B
BTTG
Guest
May God bless you all. Remember what letter is in the middle of pride and sin.
written with love
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written with love
R
Robbinson
Guest
That’s funny. If you read John 1:42 in the Greek, you will see that the word, translated in the Authorized Version and KJV as “stone” is actually Πέτρος (Petros). This is translated in most (the vast majority of) bible translations are referring to just “Peter” but the actual greek meaning of the word, as I noted in my earlier reply is “rock” rather than stone. Hope that helps.Blessings,
Brian
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BTTG
Guest
I was doing some history research on the Catholic Church and the commandments.
Can this be true:
Source: Alphonsus de liguori, Dignity and Duties of the Priest: or Selva ( Redemptorist Fathers, 1927) pp 26,27,31-35
p26- We find that in the obedience to the words of his priest, God himself descends on the alter, that he comes wherever they call him, and places himself in their hands… And after he comes, he remains, entirely at their disposal; they move him as they please, from one place to another; they may, if they wish, shut him up in the tabernacle, or expose him to the alter, or carry him outside the church.
pg 32 - thus the priest may, in a certain manner, be called the creator of his Creator, since by saying these words of consecration, he creates, as it were, Jesus in the sacrament, by giving him a sacramental existence, and produces him as a victim to be offered to the eternal Father.
pg 33 - The power of the priest says, St. Bernardine of Sienna, is the power of the divine person; for the transubstantiation of the bread requires as much power as the creation of the world.
pg 34- According to St. Cyprian, a priest at the altar performs the office of Christ. The priest holds the place of the Saviour himself, when, by saying :Ego te absolvo", he absolves from sin.
pg 35 - The Jews justly said: Who can forgive sins but God alone? But what only God can do by his omnipotence, the priest can also do by saying " Ego te absolvo a peccatis tuis" ( I absolve you from your sins).
Can this be true:
Source: Alphonsus de liguori, Dignity and Duties of the Priest: or Selva ( Redemptorist Fathers, 1927) pp 26,27,31-35
p26- We find that in the obedience to the words of his priest, God himself descends on the alter, that he comes wherever they call him, and places himself in their hands… And after he comes, he remains, entirely at their disposal; they move him as they please, from one place to another; they may, if they wish, shut him up in the tabernacle, or expose him to the alter, or carry him outside the church.
pg 32 - thus the priest may, in a certain manner, be called the creator of his Creator, since by saying these words of consecration, he creates, as it were, Jesus in the sacrament, by giving him a sacramental existence, and produces him as a victim to be offered to the eternal Father.
pg 33 - The power of the priest says, St. Bernardine of Sienna, is the power of the divine person; for the transubstantiation of the bread requires as much power as the creation of the world.
pg 34- According to St. Cyprian, a priest at the altar performs the office of Christ. The priest holds the place of the Saviour himself, when, by saying :Ego te absolvo", he absolves from sin.
pg 35 - The Jews justly said: Who can forgive sins but God alone? But what only God can do by his omnipotence, the priest can also do by saying " Ego te absolvo a peccatis tuis" ( I absolve you from your sins).
A
adrift
Guest
May God bless you all. Remember what letter is in the middle of pride and sin.
written with love:bigyikes:
M
Michael_Francis
Guest
**3 posts have been pruned from this thread as off topic.
Please remain on topic.
Sincerely,**
Please remain on topic.
Sincerely,**
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adrift
Guest
When Jesus died
Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath. He gave Peter the Keys. The Christians met on Sunday and broke bread. This was the fulfillment of Jesus’ command to do this in memory of me.
Why was Sabbath made what was the purpose.? Can that purpose only be fulfilled on a paticular time Friday night to Saturday night or would that be what Jesus condemned-legalism.
The temple was destroyed which ended the Jewish people ablility to worship as they once had.
Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath. He gave Peter the Keys. The Christians met on Sunday and broke bread. This was the fulfillment of Jesus’ command to do this in memory of me.
Why was Sabbath made what was the purpose.? Can that purpose only be fulfilled on a paticular time Friday night to Saturday night or would that be what Jesus condemned-legalism.
A
adrift
Guest
The boy’s name Cephas \
ce-
phas\ is of Hebrew origin, and the meaning of Cephas is “rock”. Biblical: what Jesus called his apostle Simon. Peter is the Latin translation by which he is more frequently known.
B
BTTG
Guest
The information that I posted, that was pruned, was leading to a question of importance of this thread topic.
I ask that you reconsider to post the information in my last post on this thread. If there was information that I provided was inaccurate, or the references that I provided were incorrect, please let me know, and I will certainly apologize for such.
thank you
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adrift
Guest
You need to contact the moderator directly. I don’t believe that what you posted on the subject was the objection but the other things in your post that were unkind.
B
BTTG
Guest
Many have stated on this thread that the 10 commandments started and were given to Moses at Mt. Sinai and not before.
I have already alluded to the story of the manna and God’s test of the people that occurred before Mt. Sinai.
By the following we can read that the Sabbath was being observed long before Mt. Sinai.
(Gen 2:2) And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he **rested **on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
(Gen 2:3) And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had **rested **from all his work which God created and made.
There are 70 different definitions for the word rest in the bible.
However, the word “rest” in both of these verses according to Strong’s concordance is " shâbath
shaw-bath’
A primitive root; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.
To keep Sabbath
Now we read in Exo. 4 about Moses’ encounter with the Pharaoh about the Sabbath.
(Exo 5:4) And the king of Egypt said unto them, Wherefore do ye, Moses and Aaron, let the people from their works? get you unto your burdens. (Exo 5:5) And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now are many, and ye make them rest from their burdens.
The same definition of “rest” - Sabbath, in the above verse, is the same definition in that of Gen.
