in the Lord. I have a son and a daughter.

My son recognizes why it’s so crucial for him to remain chaste until marriage - to protect his bride to be some day, though he already was of the mindset it’s to protect the young women who would be pressuring him to have premarital sex from their own insecurities.

We didn’t know at the time it couldn’t be screened in men. In that case, then, I figure my daughter would still maintain the position that what’s meant to know in advance of marriage is meant to know, and what isn’t isn’t. She’ll still have the guy take a battery of blood tests though, that’s just common sense these days.

Cost-effectiveness. Vaccinating boys/men is not out of the question. I’ve read this is being considered.

The vaccine protects against 2 of the strains of HPV linked to 70% of cervical cancers. It also protects against 2 of the strains that cause 90% of genital warts. I think the vaccine is promising but there is health education that should accompany use of the vaccine. With that said, I don’t support mandatory immunization.

It appears we are on the same page.

 

[astegallrnc]

It appears we are on the same page.

Yes!

4 of which are linked to cervical cancer

The last stat I read was there are 13 associated with cervical cancer and that HPV is associated with 99.7% of cervical cancers. The vaccine protects against 2 of the 13 strains associated with cervical cancers (direct causation has not been demonstrated). The vaccine is being marketed as preventing cervical cancer but from a public health perspective it may accomplish much more ( ie., reducing ab paps, costs associated with ab paps, etc.). The other 2 strains the vaccine protects against are associated with 90% of genital warts, which affect an estimated 500,000-1 million people annually. Although genital warts are not life-threatening, maternal transmission is possible. According to the CDC:
Among HPV-6 and -11 associated conditions are genital warts and recurrent respiratory papillomatosis (RRP). The peak prevalence of genital warts appears to be at ages 20-29 years in both men and women; one study demonstrated the incidence rate at 157/100,000 persons. These warts recur in 30% of cases and cause multiple treatment visits. RRP is a condition in which warts grow in the respiratory tract, a rare but debilitating and recurrent disease that can require multiple surgeries. It is most common in juveniles and is most likely maternally transmitted. Estimated prevalence of juvenile-onset RRP is 1-4/ 100,000 children aged <18 years, and incidence is 0.1-2.1/100,000 children. A voluntary RRP registry indicates a median of 13 lifetime surgeries, with a range of 2-179 surgeries.

I realize each of us will view the significance of these stats differently but the information may benefit someone about the necessity of the vaccine.
Autumn

 

[gam197]

originally quoted by astegallrnc
I realize each of us will view the significance of these stats differently but the information may benefit someone about the necessity of the vaccine.

Confused, astegallrnc, do you have children? And no this should not be mandatory.

The vaccine protects against 2 of the 13 strains associated with cervical cancers (direct causation has not been demonstrated).

Two strains and 70%…how about the other 30%… For this every girl should be vacinated. No, not mandatory. These viruses mutate. It will cost a fortune.