Church teachings around sexuality 'irrelevant to 75%'

[pepipop]

irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0412/breaking31.html

*The Church’s teachings on sexuality have “no relevance” to 75 per cent of Irish Catholics or their families, a new survey has found.

It has also established that 87 per cent of Irish Catholics believe priests should be allowed marry, 77 per cent believe there should be women priests while 72 per cent believe older, married, men should be allowed become priests.

The Amárach survey also found weekly Mass attendance in Ireland, at 35 per cent, is one of the highest in Europe.

Commissioned by the Association of Catholic Priests (ACP), the Contemporary Catholic Perspectives survey was carried out among 1,000 Catholics throughout the island of Ireland over a two-week period in February.

Where the Church’s teaching on homosexuality was concerned, 46 per cent “disagree strongly”, while five per cent “agree strongly”.

It found 61 per cent disagree with the Church on the issue while 18 per cent consider homosexuality immoral.

Where divorced and/or separated people in a second stable relationship are concerned, 87 per cent believe they should be allowed to take communion.

Just five per cent say they should not.

Five times as many Irish Catholics believe the Church is subservient to Rome compared to those who believe it is independent, with more than one in four (or 28 per cent) believing it to be “completely subservient”.*

The catholic church in Ireland is ‘completely subservient’ to Rome - and their problem is?

 

[LoyalViews]

HA! And I can guarantee you only 20% of Irish Catholics were interviewed.

 

[bmullins]

Even if 100% of people think it’s ok to murder, it doesn’t make it morally right. Either the churches teachings are guarded by the Holy Spirit or they aren’t. Do I think there are some amazingly intelligent women who would make amazing priests? Yes. But the church teaches what it does. If it changes then great! If it doesn’t, then I’ll abide by it.

The gates of hell shall not prevail, either Jesus told the truth or he didn’t.

 

[Jennet]

I love the way that the mainstream media seems to believe the Catholic Church will have to change fundamental teachings if enough of those who term themselves Catholic suddenly they decide they don’t like something!!

 

[lizaanne]

The Church’s teachings on sexuality have “no relevance” to 75 per cent of Irish Catholics or their families, a new survey has found.

And this is entirely and completely irrelevant. Just because a lot of people have an opinion on something does not make it right.

~Liza

 

[CGDouglas]

irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0412/breaking31.html

*The Church’s teachings on sexuality have “no relevance” to 75 per cent of Irish Catholics or their families, a new survey has found.

It has also established that 87 per cent of Irish Catholics believe priests should be allowed marry, 77 per cent believe there should be women priests while 72 per cent believe older, married, men should be allowed become priests.

The Amárach survey also found weekly Mass attendance in Ireland, at 35 per cent, is one of the highest in Europe.

Commissioned by the Association of Catholic Priests (ACP), the Contemporary Catholic Perspectives survey was carried out among 1,000 Catholics throughout the island of Ireland over a two-week period in February.

Where the Church’s teaching on homosexuality was concerned, 46 per cent “disagree strongly”, while five per cent “agree strongly”.

It found 61 per cent disagree with the Church on the issue while 18 per cent consider homosexuality immoral.

Where divorced and/or separated people in a second stable relationship are concerned, 87 per cent believe they should be allowed to take communion.

Just five per cent say they should not.

Five times as many Irish Catholics believe the Church is subservient to Rome compared to those who believe it is independent, with more than one in four (or 28 per cent) believing it to be “completely subservient”.*

The catholic church in Ireland is ‘completely subservient’ to Rome - and their problem is?

Lies… Damn Lies… And Statistics.

God Bless,

Christopher.

 

[garn9173]

HA! And I can guarantee you only 20% of Irish Catholics were interviewed.

I’d be stunned if the percentage was that high.

 

[mdgspencer]

The group who came out with this information is an advocacy group. Its founding Irish priest was ordered to stop writing because he was denying Catholic doctrine and he was sent to a monastery for six weeks in the hope it would help him become loyal to Catholic beliefs. This group is hardly a reputable polling source like Gallup, which uses strict standards in its work. It seems a mistake to me to simply quote the figures they supply as if they are unquestionable truth.

