Choosing mortal sin for my husband and marriage? What?!

[maryjk]

There’s a third option. That directive is meant for couples where one spouse is using a form of contraception that the other person has no control over. A pill or a surgical procedure can be administered without the participation **or even the knowledge of both parties. **A condom doesn’t fall under that situation as it is impossible for it to be used without the consent of both parties.

But this theory wouldn’t work once the spouse became aware of it. So it would then fall into the same situation as a spouse using a condom.

Once you know, you know.

(I don’t agree with you interpretation. Just showing why I think it doesn’t work.)

 

[Allegra]

But this theory wouldn’t work once the spouse became aware of it. So it would then fall into the same situation as a spouse using a condom.

Once you know, you know.

(I don’t agree with you interpretation. Just showing why I think it doesn’t work.)

I personally don’t see any situation where I would be willing to live with a man who expected me to hop in bed with him after her unilaterally decided to render me infertile in the first place. I can think of few actions that constitute a bigger betrayal of my trust, The only thing I can think of is if he had a permanant procedure done and then was extremely remoresful (and I mean EXTREMELY) afterward. Presuming the procedure could not be successfully undone, perhaps it would then be acceptable to resume relations? Maybe that is the sort of situation we are talking about. Common sense tells us that it takes two people to use a condom though.

 

[Allegra]

“That directive is meant for couples where one spouse is using a form of contraception that the other person has no control over. A pill or a surgical procedure can be administered without the participation or even the knowledge of both parties.”

Coitus interruptus also counts–that’s something that only one partner has control over.

Is there anyone out there who is dumb enough to believe that the withdrawl method is more effective than NFP?

 

[Xantippe]

“Is there anyone out there who is dumb enough to believe that the withdrawl method is more effective than NFP?”

Yep–the husbands of some women who post here.

 

[Allegra]

“Is there anyone out there who is dumb enough to believe that the withdrawl method is more effective than NFP?”

Yep–the husbands of some women who post here.

That’s the most impressive argument in favor of sex ed I’ve ever heard.

 

[Allegra]

“Is there anyone out there who is dumb enough to believe that the withdrawl method is more effective than NFP?”

Yep–the husbands of some women who post here.

And furthermore, doesn’t complete thick-headedness of that caliber disqualify a person from mortal sin anyway? I mean, the woman hopefully knows that she’s going to be pregnant in about five minutes using that method anyway, so she’s not in any sin. Meanwhile, the man with his stunted knowledge of basic human biology is quite possibly too ignorant of the situation to be truely culpable. The only problem is if the couple actually has a serious reason to avoid a pregnancy. In which case, they’re in big trouble!

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

Common sense tells us that it takes two people to use a condom though.

I find this discussion very interesting and relevant, but I just want to add that when one spouse suffers pressure to comply in using a condom to the extent that they simply can’t take it anymore or else they will crack up under that pressure, then that person’s responsibility and culpability is simply not the same.

 

[Brendan_64]

If you willingly and freely participate in an act that you know is enabling another person to commit a mortal sin, then you too are guilty of sin. The fact that the act involves sexual intercourse between a man and wife does not negate this.

If, on the other hand, a man had a vasectomy and did not tell his wife about it, or a woman took the pill and didn’t tell her husband about it, then the spouse would not be guilty of sin since they did not have knowledge of what their partner has done.

 

[Brendan_64]

I find this discussion very interesting and relevant, but I just want to add that when one spouse suffers pressure to comply in using a condom to the extent that they simply can’t take it anymore or else they will crack up under that pressure, then that person’s responsibility and culpability is simply not the same.

Culpability can indeed be lessened under these circumstances, but that still does not mean that cooperation is not a sinful act. It is still a sin to cooperate.

 

[Rau]

If a condom is used then both parties are actually using it. Just because it is on the husband’s body does not mean that is just him alone that is using it. Both parties would be using contraceptives in this case.

The (only) party using the condom is the one(s) who wished or intended its use. The other is agreeing to sex in the knowledge the other is contracepting. This other person may not be sinning depending on circumstances, but the former person always does.

If I know my wife is on the pill, I MAY be permitted to accept her request for sex (subject to the 3 conditions mentioned elsewhere in this thread). It would seem less likely that I could properly initiate it.

 

[Allegra]

I find this discussion very interesting and relevant, but I just want to add that when one spouse suffers pressure to comply in using a condom to the extent that they simply can’t take it anymore or else they will crack up under that pressure, then that person’s responsibility and culpability is simply not the same.

If one spouse is pressuring the other to engage in sexual acts they are uncomfortable with to they extend that they can’t take it anymore and are about to “crack”, they’ve got serious marital problems! I couldn’t imagine living that way, with someone with so little respect for me. I find the very idea appalling and it’s very sad that some people live with this cruelty.

 

[GenosFutureWife]

Don’t be so hard on yourself. The rules are meant for a perfect world, and we live in a world that is not perfect.
Once upon a time I knew a man who didn’t want more children, for serious reasons. He had a vasectomy, and, even though his wife grieved about the impossibility of a larger family after that for a little while, she also knew that it was what had to be done for the sake of her husband, marriage and the children who they already had.
It was a good choice for them, and kept an unstable relationship from getting any worse.
I do not feel that she sinned in the process, even though she knew… as it was his body, and his choice, as well as his inability to deal with more children.
I believe that God looks into a persons heart and sees that it is not that persons fault when his/her mate has serious issues.

Breastfeeding a child nurtures the child in such a special way that a bottle cannot. Breastfeeding is Gods preferred method of spacing babies at perfect intervals.