Columbus Day Has Been A Federal Holiday Since 1934, Maine and Vermont have renamed "Indigenous People Day"

[Cathoholic]

2/2 . . . (With minor overlap for continuity) . . .

Warren, who falsely claimed Native American heritage throughout her academic career, embraced the temporary replacement. . . .

. . . “We owe them our respect . . .

. . . Warren has faced scrutiny for falsely claiming Native American heritage in the past. The results of her DNA test made public last year showed that she possessed between 1/64th and 1/1,024 Native American ancestry (or between 0.1 percent to 1.56 percent). The results called her past claims of Native American heritage – Cherokee heritage, specifically – into question.

Not only had Warren identified as a minority professor for years, she also claimed Native American heritage on her Texas Bar registration card and once cited her high cheekbones as proof of her native roots. A clip of an interview from 2012 shows the presidential hopeful telling a reporter that she had pictures proving her Native American family history, but she refused to show them. . . .

As Breitbart News reported, Warren’s DNA results did not show a direct association with Native American tribes in the U.S., further debunking her claims of Cherokee heritage.

Warren has failed to explain why she went so many years claiming minority status without checking her family history, but she has since admitted that she is “not a citizen of a tribe” and issued a general apology for making what she described as a “mistake.”

“Like anyone who’s been honest with themselves, I know that I have made mistakes,” Warren said at the Native American Presidential Forum in Sioux City, Iowa, in August. “I am sorry for harm I have caused.”

Warren will join 11 other candidates on the debate stage at Otterbein University in Westerville, Ohio, on Tuesday evening. The Massachusetts senator’s false claims of Native American heritage have yet to become a topic of conversation at any of the primary debates.

Elizabeth Warren Commemorates 'Indigenous Peoples' Day'

Warren commemorated "Indigenous Peoples' Day" in place of Columbus Day and claimed America has a "long and painful" history of mistreatment.

www.breitbart.com

 

[Zach]

Like I said I’m all for celebrating it. Just don’t have it as a federal holiday. If it’s just something progressives are going to change the name of and delight in bashing Columbus then what’s the point of a federal holiday if we can’t even agree on who or what is being celebrated or what to name it.

 

[Rhubarb]

He was courageous to even attempt to sail. The hardship he and his men endured, no one else was that stupid. He thought he was attempting to get to the West Indies directly for trade.

I suppose that makes up for the mass murder, the hunting people for sport, the maiming of people who didn’t being enough gold to them, and fathering the Atlantic slave trade? Neither his motives or actions were admirable. The reality that is the whole scope of what Columbus did has been buried, and people keep trying to shovel more dirt on it.

 

[Zach]

Just a note for Elizabeth Warren. She does realize that indigenous Americans did pretty good job themselves of slaughtering each other right?

 

[gam197]

If it’s just something progressives are going to change the name of and delight in bashing Columbus then what’s the point of a federal holiday if we can’t even agree on who or what is being celebrated or what to name it.

No it is an outward attack on the catholic faith, but aimed at two particular groups and most importantly the Irish. It has been going on since the Know nothings.

The catholic missionaries were not evil people. The original explorers were not evil people. I am sorry the the Latin American Countries had lots of slaves, That is their guilt and their problem not mind.

 

[Rhubarb]

Sounds like the MS 13 guys.

Well at least both you and I seem to oppose the open border routine and barging into a land for financially “a better life”.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

 

[gam197]

Latin american has a great deal to be ashamed of. They had lots of slaves. That is their guilt not mine.

Columbus was one Italian man. He did not start the slave trade. He arrived here later in life in 1492 and only lived a short time abut 10 years.If it was started , it was started by leaders in Spain whom he sailed for.

 

[Cathoholic]

You mean its OK to go into a foreign land looking for that financial better life??

Because THAT was a large part of your link’s gripes about Christopher Columbus. (Admittedly not all, but still harped on these points a lot).

If you think it is a false equivalence state WHY (in THAT area).

If you make your case, I am happy to affirm that. But it is going to take more than the fallacy of ipse dixit for you to make your point here.

 

[Rhubarb]

Latin american has a great deal to be ashamed of. They had lots of slaves. That is their guilt not mine.

