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malphono
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Apparently.
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bpbasilphx
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\To bpbasllphx: Iâm so sorry but what a ridiculous comment. I am sure you know what I meant but I made you angry so you must resort to such comments they offer nothing to the discussion.\
**I know exactly what you meant.
You complained about the supposed riches of the Church, and expect others (namely the ministers of the Church) to live at a level you donât care to yourself.
Judas, likewise, complained about expensive things being given to Jesusâbut not because he loved the poor, according to the Gospels.
You are the only one that seems to be getting angry that people donât roll over and agree with you immediately.
Otherwise, you would not dismissing comments that disagree with your preconceived notions as âridiculous.â**
**I know exactly what you meant.
You complained about the supposed riches of the Church, and expect others (namely the ministers of the Church) to live at a level you donât care to yourself.
Judas, likewise, complained about expensive things being given to Jesusâbut not because he loved the poor, according to the Gospels.
You are the only one that seems to be getting angry that people donât roll over and agree with you immediately.
Otherwise, you would not dismissing comments that disagree with your preconceived notions as âridiculous.â**
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Pakesh
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There is no point to this thread anymore. As I said earlier, I believe the OP is just trying to throw rocks at a hornetâs nest.
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bpbasilphx
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I wonât argue your point, Pakesh, but I would like to say one more thing:
Fr. Vincent on the Ask and Apologist Forum frequently says that one of the most widespred misconceptions about God is that Heâs basically a bigger, softer, cuddlier, and warm-fuzzier version of ourselves.
In other words, they create a God their own perceived image and likeness.
You can see in Billâs posts that he labors under this delusion himself.
Fr. Vincent on the Ask and Apologist Forum frequently says that one of the most widespred misconceptions about God is that Heâs basically a bigger, softer, cuddlier, and warm-fuzzier version of ourselves.
In other words, they create a God their own perceived image and likeness.
You can see in Billâs posts that he labors under this delusion himself.
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Bill_J
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I see that I am under attack. I except this without anger. First let me say I do not wish anyone to live in poverty. I hope everyone lives a very comfortable life. But do we really need to live in castles and homes that cost millions of dollars? You say I am making God into some bigger cuddly version of myself. God created me and calls me one of his children. Let me ask you a question. If I can love my children unconditionally and nothing they do or say will change that love and I demand or as you say command nothing from them then how is it my loving Father who is perfect would do any less for me or you? You speak of God in the old testament did not Jesus come to change that kind of thinking? Also why is it that the bible is full of people being commanded by God but when someone today says God spoke to them they are considered crazy?
I am sorry to the person who asked about the God within. But I am not as educated as you are and I did not understand the question.
I truly mean no harm to any of you. I do not wish to anger any of you I only wish and pray that you see God as not some old man out there waiting for us to mess up and then punish us and say you did it to yourself. But I pray that you see our loving God as part of us.
I believe Jesus was refering to his death and that is how they prepared the body. Judas did not understand this because Jesus was still alive at the time.
The way you speak of God with all the commands and give me this and do this it is like we are His/Her pets not His/Her children.
Iâm not sure I understand why people are upset with me? I thought faith was about God not a church? I am only talking about the greatest love man has ever known. I speak of our God that loves us no matter who we are and loves us unconditionaly is that not what Jesus told us?
I once had a discussion with my priest and it was about how people dressed when coming to church. He said they should be dressed in good clothes I said what does it matter they are at church. He said to me if you were to visit the Queen would you not dress in you best clothes. I said maybe but would the Queen go sit on a park bench with a homeless person who hasnât washed in months and love that person with all of their heart?
As much as you think Iâm in here to cause trouble you are wrong I just want people to experience God for themselves not how others want you to experience Him/Her. Yes including what I say. Just open your heart to Godâs true love. Youâll be amazed what you find there.God bless you all. Peace!
I am sorry to the person who asked about the God within. But I am not as educated as you are and I did not understand the question.
I truly mean no harm to any of you. I do not wish to anger any of you I only wish and pray that you see God as not some old man out there waiting for us to mess up and then punish us and say you did it to yourself. But I pray that you see our loving God as part of us.
I believe Jesus was refering to his death and that is how they prepared the body. Judas did not understand this because Jesus was still alive at the time.
The way you speak of God with all the commands and give me this and do this it is like we are His/Her pets not His/Her children.
Iâm not sure I understand why people are upset with me? I thought faith was about God not a church? I am only talking about the greatest love man has ever known. I speak of our God that loves us no matter who we are and loves us unconditionaly is that not what Jesus told us?
