cohabitation, the new norm?

[Norseman82]

Dating today as a practicing Catholic is next to impossible, since sex is assumed at a certain point in the relationship…anytime from before two people become a couple to a few weeks into the relationship.

This is a very cynical view, but as a fellow single Catholic, I agree. Single people aren’t wanted in most parishes.

I don’t know if it’s so much that we aren’t wanted (I’m sure if I left my envelopes would be missed!), I think it’s more that the people in charge of most singles and young adult ministry programs are clueless to the fact or don’t take seriously enough that most single people who are eligible to be married want to get married and single Catholics who take their faith similarly want to marry other single Catholics who take their faith seriously. Instead, we have “single vocation” and “alternate lifegiving” shoved down our throats. Other singles ministries are more geared to the divorced/widowed set, like one singles conference I went to last year where one panel discussion was 80% divorced females, one especially bitter and telling us “at your ages all that you can expect are women with children”.

One shining light, though, was the National Catholic Singles Conference held here in late April (there is supposed be one in San Diego too). The people running that seem to “get it”.

 

[Dispector]

As a young, single and practicing Catholic male I can vouch for how difficult it is to find a good girl that, at the very least, respects my faith and my morals let alone one that shares my Catholic faith.

As for cohabitation, I don’t think cohabitation is wrong as of itself. It just opens the door for sinful behavior. It’s better to avoid cohabitation simply from the temptation that you can through yourself into.

Respectfully,
Mark

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

I think it’s more that the people in charge of most singles and young adult ministry programs are clueless to the fact or don’t take seriously enough that most single people who are eligible to be married want to get married and single Catholics who take their faith similarly want to marry other single Catholics who take their faith seriously. Instead, we have “single vocation” and “alternate lifegiving” shoved down our throats.

I am on the committee of Leeds Diosecan Single Catholics. We always say that we are not a dating agency. One reason is that people come with totally unrealistic expectations. We are quite a small group, none of us very rich, most not young or talented. You don’t get many successful single business men in their thirties looking to meet women in their thirties, or attractive women in their twenties who are not already bombarded with invitations from attractive men. That’s just what life is like. I’m not saying never, but it is not as easy as joining us and their pairing off with the person of your dreams.

The grass is always greener. We don’t accept divorced members, for obvious reasons, but one who came to a meeting due a misunderstanding, on hearing that everyone else was unmarried, said “you are so lucky”.

 

[Riley259]

I turned on the TV last night and immediately saw Bob Barker (or whatever the Jeopardy show host’s name is) on Conan O’Brien talking about marrying his wife. First he said she was 24 years younger…which seemed a little off but I don’t really know the circumstances. But then he went on to say, “She is really old fashioned, for example we didn’t move in together until we were married.”

I’m 24 and have had 2 or 3 friends move in with girlfriends or fiances, but they are the great minority. To a degree I am in a Catholic or at least Christian bubble. Is it really that prevalent? To the degree that I could be called “old fashion” by most, or is he in an opposite Hollywood bubble, why American society between our two positions?

On a side note I just read a head line on CNN: “Morning Sickness so Bad that Mom had an Abortion”. It’s terrible to see that. I’m sorry that mother was feeling so bad. But more saddened that she decided on such a terrible “solution” and that our nation has made that “solution” legal. Prayer. I need to spend more time in prayer.

Apparently it really is that bad. The Catholic church in Boston recently reported that marriages are down 30% since the 1980’s. They’re currently putting together a program in the archdiocese to encourage people to get married - apparently alot more people are just living together. The very idea of marriage has been cheapened by co-habitation and the cry for same-sex marriage.

 

[quiet52]

“The contract is now meaningless, destroyed by no fault divorce. Anyone can just walk away.”

This happened to my sister. Her ex-husband is the jerk, who cheated on her, stole all the assets, and who abused her. Only in divorces can the person at fault be the plaintiff, and the defendant may not be “guilty” of anything. My sister put so much effort into being the good Catholic wife but now, even though disabled because of a car accident and unable to work, must fend for herself. She was left with the debts of her ex-husband, no medical insurance, and no security whatsoever, because the courts don’t care. No-fault divorce not only demeans the institution of marriage, but makes people untrusting about it.
We all need to support and pray for the marriage preparation programs in our parishes and dioceses.

“Single people aren’t wanted in most parishes.”

It acan seem that way sometimes. A parish is a microcosm of society though – society in general isn’t welcoming toward single people. The attitude seems to be “something is wrong with you.”

