Church fights same-sex 'marriage' in Spain

[mlchance]

Mac6yver:

Fair enough.

Okay. Let’s look at the three links in post 148.

The first: “Genetic factors, along with cultural and early experiences, influence male homosexuality, Italian scientists said on Wednesday.”

Interesting. Note what the article doesn’t say: It doesn’t homosexuality’s cause is genetic. In fact, the researchers interviewed in the article are very tentative about their findings. Lots of qualifiers such “may influence,” et cetera. And then there’s the admission at the end of the piece that “cultural and individual experience also play a part.”

The second article is about genetic manipulation of fruit flies. Forgive those of us who think that going from genetic manipulation of fruit flies to a definitive genetic cause of same-sex attraction in human beings is a bit of a stretch.

The third link didn’t work.

Now, how about some counterpoint:

Evidence for early childhood development issues impacting sexual orientation: “Childhood Parental Relationships and the Establishment of Gender Roles of Homosexuals,” Journal of Consulting and Clinical Psychiatry (April 1969).

“Human Sexual Orientation: The Biologic Theories Reappraised,” Archives of General Psychiatry (March 1993).

Regarding parental influence:

“Homosexuality and Family Dynamics,” Bulletin of the Menninger Clinic (September 1963). This one deals specifically with male homosexuality. This strand of research was consistently verified by the work of Irving Bieber and Ray B. Evans.

Bieber’s work was confirmed as late as 1974 in a study conducted before the APA decided to remove homosexuality from its list of disorders. See “Parental Background of Male Homosexuals and Heterosexuals,” Archives of Sexual Behavior 3 (1974).

The link between child abuse of homosexuality:

“Sexual Contacts: Experiences, Thoughts, and Fantasies of Adult Male Survivors of Child Sexual Abuse,” Journal of Sex and Marital Therapy (Winter 1997).

Additional works could be provided.

So, basically, what I said was true is. There is a vast body of evidence that homosexuality’s principles causes are psychological and social. There is a tiny body of inconclusive evidence that states that genetic factors may figure into the social and psychological picture somehow. There is zero evidence that homosexuality’s cause (at least in human beings) is entirely genetic.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[katherine2]

Brad:

Not a blank check. But it does give one a right to promote laws that would create a more peaceful and prosperous nation and promote the general welfare or children.

no disagreement. such seems to be in the field of prudential judgements.

 

[katherine2]

fix:

The Ten Commandments are an expression of what the Church calls the Natural Law. Here God commands that one should not murder, steal, lie, commit adultery etc. …What human law cannot do is to make legal those actions which are against the natural law.

Natural Law and the Commandments tell one that 'thou shall not lie." Yet, it is legal to tell your wife that you were working late when you wer down a Hooters having beers and trying to get the waitress to sit on your lap. Now, I am quite certain such behavior is sinful (considering your views of women, I have no idea where you stand on this). It is also legal behavior. So, no, it is not true that what human law cannot do is to make legal those actions which are against the natural law. We have issues of the civil order.

…If laws should be passed in the future which make consider the union of man with a man or a woman with a woman to be a marriage, we would have another example of human law going against natural law.

Just as laws permitting divorce and remarriage are against natural law.

 

[Mac6yver]

renee1258:

Actually yes, including myself in the past. I’ve smarten up, and since then been enjoying my sex life a lot more. Think about it. Not a mental illness, just dumb, and disrespectful to one’s self esteem to be used in such a way.

I disagree. How is it disrespectful? Especially when both parties participate. My wife would probably disagree with you as well.

 

[fix]

katherine2:

Natural Law and the Commandments tell one that 'thou shall not lie." Yet, it is legal to tell your wife that you were working late when you wer down a Hooters having beers and trying to get the waitress to sit on your lap. Now, I am quite certain such behavior is sinful (considering your views of women, I have no idea where you stand on this). It is also legal behavior. So, no, it is not true that what human law cannot do is to make legal those actions which are against the natural

That some humans ignore the natural law and make illegitimate laws does not mean they should do that.

All lying does not have to be illegal to be wrong. Many types of lies are both wrong and illegal, but not every action has to be criminalized. Not every vice has to be illegal.

My views on women are equal to the Church’s views. I do not attend hooters.

 

[Trelow]

Mac6yver:

I disagree. How is it disrespectful? Especially when both parties participate. My wife would probably disagree with you as well.

See: CCC Section Two, Chapter Two, Article 6

As long as you end up open to life, and use the act to further the intimate unity, not as a means to selfishly derive pleasure, then it’s ok.

 

[Mac6yver]

Trelow:

See: CCC Section Two, Chapter Two, Article 6

As long as you end up open to life, and use the act to further the intimate unity, not as a means to selfishly derive pleasure, then it’s ok.

Well, we are not Catholic. I am familiar with the Catholic Churchs’ teaching though.

 

[katherine2]

All lying does not have to be illegal to be wrong. Many types of lies are both wrong and illegal, but not every action has to be criminalized. Not every vice has to be illegal.

Well, it took us a while to get here, (127 posts) but finally you’ve seen the light. God bless you.

My views on women are equal to the Church’s views. I do not attend hooters.

I’m pleased to hear that.

 

[fix]

katherine2:

Well, it took us a while to get here, (127 posts) but finally you’ve seen the light. God bless you.

Those words must be properly understood. That in no way means homosexual unions should be legal or we should not “fight” agianst any faux law. Not criminalizing a petty, venial wrong is one thing, but legally recognizing a grave evil is quite another thing.

I’m pleased to hear that.

Would you think I would be that type of man?

 

[katherine2]

fix:

Those words must be properly understood. That in no way means homosexual unions should be legal or we should not “fight” agianst any faux law. Not criminalizing a petty, venial wrong is one thing, but legally recognizing a grave evil is quite another thing.

Would you think I would be that type of man?

Oh, fix, I thought we had come so far.

Yes, as a woman, I’m not willing to assign canoodling with a hussy barmaid, sucking down booze and lying to your wife about your whereabouts as a"petty, venial wrong" while assigning other moral failures as a “grave evil”.

Though I do understand a lot of men do think this way.

 

[renee1258]

Mac6yver:

I disagree. How is it disrespectful? Especially when both parties participate. My wife would probably disagree with you as well.

It is the ultimate act of submission. Men think it is kinky for that reason. Also they don’t have to fear pregnancy, since it is very common among teenager girls to satisfy their boyfriends demands.I believe every woman would perfer “ahem” over the alternative.

Women say they like oral, just to overcome the rather demeaning act they perform on men. The same reason when woman say they like pornography, they are just rolling over and being doormats and put up with a man’s **** because they don’t demand better. Just like women fake orgasisms.

Like I said it is just rather dumb considering a woman has a vagina, and a man has a penis. Why bother putting your mouth there? Demand the good stuff, nothing less.