I once had a discussion with my priest and it was about how people dressed when coming to church. He said they should be dressed in good clothes I said what does it matter they are at church. He said to me if you were to visit the Queen would you not dress in you best clothes. I said maybe but would the Queen go sit on a park bench with a homeless person who hasnât washed in months and love that person with all of their heart?
As much as you think Iâm in here to cause trouble you are wrong I just want people to experience God for themselves not how others want you to experience Him/Her. Yes including what I say. Just open your heart to Godâs true love. Youâll be amazed what you find there.God bless you all. Peace!
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Friar_David_O.Carm
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No response Bill?
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Bill_J
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The lord is good to all of His/Her children all of us no matter what!!! NO STRINGS ATTACHED!
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Friar_David_O.Carm
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Not an answer to my question.
But⌠Does this mean everyone is saved no matter what they do?
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Pakesh
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Very, very astute and to the point! Well said!
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bpbasilphx
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**God is so good to HIS children that HE will not force HIMSELF on them throughout eternity if they want nothing to do with HIM in this life.
And you know what that eternal state is called?
Hell.**
\You speak of God in the old testament did not Jesus come to change that kind of thinking?\
**Where did you get that idea?
Not from the words of Jesus Himself, surely.**
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Bill_J
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Why do you all fight Godâs love so much. Yes everyone is saved no matter what because God will not turn his back on his creations. Again I speak of an all loving God unconditional. Yet you try to find fault in that love. Are you worried that God loves a sinner as much as you? Really I speak of a God that truly truly loves us and you fight that love. Iâm really not understanding this.
Did the High Priest not the High Priest try to use scripture against Jesus was this not the old testament since the new had not been written yet.
Again I ask you what do you have against LOVE??
Please forgive my frustration. I do not intend to argue but to discuss. I think you are all great people.
Did the High Priest not the High Priest try to use scripture against Jesus was this not the old testament since the new had not been written yet.
Again I ask you what do you have against LOVE??
Please forgive my frustration. I do not intend to argue but to discuss. I think you are all great people.
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Friar_David_O.Carm
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Not very Scriptural of you. Have you read the Bible? Have you read the New Testament? Everyone is not saved, everyone will not go to Heaven, that is a fact, read your Bible.
Yes, God loves the sinner, but when the sinner loves his sin more than he loves God he is doomed.
Again, what if the âGod withinâ tells two people contradicting things? How do you determine the Truth? And why do you ignore this question?
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bpbasilphx
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\Why do you all fight Godâs love so much. Yes everyone is saved no matter what because God will not turn his back on his creations. Again I speak of an all loving God unconditional.\
**Thatâs not what Jesus Himself said.
As I remarked elsewhere, youâve made up a god in what you perceive to be your own image and likeness, but you donât seem to be broad-minded enough to allow for people to disagree with you.
BTWâwhy did you post this on the Eastern Catholic Forum?**
**Thatâs not what Jesus Himself said.
As I remarked elsewhere, youâve made up a god in what you perceive to be your own image and likeness, but you donât seem to be broad-minded enough to allow for people to disagree with you.
BTWâwhy did you post this on the Eastern Catholic Forum?**
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Pakesh
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God doesnât turn his back on us or send us to Hell. Humans choose to Sin and reject God, thus condemning themselves.
I am astonished, though, on one level this thread is continuing and in this forum
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Bill_J
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Iâm not sure what you mean by contradicting. Do you mean your opinion and my opinion? People can choose what ever they want. If it is something bad then there are universal laws that will come in. These are not nessesarily Godâs laws. Such as you kill you go to jail for life. That does mean God will Judge the same as man does.
Are you saying that God only speaks through the Bible.? That God spoke to men thousands of years ago and then just shut down. No more writings no more talking nothing and He/She will leave it up to certain men to pick what the rest of us will read and learn from.
Do you deny that there are many more Gospels but only certain ones were picked?
To the writer that said he canât believe this discussion continues. I agree I thought the high priest would shut this down long ago. I have no doubt in my mind that if Jesus were to come back today you would only listen to what the church told you. Iâm sure he would be brought before the cardinals and even the Pope for questioning.
Since you claim I avoid your questions I will ask you some again. Why do you fight unconditional love so much? Also why is it so hard to believe that God loves everyone one of us equaly the sinner as well? One more why do you have this need to send people to what you call hell and why would an all loving God wish to do so.