The Church needs the gifts from everyone, single or not, in order to be built up. Catholic singles need to brush off any hurts and give what they can of themselves to the Church no matter what, no matter what individuals in the parish judge.

 

[JimG]

No-fault divorce not only demeans the institution of marriage, but makes people untrusting about it.

I agree completely. How when anyone take a lifetime commitment seriously when it is easier to walk away from than an auto loan?

 

[goofyjim]

Apparently it really is that bad. The Catholic church in Boston recently reported that marriages are down 30% since the 1980’s. They’re currently putting together a program in the archdiocese to encourage people to get married - apparently alot more people are just living together. The very idea of marriage has been cheapened by co-habitation and the cry for same-sex marriage.

How can they encourage someone to marry who doesn’t feel called to it? I find as the generations go on that more and more are comfortable being single. Are they not doing their Christian duty?

 

[strngrnrth]

I’m a Protestant who is considerring becoming Catholic. I have been poor much of my life and lived in a lot of places where most people are young, compared to Americans in general. Thus in my pre-Christian life I got pretty used to the idea of roommates. Most of the men I have lied with were roommates; there was no romance, dating or sex between us. However, most men who were “interested” in me thought we had to have sex the very day we met, or I was a tease. So to me, who you sleep with and who you live with were two different things. I always had male friends. i was also very close to my girl friends. So I never equated sex and closeness at all. Kind of the opposite, in fact, if anything. Now, though, I find most of the friends I make act irritated if I expect real friendship to form. They want to spend that kind of time with their spouses, fiances, etc. And most of my new friends think that if two or more people live together and have different sexes, they must be living in sin. And if I complain of loneliness they reassure me that I will get married. I don’t want to get married! It sounds awful. Is the lack of friendship and platonic normalcy in my life a result of aging or a part of being a Christian? Just wondering.

 

[drburle]

I’m a Protestant who is considerring becoming Catholic. I have been poor much of my life and lived in a lot of places where most people are young, compared to Americans in general. Thus in my pre-Christian life I got pretty used to the idea of roommates. Most of the men I have lied with were roommates; there was no romance, dating or sex between us. However, most men who were “interested” in me thought we had to have sex the very day we met, or I was a tease. So to me, who you sleep with and who you live with were two different things. I always had male friends. i was also very close to my girl friends. So I never equated sex and closeness at all. Kind of the opposite, in fact, if anything. Now, though, I find most of the friends I make act irritated if I expect real friendship to form. They want to spend that kind of time with their spouses, fiances, etc. And most of my new friends think that if two or more people live together and have different sexes, they must be living in sin. And if I complain of loneliness they reassure me that I will get married. I don’t want to get married! It sounds awful. Is the lack of friendship and platonic normalcy in my life a result of aging or a part of being a Christian? Just wondering.

Hello, I am pleased that you are considering Catholicism. The fact you don’t want to get married is because you have not found the right person. I have heard many people and some friends say the same thing and I think part of the reason is the number of quality people (it gets worse with age) out there is on the decline partially because the state of morality. I have also seen there attitude change once finding the Mr. or Ms. right.

 

[Norseman82]

How can they encourage someone to marry who doesn’t feel called to it? I find as the generations go on that more and more are comfortable being single. Are they not doing their Christian duty?

How can they NOT feel called to it?

1. The CCC states that the vocation to marriage is placed in our very nature (CCC 1603)
2. If they are truly single in the Christian sense, then they would not be cohabitating, wouldn’t they? The fact that they are behaving like married couples shows that they have the call, it’s just that it is being responded to in a sinful manner.

 

[Fisher-of-Men]

May have been stated earlier, but my wife and I do marriage prep courses and here are some astonishing stats:

80% of couples who practice cohabitation before marriage get divorced (greatest single cause)

On the flip side:

1 in 700 couples who attend Mass together regularly get divorced

AND

1 in 1200 couples who pray together regularly get divorced

WOW, that say’s something about the sanctitiy of Marriage and doing things God’s way!!

 

[Pug]

80% of couples who practice cohabitation before marriage get divorced (greatest single cause)

I think you mean greatest single predictor, which is not the same.

 

[goofyjim]

How can they NOT feel called to it?

1. The CCC states that the vocation to marriage is placed in our very nature (CCC 1603)
2. If they are truly single in the Christian sense, then they would not be cohabitating, wouldn’t they? The fact that they are behaving like married couples shows that they have the call, it’s just that it is being responded to in a sinful manner.

But not all single people are cohabiting. And they are unequivocally not all called to marriage.

 

[goofyjim]

Forgive me for this but a previous post has finally allowed me to catch a flaw in the catechism. It states that everyone is called to marriage. This would go against Jesus teaching that soem are called to celibacy, and not just the religious.