Nobody is asking you to personally feel guilty for anything. That isn’t what matters like this is about. It is about people advocating for a change in the kind of people we celebrate and memorialize. It’s not about you. (bolds for emphasis) Typically these arguments come about because people make accusations of ‘destroying our heroes’ when in fact, they’re just pointing out actions and behaviors that are certainly not heroic.

Columbus was one Italian man. He did not start the slave trade. He arrived here later in life in 1492 and only lived a short time abut 10 years.If it was started , it was started by leaders in Spain whom he sailed for.

Columbus was made Viceroy and Governor of the West Indies by the Spanish Crown, and was notoriously brutal, unjust, vain, and avaricious. He -was- the leader in Spain (that’s what viceroy means - vice-king) that as ruling in Hispaniola. In fact, he was removed from his office just because of his brutality and unjust rule and even jailed for it when he was recalled from Spain.

 

[Rhubarb]

So I typically try not to respond to you, because you tend to argue in bad faith. If I had a dime for every time you railed against ‘using dead bodies for political purposes’ when mass shooters crop up, while at the same time posting every link to a deadly crime committed by an immigrant, I could retire. But I’ll give this a go.

You mean its OK to go into a foreign land looking for that financial better life??

Because THAT was a large part of your link’s gripes about Christopher Columbus. (Admittedly not all, but still harped on these points a lot).

The beginning of the article/presentation/whatever you want to call it discusses Columbus’ motives because we in the US (at least since the late 80s and early 90s when I was in grade school) tried to build Columbus up as some sort of scientist-explorer that wanted to prove to everyone that the world was round. I’m not sure if you recall the Looney Tunes Christopher Columbus episode - it began with Columbus arguing that the world was round, and everyone arguing back that the world was flat. Which is why he went off on his voyage - to prove some truth that only he had the foresight to see.

That isn’t true. Columbus wanted to get rich. Everyone knew the world was round. That’s the point the author is trying to make - as his purpose is to dispel some common myths about Columbus. He wasn’t some misunderstood genius who wanted to push the horizons of human knowledge. He just wanted a buck. Which isn’t necessarily bad - but is that something worthy of hero worship?

If you think it is a false equivalence state WHY (in THAT area).

If you make your case, I am happy to affirm that. But it is going to take more than the fallacy of ipse dixit for you to make your point here.

Firstly, your post tries to equate MS-13 gang-bangers to refugees vis-a-vis open borders. That equivalence is at best, unsupported by the facts, and at worse, a lie.

Secondly, refugees escaping gang violence and economic depression isn’t the same thing as a military conquest of another people and exploiting them economically and sexually - which is what Columbus oversaw did as governor. The colonists didn’t enter the island and try to get jobs at landscape firms, or clean houses, or heck get on welfare (as refugees are unfairly maligned as doing) They set up forts, and brutally took over.

Piggy-backing off the first two. Desperate people fleeing desperate situations isn’t the same thing as straight up old school imperialism.

 

[gam197]

He was viceroy for Spain. He may or may not have been a good ruler, and apparently was removed from office, but that does slander him as founder of the slave trade.

Howard Zinn did a great deal of damage. This book was A People’s History of the United States was given recently to a family member in Catholic high school. I knew of Howard Zinn but not this.

Scholar: Leftist Historian Howard Zinn Lied About Christopher Columbus

Mary Grabar, a scholar at the Alexander Hamilton Institute in Clinton, New York, recently published a book that aims to debunk the revisionary scholarship of leftist historian Howard Zinn. In her book, Grabar takes aim at Zinn's lies about Christopher Columbus, which have in part fueled the...

www.breitbart.com

 

[Zach]

It is about people advocating for a change in the kind of people we celebrate and memorialize.

If that’s the case we won’t be celebrating anyone, including Elizabeth Warren’s beloved “indigenous peoples”, or for that matter Martin Luther King. If we only wanted to celebrate saints than we’d have to emulate the Catholic Church, which frankly wouldn’t be a bad idea.

 

[Rhubarb]

If we only wanted to celebrate saints than we’d have to emulate the Catholic Church, which frankly wouldn’t be a bad idea.

Note that I (like the Oatmeal author) did suggest that Bartolome de las Casas (a Dominican friar) far more deserves the honor of a holiday.

 

[gam197]

Note that I (like the Oatmeal author) did suggest that Bartolome de las Casas (a Dominican friar) far more deserves the honor of a holiday.