Iâm sure I am looked upon as a sinner or (blasphemer?) I donât understand this because I only speak of LOVE a love that most of us can not understand a love that is well above any of our own love. How is it that I a simple simple man can love my son with all my heart and know that he is kind and caring person and yet my church says he is an abomination to God because he is GAY! I love my son and would die for him so please donât tell me God loves him any less. God bless, I pray that you all will know Godâs true love one day.
âRemember without guilt or sin the church would be out of bussiness.â
Are you saying that God only speaks through the Bible.? That God spoke to men thousands of years ago and then just shut down. No more writings no more talking nothing and He/She will leave it up to certain men to pick what the rest of us will read and learn from.
Do you deny that there are many more Gospels but only certain ones were picked?
To the writer that said he canât believe this discussion continues. I agree I thought the high priest would shut this down long ago. I have no doubt in my mind that if Jesus were to come back today you would only listen to what the church told you. Iâm sure he would be brought before the cardinals and even the Pope for questioning.
Since you claim I avoid your questions I will ask you some again. Why do you fight unconditional love so much? Also why is it so hard to believe that God loves everyone one of us equaly the sinner as well? One more why do you have this need to send people to what you call hell and why would an all loving God wish to do so.
Iâm sure I am looked upon as a sinner or (blasphemer?) I donât understand this because I only speak of LOVE a love that most of us can not understand a love that is well above any of our own love. How is it that I a simple simple man can love my son with all my heart and know that he is kind and caring person and yet my church says he is an abomination to God because he is GAY! I love my son and would die for him so please donât tell me God loves him any less. God bless, I pray that you all will know Godâs true love one day.
âRemember without guilt or sin the church would be out of bussiness.â
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Friar_David_O.Carm
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The âGod withinâ tells one person that sex outside of marriage is a good thing while it tells another person that it is not a good thing. How does one determine the Truth without an authority? This is the mess the protestant Churches are in as there is no authority.
No, God also speaks through His Church.
There are many more books that claim to be Gospels but the only inspired ones are in the Holy Scriptures. The Holy Scriptures were canonized by the Church through the work of the Holy Spirit.
I have never fought against the unconditional love of God. What I fight against is what you seem to think this means. Part of unconditional love is honoring the choices a person makes. If a person chooses to work against God then God will honor that and not force Himself upon them.
We are all equally sinners, of which I am one of the greatest, that does not mean that God does not love us.
I send no one to Hell, they chose it over God themselves.
No, you are looked upon as a heretic as you are superimposing your view upon God rather than actually looking at what God has taught us through His Bible and through His Church.
I can see you are not open to discussion you are just here to push your view so I will move on now. I will pray for you.
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bpbasilphx
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\Again I ask you what do you have against LOVE??\
What do you have against REVEALED TRUTH??
\Are you saying that God only speaks through the Bible.? That God spoke to men thousands of years ago and then just shut down. No more writings no more talking nothing and He/She will leave it up to certain men to pick what the rest of us will read and learn from.\
**Hooray! Youâre starting to catch on!
The alternative, which you are proposing, is that there is no objective revealed truth. (Though in fact, youâre quite dogmatic about your own opinions.)
You keep on saying that everyone is saved, and nobody will be in Hell.
Then how do you account for the words of Jesus Christ Himself Who warned that at the last judgement, there will be some people to whom He says, âDepart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fireâ? Matthew 25:41.
Or is that verse simply not in your Bible?**
What do you have against REVEALED TRUTH??
\Are you saying that God only speaks through the Bible.? That God spoke to men thousands of years ago and then just shut down. No more writings no more talking nothing and He/She will leave it up to certain men to pick what the rest of us will read and learn from.\
**Hooray! Youâre starting to catch on!
The alternative, which you are proposing, is that there is no objective revealed truth. (Though in fact, youâre quite dogmatic about your own opinions.)
You keep on saying that everyone is saved, and nobody will be in Hell.
Then how do you account for the words of Jesus Christ Himself Who warned that at the last judgement, there will be some people to whom He says, âDepart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fireâ? Matthew 25:41.
Or is that verse simply not in your Bible?**
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Bill_J
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I guess we can go around in circles all day. I could get into why God would would have people burn in fire. I mean what purpose would that serve is it not enough if he were to reject us to just not think about us. But he has to burn our souls interesting. I could get into this believe of the Devil and God fighting for our and the fact that God could actually lose that battle. But as you said there is no discussion here. As you believe I am not open to discussion which for the life of me I can not figure out why you feel you are only discussing and not attacking and I am closed minded?
You mention sex before marriage I find it interesting that we will treat amna who has killed the enemy as a hero but a person enjoying one of Godâs gifts is a sin.
