Christianity, is it sexist?

[blessedtoo]

That’s great… but why is it that Gods way of helping a woman is to always give her a husband? Can’t a woman be single and God prosper her? There are no examples of rich women in the Bible. You have the poor, godly, widow with the son who was starving. Granted God did send a prophet to feed her but most of the godly men in the Bible were rich because God blessed them.

You are trying read the Bible through a modernist lens. Not only was a woman expected to have a husband, but a man was expected to have a wife. It cuts both ways. How is that sexist? And you answered your own query with the story of the widowed mother whom God blessed with food. What’s the preoccuptation with the OT anyway? Have you not read the NT? Is it not clear that Jesus chose women for some of the most important roles in His ministry? He comissioned the apostles to care for widows in a way that had never been done before. He elevated the status of women beyond anything that was customary at the time. If you want to understand how a woman can be a Christian, I suggest you start by reading the NT and stop perseverating on the OT.

 

[dwc]

If you want to understand how a woman can be a Christian, I suggest you start by reading the NT and stop perseverating on the OT.

Amen.

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[Imagine23]

From the Douay-Rheims Version, "(Gal 3:26) For you are all the children of God, by faith in Christ Jesus.

(Gal 3:27) For as many of you as have been baptized in Christ have put on Christ.

(Gal 3:28) There is neither Jew nor Greek: there is neither bond nor free: there is neither male nor female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus.

(Gal 3:29) And if you be Christ’s, then are you the seed of Abraham, heirs according to the promise."

So, therefore, based on those verses, Christianity is not sexist.

What about the passage from Leviticus, something to the effect of “a woman should not speak aloud at church, if she has questions, she should wait to ask them of her husband when they get home.”

That sounds pretty damn sexist to me.

 

[dwc]

What about the passage from Leviticus, something to the effect of “a woman should not speak aloud at church, if she has questions, she should wait to ask them of her husband when they get home.”

That sounds pretty damn sexist to me.

Leviticus is OT. The post you quote from is Galatians, which is NT. As prior posts have pointed out, if you want to know whether Christianity (the faith) is sexist, you should read about Christ and his position on women --ie, the NT.

 

[lak611]

Leviticus is OT. The post you quote from is Galatians, which is NT. As prior posts have pointed out, if you want to know whether Christianity (the faith) is sexist, you should read about Christ and his position on women --ie, the NT.

Actually, it is not from Galatians. It is from 1 Corinthians. 1Co 14:34 " Let women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted them to speak but to be subject, as also the law saith.
1Co 14:35 But if they would learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is a shame for a woman to speak in the church.(Douay-Rheims Version)" This is not about women being inferior to men. It means that women are not allowed to be priests.

 

[Hellisreal]

The Bible was written in back in the day when women were kept in the background…they were mere property. If you read the New Testament very carefully, you will notice how many women Jesus ministered to and welcomed. How he treated women, his mother, Mary Magdelene, his cousins…who were the first to see that Jesus had risen…“WOMEN”. At the wedding feast of Cana…didn’t someone come to Mary and ask her advice about the wine running out? Why didn’t they ask a man? She referred the person to Jesus.

Mary is my role model. She was a tough cookie. She went through things in her life that I could never measure up to. That is why she was chosen. I can’t imagine myself pregnant at 15 or 17, leaving my mother and dad, traveling on a donkey in the desert, in the middle of the night, with a perfect stranger, knowing that people were after me trying to kill me, for whatever reason. Then to get to the town, in labor, only to find there wasn’t a place to be had, and to end up in a stable giving birth. That woman had guts. And 30 years later to stand at the foot of the cross and watch her boy die.

The Bible, sexist? Not from what I have read. The women of the Bible were very gutsy. Especially Mary.

There is a problem with your assertation that women were mere property “back in the day when the bible was written”. If you are to consider the Old Testament as you say, when the bible was “written” you have missed much of it, and the respect for women in it.

The biggest problem with your ideas are that you seem to think *someone *came to Mary to tell her there was a problem with wine shortages at the wedding. I don’t see any support for your claim there.

She did not refer** any person **to Jesus. Again, can you support this claim?

As for the rest of your ideas about Our Lady, I don’t want to address them.

God bless you.

 

[lak611]

She did not refer** any person **to Jesus. Again, can you support this claim?

She referred the waiters to Jesus. From the Douay-Rheims Version: “Joh 2:1 And the third day, there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee: and the mother of Jesus was there.
Joh 2:2 And Jesus also was invited, and his disciples, to the marriage.
Joh 2:3 And the wine failing, the mother of Jesus saith to him: They have no wine.
Joh 2:4 And Jesus saith to her: Woman, what is that to me and to thee? My hour is not yet come.
Joh 2:5 His mother saith to the waiters: Whatsoever he shall say to you, do ye.”