Who is he and why should my family living in the US for almost 200 years and celebrating Columbus as a honorable Catholic and given a national holiday change to someone I have never heard of. Columbus discovered America, do we forget that?

No.

 

[Rhubarb]

Go read the -actual- journal. You can find the text, unedited, and unabridged.

The Breitbart author is wrong. Or doing as Breitbart is known to do. Lie. Through its teeth.

From Swarthmore College: I saw some who had marks of wounds on their bodies and I made signs to them asking what they were; and they showed me how people from other islands nearby came there and tried to take them, and how they defended themselves; and I believed and believe that – they come here from tierrafirme to take them captive. They should be good and intelligent servants, for I see that they say very quickly everything that is said to them

Columbus is clearly commenting on how their ability to learn would tend to them making good slaves.

 

[Rhubarb]

Columbus discovered America.

I believe you mean Lief Erickson. Because he lead the expedition to the New World long before Columbus. But even that’s wrong. Because people were already here in the Americas.

And that’s why people make a deal out of this. Because there are so many misconceptions about Columbus - like the demonstratively false idea that he ‘discovered America’.

And I’ve already given you the start of information who will tell you who De las Casas is, and why he is more suitable to honor. Again, especially for Catholics I should think. Which is neither here nor there to me. Makes no difference to me what anyone wants to call October 14th. What makes a difference to me is when someone is all incredulous because they’ve ‘never heard of’ someone - when it’s clear the reason why they haven’t is because they’re refusing to investigate when presented with information.

I suppose you have to ask yourself what is more important. The less-than-a-century old tradition of Columbus Day. Or actually learning the facts of the matter. The things Columbus did as governor was vile. Truly vile. I don’t know how anyone can call that an ‘honorable Catholic’

 

[gam197]

Did Lief Ericson make it back and then start a whole movement of people/trade routes to the Americas. No.

It does not matter that people were already living here. Migrations of people have already happened. Columbus came and others follows. He is a Catholic hero, founder of Americas, note I did not say saint.

 

[Cathoholic]

Rhubarb . . .

So I typically try not to respond to you, because you tend to argue in bad faith. If I had a dime for every time you railed against ‘using dead bodies for political purposes’ when mass shooters crop up, while at the same time posting every link to a deadly crime committed by an immigrant, I could retire. But I’ll give this a go.

Why is it “bad faith” for me but not for you?

If the media just covered the two examples (illegal immigration with associated disasterous consequences vrs. politics when there is a politically “advantageous” mass murder - to hurt the Constitution) you gave in principle, people like me wouldn’t have to expose it. We could just post the story and people will draw their own correct conclusions.

Most of the illegal immigrant stories I post are not political. At least initially.

That political part comes later.

I just post them for the information.

(Admittedly I fall into some politicizing too.
I am not perfect.
You can call me on that if you think I’m doing that and I will be happy to respond.)

I have no problem with posting information about mass shootings.

Even “politically helpful” (to leftist causes) stories.

I am often the first to report them.

The problem is, to try to make political hay out of them immediately.

Look. I posted about Sanders heart attack.

NONE of the conservatives politicized it. Not one.
At least immediately.

One of the leftists (left of me anyway) did.

Even then I thought: “Can’t you just give even Bernie a rest for a couple of days before politics are injected into his heart attack”?

But I guess not.

For some on the left life is politics.

You attempting to put the focus on me personally here and how I argue is disingenuous.
At least that is the way I see it.

If you want to discuss me and my posting style start a thread on me or call me out on a given post.

I am OK with that. Anyone who frequents here, knows I have OFTEN just admitted when I am wrong.

I have not seen that reciprocated by many on the left.

 

[gam197]

It may not mean anything to Ireland but it means a great deal to to many Irish who migrated to America. They were immediate thrown into a civil war and barred from even going into stores, obtaining jobs. They were literally pushed off the streets.

The history of the American Irish is long, painful and deep. Christopher Columbus was in school revered as a Catholic hero giving glimpse of hope to a change.

You may know of Ireland history but you have very little knowledge of Irish American history.

I am sure the Italians Americans also have a history.

As far as Columbus as slave owner/beginning the slave trade, this is 1492 and very disputed.

 

[gam197]

You cannot know the American Irish history. Your family has not been a part of it. Sure you can hear details but the day to day hatred that families here had to endure and passed down orally is not a part of your heritage.