 

[Pug]

Forgive me for this but a previous post has finally allowed me to catch a flaw in the catechism. It states that everyone is called to marriage. This would go against Jesus teaching that soem are called to celibacy, and not just the religious.

Could you paste in the exact sentence that is bothering you? Of course, in the Church there are people who are NOT religious, and still are called to a single life. I’ve met them!

 

[goofyjim]

Could you paste in the exact sentence that is bothering you? Of course, in the Church there are people who are NOT religious, and still are called to a single life. I’ve met them!

Post #50 references CCC 1603 that the call to marriage is in our very nature whereas Jesus in Matthew 19 would say just the opposite. I don’t think he was referring to just physical eunuchs but those who were called to celibacy for whatever reason. So I see the two conflicting and always was of the assumption that Church teaching is not to contradict scripture, only to expand on it.

 

[Pug]

Post #50 references CCC 1603 that the call to marriage is in our very nature whereas Jesus in Matthew 19 would say just the opposite. I don’t think he was referring to just physical eunuchs but those who were called to celibacy for whatever reason. So I see the two conflicting and always was of the assumption that Church teaching is not to contradict scripture, only to expand on it.

I think, then, that you mean this spot:

…The vocation to marriage is written in the very nature of man and woman as they came from the hand of the Creator. Marriage is not a purely human institution despite…

This to me does not say that each man and each woman specifically is supposed to become married. It more says to me that marriage as a thing is from our nature; that the reason marriage is a natural vocation is because of how we were made. I don’t read it the same way you do, I think.

This is the spot that I don’t quite get (from 1604):

God who created man out of love also calls him to love the fundamental and innate vocation of every human being.

I agree with you about the eunuch for the sake of the kingdom. I think this does not have to be referring to a man who is physically missing a piece. I’ve always taken it to include the man who renounces marriage (elects to be celibate). I would have said the CCC sees it the same way. It quotes that very verse from Matt. See CCC1618, posted here for your convenience:

1618 Christ is the center of all Christian life. The bond with him takes precedence over all other bonds, familial or social.113 From the very beginning of the Church there have been men and women who have renounced the great good of marriage to follow the Lamb wherever he goes, to be intent on the things of the Lord, to seek to please him, and to go out to meet the Bridegroom who is coming.114 Christ himself has invited certain persons to follow him in this way of life, of which he remains the model:

"For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to receive this, let him receive it."115

 

[Riley259]

How can they encourage someone to marry who doesn’t feel called to it? I find as the generations go on that more and more are comfortable being single. Are they not doing their Christian duty?

I’m all in favor of those who for whatever reason have a vocation as a single person but they’re in the minority. Most of those not getting married are co-habitating instead.

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

I’m a Protestant who is considerring becoming Catholic. I have been poor much of my life and lived in a lot of places where most people are young, compared to Americans in general. Thus in my pre-Christian life I got pretty used to the idea of roommates. Most of the men I have lied with were roommates; there was no romance, dating or sex between us. However, most men who were “interested” in me thought we had to have sex the very day we met, or I was a tease. So to me, who you sleep with and who you live with were two different things. I always had male friends. i was also very close to my girl friends. So I never equated sex and closeness at all. Kind of the opposite, in fact, if anything. Now, though, I find most of the friends I make act irritated if I expect real friendship to form. They want to spend that kind of time with their spouses, fiances, etc. And most of my new friends think that if two or more people live together and have different sexes, they must be living in sin. And if I complain of loneliness they reassure me that I will get married. I don’t want to get married! It sounds awful. Is the lack of friendship and platonic normalcy in my life a result of aging or a part of being a Christian? Just wondering.

There is a big difference between being poor and being respectable. Poor people have to live in the same houses as strangers, they cannot isolate themselves from drug use or casual sex, so it produces a different attitude to life.

However in Western countries most practising Catholics are respectable. Also people tend to become more respectable as they get older. As you move from poverty to respectability you begin to realise what you have lost. However some of the solidarity of the poor is illusion. Women, in particular, often manage to convince themselves that they have a very intense and loving network of friends, whilst in fact all they have done is to suspend inhibitions.
I’d suggest maybe looking at some groups in the Church that cater for single people.

 

[paradoxy]

God who created man out of love also calls him to love the fundamental and innate vocation of every human being.

I think this would become clearer with a comma:

God who created man out of love also calls him to love, the fundamental and innate vocation of every human being.

All are called to love, whether they marry, enter a monastery or become priests… or stay single.