 

[mlchance]

Let’s sum up a hunk of the “proof” that Christianity is sexist:
Nancie Lew:

Why aren’t there stories that relate to women? How about a story about a woman who is abused by her husband or a young girl who is sexually abused by her father and where God intervenes to help them.

Why doesn’t God speak to women like he does to men like Abraham, Moses ,etc? Even with the Virgin Mary God didn’t directly speak to her… he sent an angel. Are we not good enough to speak to?

All of the women heroines in the Bible are beautiful. Does God ever choose ugly women?

…but why is it that Gods way of helping a woman is to always give her a husband? Can’t a woman be single and God prosper her?

There are no examples of rich women in the Bible.

Aside from already eloquent rebuttals offered above, there is this: Have you ever noticed how those who attack Christianity are invariably *sola scriptura *fundamentalists?

Also, I cannot help but wonder: When did we go from “I am woman. Hear me roar.” to “I am woman. Let me criticize the Bible for not being written the way I would’ve written it.”

Christianity is not sexist. Individual Christians might be, but they do so contrary to Church doctrine and Scripture.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[deb1]

What about the passage from Leviticus, something to the effect of “a woman should not speak aloud at church, if she has questions, she should wait to ask them of her husband when they get home.”

That sounds pretty damn sexist to me.

It is from the New Testament. Let me ask you this. Do you think that people in general should interupt a service by speaking?

In some of the cultures that Paul ministered to, there were women who had very little social contact. Once they were married they were expected to sit at home and only leave when their husbands allowed them. When these women did go somewhere, they wanted to socialize and talk. In other words they had no knowledge of how to act during a more formal meeting.

Paul, is saying, let the women come to church-something some of the husbands probably were not doing-but teach them to hold off asking questions until after the service.

I’ve never understood why this is a controversial verse. If I was in a church service I would be annoyed if people were talking around me.

Because he was from an Jewish background, Paul could have said, let the women and men be seperated during service. That is what Orthodox Jews do today. The fact, considering his background, that he was all right with the genders being intermingled is pretty amazing to me.

 

[Nancie_Lew]

In Genesis God gave both the man and the woman dominion over the Earth. How does dominion apply to a man as opposed to a woman? Are there differences? It seems like there is. Did the woman lose her dominion after the fall?

 

[Nancie_Lew]

Aside from already eloquent rebuttals offered above, there is this: Have you ever noticed how those who attack Christianity are invariably *sola scriptura *fundamentalists?

I’m not a Christian so what does sola scriptura have to do with this thread?

It seems to me that Augustine didn’t believe that women had souls. Where did he get that belief? I don’t think it says in the Bible that women don’t have souls so he must have gotten it from Catholic tradition.

 

[mercygate]

That’s great… but why is it that Gods way of helping a woman is to always give her a husband? Can’t a woman be single and God prosper her? There are no examples of rich women in the Bible. You have the poor, godly, widow with the son who was starving. Granted God did send a prophet to feed her but most of the godly men in the Bible were rich because God blessed them.

Do you think that perhaps men and women are meant for one another for mutual support and for the protection of children: male AND female he created them? And when male and female get together, they procreate. Societies (whether biblical or not) depend on strong relations between the sexes: family ties and mutual responsibilities.

Of course there are rich women and single women. Just read about the valiant woman of Proverbs: she’s married but has her own money, invests in real estate . . .

Have you actually read the Bible for yourself? You sound like someone who has been exposed to feminist theology: where the set up is to expose all the problems women have as the result of patriarchy.

 

[mercygate]

I’m not a Christian so what does sola scriptura have to do with this thread?

It seems to me that Augustine didn’t believe that women had souls. Where did he get that belief? I don’t think it says in the Bible that women don’t have souls so he must have gotten it from Catholic tradition.

If you’re going to make a statement like that about Augustine, you had better back it up with a citation.

On her deathbed, his mother asked him to remember her in his Masses. Hmm. I suppose if Augustine’s mother had a soul, others did as well.

You gotta start fact-checking.

 

[deb1]

I’m not a Christian so what does sola scriptura have to do with this thread?

It seems to me that Augustine didn’t believe that women had souls. Where did he get that belief? I don’t think it says in the Bible that women don’t have souls so he must have gotten it from Catholic tradition.