 

[PennyinCanada]

And they yelled, “Crucify him! Crucify him! We want Barabus!”
So soon after the triumphant entry into Jerusalem. They took an opinion poll that day too.

 

[Mijoy2]

I find this very believable. The numbers seem to go along with what I would expect if I were to a take a poll of all family/friends and accomplises on the saem matters.

The church should be a democracy. That way, as time progresses the church could progress with the times. In a relatively short time the church could progress like much of the world where pretty much anything goes. We could elevate the doctrines of many of our modern day heros such as Lady GaGa, Opera Winfrey, Bill Maher and others to Magesteriumm status and all would FINALLY be well with the world.

Either that or we could put our faith in the 2000 year old Church Christ started and promised would be guided by the Holy Spirit and that Satan would not prevail.

The later has become the minority. Does not mean the former has become correct?

 

[Dave_B]

I love the way that the mainstream media seems to believe the Catholic Church will have to change fundamental teachings if enough of those who term themselves Catholic suddenly they decide they don’t like something!!

Well put. I have a friend who calls himself Catholic who is an Atheist. I think plenty fall into that category.

 

[annspazz]

hmmm…someone once said to me:

…wrong is wrong no matter how many people are in favor of it and right is right no matter how many people are opposed to it…

 

[_Abyssinia]

Where are the methods for the study?

 

[Armor_of_Light]

And they yelled, “Crucify him! Crucify him! We want Barabus!”
So soon after the triumphant entry into Jerusalem. They took an opinion poll that day too.

…I always hated having to be a part of the congregation saying “crucify him!”, but now I see it is true…we all say it when we sin.

Good point friend.

 

[Stumblesalot]

irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0412/breaking31.html

*The Church’s teachings on sexuality have “no relevance” to 75 per cent of Irish Catholics or their families, a new survey has found.

It has also established that 87 per cent of Irish Catholics believe priests should be allowed marry, 77 per cent believe there should be women priests while 72 per cent believe older, married, men should be allowed become priests.

The Amárach survey also found weekly Mass attendance in Ireland, at 35 per cent, is one of the highest in Europe.

Commissioned by the Association of Catholic Priests (ACP), the Contemporary Catholic Perspectives survey was carried out among 1,000 Catholics throughout the island of Ireland over a two-week period in February.

Where the Church’s teaching on homosexuality was concerned, 46 per cent “disagree strongly”, while five per cent “agree strongly”.

It found 61 per cent disagree with the Church on the issue while 18 per cent consider homosexuality immoral.

Where divorced and/or separated people in a second stable relationship are concerned, 87 per cent believe they should be allowed to take communion.

Just five per cent say they should not.

Five times as many Irish Catholics believe the Church is subservient to Rome compared to those who believe it is independent, with more than one in four (or 28 per cent) believing it to be “completely subservient”.*

The catholic church in Ireland is ‘completely subservient’ to Rome - and their problem is?

Here are some thoughts about ‘surveys’

1.Who funded the research?
2.Is the research objective (i.e. an anti-Catholic newspaper is likely to ‘find’ or present data in such a way as to be detrimental to the church).
3.Who were the participants (were they devoutly practicing Catholics or Catholics that had not attended mass for 20 years. What age range were they? Were the participants ‘handpicked’ in order to prove a point)?

Example: I ask 100 Catholics if priests should be allowed to marry.

5 say yes (and are all in the young age group)

10 are unsure (and 8 are in the young age group)

85 say no (and 15 are in the young age group)

I manipulate the statistics to suit my own subjective ‘wanted’ outcomes by now stating I am only interested in young Catholics. I further bias the study by defining those answering ‘no’ as agreeing with church teaching. From this definition, those answering ‘unsure’ or ‘yes’ do not agree with church teaching.

So if I take the ACTUAL results 85 out of 100 (i.e. 85%) agree with church teaching

However, if I were to use my manipulated statistics, I can say: In a recent survey 46 % of young Catholics do not agree with priests being unable to marry ({[5+8]/28} x 100= 46%). I have ‘handpicked’ the young Catholics (who only represent 28% of those questioned) in order to extrapolate a detrimental statistic relating to the Catholic Church. Such manipulations are easily achievable from any given data set. Just remember that there is an agenda against the Catholic Church, in which the popular media is playing a significant role. DON’T FALL FOR THE LIES!