I understand that it is hard to listen to someone with a diferent opinion from your own. Iâm sure that is how the High Priest felt in Jesus time. This guy that keeps challenging them how dare he do such a thing. These were men who were positive they had all the answers they were right. They quoted scripture and talked of Moses. So how frustrating to hear this Jesus speak of God as his Father.
Maybe just maybe the translation of the Gospels wasnât 100% or maybe they really didnât like what some of the others had to say.
Some say the Holy Spirit guides the cardinals to choose a Pope. I guess with some of the Popes we have had over the years those cardinals werenât really listening.
I will say I understand now what Jesus meant when he said he was not excepted by his own people. The town he came from they tried to stone him. I see I am not excepted by fellow Catholics.
I would never try to impose my will on God for that is impossible. Nor would I try to oppose my will on you. Would you say Jesus was impossing his will on the Jews of his time or would you say he was speaking from his heart to open their hearts to love one another.
Thank you for praying for me. I will do the same for you. I love to pray or should I say I love to talk to my best friend and creator. Take care and please put a smile on your face and remember you are amazing. Take a look around you will se God He/She is every where in the dark in the light in the storm as well as the calm in the good the bad and the ugly. Not there is any ugly people.
PEACE!
You mention sex before marriage I find it interesting that we will treat amna who has killed the enemy as a hero but a person enjoying one of Godâs gifts is a sin.
I understand that it is hard to listen to someone with a diferent opinion from your own. Iâm sure that is how the High Priest felt in Jesus time. This guy that keeps challenging them how dare he do such a thing. These were men who were positive they had all the answers they were right. They quoted scripture and talked of Moses. So how frustrating to hear this Jesus speak of God as his Father.
Maybe just maybe the translation of the Gospels wasnât 100% or maybe they really didnât like what some of the others had to say.
Some say the Holy Spirit guides the cardinals to choose a Pope. I guess with some of the Popes we have had over the years those cardinals werenât really listening.
I will say I understand now what Jesus meant when he said he was not excepted by his own people. The town he came from they tried to stone him. I see I am not excepted by fellow Catholics.
I would never try to impose my will on God for that is impossible. Nor would I try to oppose my will on you. Would you say Jesus was impossing his will on the Jews of his time or would you say he was speaking from his heart to open their hearts to love one another.
Thank you for praying for me. I will do the same for you. I love to pray or should I say I love to talk to my best friend and creator. Take care and please put a smile on your face and remember you are amazing. Take a look around you will se God He/She is every where in the dark in the light in the storm as well as the calm in the good the bad and the ugly. Not there is any ugly people.
PEACE!
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bpbasilphx
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\I will say I understand now what Jesus meant when he said he was not excepted by his own people.\
**First off, the verb youâre looking for is âacceptedâ, which means almost the opposite of âexcepted.â
Next, attempting to put yourself on the same level as Jesus is not only irreverent and prideful, but ludicrous.
What youâre believing and proposing here is simply not Catholicism or Christianity in any form. Believe it, if you think itâs the truth, but be honest and donât call yourself Catholic if you do.**
**First off, the verb youâre looking for is âacceptedâ, which means almost the opposite of âexcepted.â
Next, attempting to put yourself on the same level as Jesus is not only irreverent and prideful, but ludicrous.
What youâre believing and proposing here is simply not Catholicism or Christianity in any form. Believe it, if you think itâs the truth, but be honest and donât call yourself Catholic if you do.**
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Bill_J
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Sorry it took so long to get back. Also sorry my spelling isnât that great.
How many times have you heard the church or anyone say follow Jesus example live as Jesus did? So when I say Jesus was not ACCEPTED by his own people. I was reffering to the situation not Jesus.
So you are saying that Jesus practiced his Jewish faith but because he had a different opinon or a new testament if you will he was not to call himself Jewish.
You seem more interested in attacking me my spelling or grammar or even if I am catholic more that you listen to what is being said.
All of you seem far more interested in the Church than you are in God. Iâm sorry you feel such anger towards me. I can assure you I feel no such anger towards you. Peace.
How many times have you heard the church or anyone say follow Jesus example live as Jesus did? So when I say Jesus was not ACCEPTED by his own people. I was reffering to the situation not Jesus.
So you are saying that Jesus practiced his Jewish faith but because he had a different opinon or a new testament if you will he was not to call himself Jewish.
You seem more interested in attacking me my spelling or grammar or even if I am catholic more that you listen to what is being said.
All of you seem far more interested in the Church than you are in God. Iâm sorry you feel such anger towards me. I can assure you I feel no such anger towards you. Peace.
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