I have heard this about Augustine as well but I have no idea if it is true or just a very nasty urbane legend. Even if he personally believe this it does not follow that he developed this from Catholic tradition.

 

[mercygate]

God sent a prophet to David concerning the murder of Uriah . What did the prophet say to David? Only that David had many sheep and Uriah few. David wasn’t really condemned by God for his adultery it was because he stole another mans property. The issue here is property. Women are chattel otherwise God would have told David he was sinning by having more than one wife. Also… Bathsheba was probably forced into adultery and marriage.

I have often thought it odd that Bathsheba, living across the street from David’s palace, where she knew he walked in view of her own house, should be taking a bath without being aware that he was there: "Oh *my!!! *DAVID is up there LOOKING at me! What a surprise! I didn’t know anybody could see!!!

Not to “blame the victim” – just noting the obvious. This is David: handsome, successful, charming David with a keen eye for women. C’mon. Talk about sending signals! IT doesn’t justify David of course.

By the way: God forgives David because of his penitence, expressed in Psalm 51, but he punishes both David and Bathsheba: the child of their liaison dies.

Sexist? By OT standards, it was the norm. Would this be the standard by which Christianity operates. Not hardly by a longshot.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

I’m not a Christian so what does sola scriptura have to do with this thread?

It seems to me that Augustine didn’t believe that women had souls. Where did he get that belief? I don’t think it says in the Bible that women don’t have souls so he must have gotten it from Catholic tradition.

Somewhere in the bazillions links in my Bookmarks are rebuttals regarding the misquotes by Augistine and others. The quotes attributed are out of context, ignoring something written just before or after. I will try to hunt them down.

And the sola scriptura thing? Typically it’s Fundamentalists that accuse Catholics of erroneous teaching because of their foundation in sola scripture.

 

[Nancie_Lew]

I have often thought it odd that Bathsheba, living across the street from David’s palace, where she knew he walked in view of her own house, should be taking a bath without being aware that he was there: "Oh *my!!! *DAVID is up there LOOKING at me! What a surprise! I didn’t know anybody could see!!!

Not to “blame the victim” – just noting the obvious. This is David: handsome, successful, charming David with a keen eye for women. C’mon. Talk about sending signals! IT doesn’t justify David of course.

By the way: God forgives David because of his penitence, expressed in Psalm 51, but he punishes both David and Bathsheba: the child of their liaison dies.

Sexist? By OT standards, it was the norm. Would this be the standard by which Christianity operates. Not hardly by a longshot.

Great…but how many wives ( not to mention concubines) did David have and yet he still wasn’t satisfied? Christians try to justify polygamy in the Bible but what about men who had concubines? Concubines are used merely for sex, sometimes reproduction, yet God doesn’t condemn that. God condemns every other sin in the Bible yet he allows men to get away with this.

The main reason David got into trouble with Bathsheba was because he was supposed to have been at war with his soldiers.

 

[Nancie_Lew]

All of the women heroines in the Bible are beautiful. Does God ever choose ugly women? Women in society are constantly told they have no value unless they are good looking. When I read the Bible its all about Esther, Sarah, Bathsheba etc and how gorgeous they are. Than theres poor Leah and how she was rejected by Jacob. Rebecca was the beautiful one. Why not choose Leah?

How about a story about a king that falls in love with an ugly woman because of her beautiful character. The Bibles always stressing character in women.

I made a mistake it was Rachael…not Rebecca. Rebecca was married to Isaac.

By the way, one of my favorite names is Rebecca.

 

[Nancie_Lew]

Do you think that perhaps men and women are meant for one another for mutual support and for the protection of children: male AND female he created them? And when male and female get together, they procreate. Societies (whether biblical or not) depend on strong relations between the sexes: family ties and mutual responsibilities.

Of course there are rich women and single women. Just read about the valiant woman of Proverbs: she’s married but has her own money, invests in real estate . . .

Have you actually read the Bible for yourself? You sound like someone who has been exposed to feminist theology: where the set up is to expose all the problems women have as the result of patriarchy.

There’s nothing wrong with feminist theology. I have read the Bible for myself that is why I don’t care for Christianity. Christians are always forcing their morality on other people particularly women and gays. That’s why I am a feminist. I believe in equality for all people.

 

[Nancie_Lew]

Somewhere in the bazillions links in my Bookmarks are rebuttals regarding the misquotes by Augistine and others. The quotes attributed are out of context, ignoring something written just before or after. I will try to hunt them down.

And the sola scriptura thing? Typically it’s Fundamentalists that accuse Catholics of erroneous teaching because of their foundation in sola scripture.

I don’t think Martin Luther believed women had souls either.