In any case, from a survey I’ve just conducted in my mind, I have concluded that: in 95% of cases, statistics are simply a tool used for the purposes of misleading people. I have also concluded that 97.2187% of statistics are made up on the spot lol!

God bless

 

[chaunceygardner]

Rather than finding fault with the survey or claiming the moral high ground, wouldn’t it be of more value to ask WHY so many people have those opinions? What are the causes, and is it a trend? And most important, what can be done about it? Should the Church be happy to be losing so many baptized, life long Catholics?

Those doing the survey may have had an agenda, but they only commissioned the survey; the survey was prepared and done by what appears to be a reputable market research company in Ireland. The group that commissioned the survey may have focused on the results that supported their position, but should one condemn it all before having actually studied it?

And the reported results seem to be quite similar to results from other surveys done in other countries. Ireland is not unique, although they may have better reasons than most for not trusting the hierarchy of their church.

 

[pepipop]

Rather than finding fault with the survey or claiming the moral high ground, wouldn’t it be of more value to ask WHY so many people have those opinions? What are the causes, and is it a trend? And most important, what can be done about it? Should the Church be happy to be losing so many baptized, life long Catholics?

Why should the church care or take their opinions on board? The rulings/discplines/teachings of the church are decided by the ‘hierarchy’, who themselves were chosen by the Holy Spirit.

I think their decisions will be a lot more in line with what God wants for his church, than a group of cafeteria catholics.*

 

[JMJSHJ]

chaunceygardner;9174083:

Rather than finding fault with the survey or claiming the moral high ground, wouldn’t it be of more value to ask WHY so many people have those opinions? What are the causes, and is it a trend? And most important, what can be done about it? Should the Church be happy to be losing so many baptized, life long Catholics?

Why should the church care or take their opinions on board? The rulings/discplines/teachings of the church are decided by the ‘hierarchy’, who themselves were chosen by the Holy Spirit.

I think their decisions will be a lot more in line with what God wants for his church, than a group of cafeteria catholics.

I think the Church should care to an extent that it may want to revise what they preach and teach. If they aren’t teaching the fundamentalsof our Faith and explaining WHY we believe what we believe, this poll is the inevitable result of that inaction.

 

[chaunceygardner]

pepipop:

Why should the church care or take their opinions on board? The rulings/discplines/teachings of the church are decided by the ‘hierarchy’, who themselves were chosen by the Holy Spirit.

I think their decisions will be a lot more in line with what God wants for his church, than a group of cafeteria catholics.

If you have symptoms that indicate a severe medical problem, would you just ignore them or find out the cause and treat it? If you find your car veering in one direction when you drive do you just compensate by turning the steering wheel in the opposite direction, or do you determine what the problem is and fix it? If you are in charge of a once vibrant organization and find that a great number of your members are not attending meetings, not participating in the programs, not paying their dues, not even paying attention to what the leaders of the organization are saying, but still consider themselves members, would you not want to know the extent of the problem and why it is happening?

I am not saying that the Church must change to fit the views of all those who have negative views, but the Church MUST ask itself what is going on and why, so you can do something about it. Its mission is not to weed out the marginal or the imperfect, but to bring them in to the faith. To me, that would follow the words and deeds of Jesus.

Our diocese is apparently emphasizing evangelization this year. Parishes are supposed to start a program. My first recommendation for our parish is to contact people who are no longer participating, including all the young people who have been catechized and confirmed but never return, and the adults who bring their children in for baptism and first communion and appear to be strangers the rest of time, and those who were participating parish members but left. Not to evangelize them, but to ask them WHY? Only then can the Church hope to do anything to get them back or to make them full participants again.

I would rather do that FIRST before trying to convert Baptists, Lutherans, and Methodists.

 

[pepipop]

*

I think the Church should*

care to an extent that it may want to revise what they preach and teach. If they aren’t teaching the fundamentalsof our Faith and explaining WHY we believe what we believe, this poll is the inevitable result of that inaction.

Too true, that’s the problem in a nutshell.