We you read on in Exo. 5:6- onward, we see the Pharaoh is upset that Moses want’s his people to have a Sabbath day rest and makes then work harder.
Even the “stranger”, non-Jew is to keep the Sabbath day/Saturday…(Isa 56:6) Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
written with love
I have already alluded to the story of the manna and God’s test of the people that occurred before Mt. Sinai.
By the following we can read that the Sabbath was being observed long before Mt. Sinai.
(Gen 2:2) And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he **rested **on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
(Gen 2:3) And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had **rested **from all his work which God created and made.
There are 70 different definitions for the word rest in the bible.
However, the word “rest” in both of these verses according to Strong’s concordance is " shâbath
shaw-bath’
A primitive root; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.
To keep Sabbath
Now we read in Exo. 4 about Moses’ encounter with the Pharaoh about the Sabbath.
(Exo 5:4) And the king of Egypt said unto them, Wherefore do ye, Moses and Aaron, let the people from their works? get you unto your burdens. (Exo 5:5) And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now are many, and ye make them rest from their burdens.
The same definition of “rest” - Sabbath, in the above verse, is the same definition in that of Gen.
We you read on in Exo. 5:6- onward, we see the Pharaoh is upset that Moses want’s his people to have a Sabbath day rest and makes then work harder.
Even the “stranger”, non-Jew is to keep the Sabbath day/Saturday…(Isa 56:6) Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
written with love
R
Robbinson
Guest
Craig - I’m not sure what your point is.
The fact, from scripture, remains that while God blessed the 7th day - the commmandment to man to “rest” on the Sabbath did not happen until the mosaic law was given to the Jews on Sinai. That command did not exist before then.
In terms of the Sabbath commandment after Christ - its been pointed out (and you keep ignoring) that we keep the Sabbath in our eternal/perpetual rest in Christ (just as Adam and Eve were intended to have perpetual and eternal rest in, and fellowship with, God in the garden of Eden) - this occuring on the 7th day (in fulfillment of the commandment) and every day.
Blessings,
Brian
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BTTG
Guest
The command did exist before Sinai, I showed you in Exo. 5 that it already existed.
Brian, you are very intelligent person. no sarcasm. I really mean that. I will give you a few days to think over what I said. What the verses point out is that the Sabbath day was established during creation week, and thus before Mt. Sinai.
written with love
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adrift
Guest
[QUOTEThe command did exist before Sinai, I showed you in Exo. 5 that it already existed]
There was no command yet. It was used later to show why the commandment. You don’t have Noah observing Sabbath, Abraham his sons or grandsons observing Sabbath.
It is not mentioned while Abraham was in Egypt nor do you see Joseph keeping Sabbath. Your contention that Sabbath was kept from Adam on down is not borne out either in history or Scripture.
I believe you used this to show that the gentiles kept Sabbath but it doesn’t do that. I don’t think that there is any Scripture that says that the Non Jewish Christians kept Sabbath.
But all the Sabbath keeping in the Old testament is besides the point. What it comes down to is did the Apostles keep Saabath and did they have the authority to Change it. My above comments address that issue.
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Robbinson
Guest
Craig - no offense taken, however, but (i) I recall your earlier suggestion that God blessing the Sabbath in Genesis was evidence that the Sabbath was a command to man (but it was not, it was not given as a command for rest until Sinai; (ii) I recall your suggesting that the prohibition from collecting manna on the sabbath in the wilderness was evidence that the Sabbath existed before sinai (and I pointed out that to the contrary, it was evidence the command had not been given yet – otherwise God would not have had to instruct the jews not to collect manna on the sabbath - it was a forshadowing of the sabbath commandment to come at sinai and (iii) finally, I actually don’t recall you pointing to Exodus 5 - but having read that again, I see no reference there to a Sabbath or Sabbath rest - just pharo complaining that Moses wanted to take the jews to the desert to sacrifice to God to "rest from their labors’ - this has nothing to do with the Sabbath and we don’t even know if those days would have fallen over a Sabbath???
Blessings,
Brian
B
BTTG
Guest
Hi Brian,
In Exo 5, take a look at the Hebrew word for “rest”. The same Hebrew word for “rest” appears in the 7th day of creation week. Moses is making Israel keep the Sabbath. Making them rest from their works. (Exo 5:5) And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now are many, and ye ( Moses) make them rest from their burdens.
We read next that God had already given the Sabbath to Israel … " see that the Lord hath given you the sabbath" . Israel already knows that the Sabbath is to be observed, however, I believe Israel was not obedient to the Sabbath. (Exo 16:29) See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.
**You stated ** - I recall your suggesting that the prohibition from collecting manna on the sabbath in the wilderness was evidence that the Sabbath existed before sinai (and I pointed out that to the contrary, it was evidence the command had not been given yet – otherwise God would not have had to instruct the jews not to collect manna on the sabbath - it was a forshadowing of the sabbath commandment to come at sinai
My reply - The collecting of manna was God’s test to Israel. I believe prior to this Israel was not keeping the Sabbath day as God intended it to be. God is testing Israel, just like He tested Adam in the garden of Eden. God has tested His children throughout history with His commands already provided.
What do you mean by foreshadowing?
I am not sure if I asked you the question of why did God bless and sanctify the Sabbath day during creation week?
V
Vince1022
Guest
Not really. The Temple of Jerusalem was destroyed in the early 6th century B.C., and yet Jews continues do worship God. The Temple was rebuilt in the later 6th century, but still, Jews outside Jerusalem continued to worship God regardless.
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adrift
Guest
Please note that I did not say they could not worship nor did not worship but I said that they DID NOT worship as they ONCE did. They no longer had sacrificial worships. Today they still worship God but they do not worship the same way as when they had the Temple.
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adrift
Guest
Is a hint of what is to come.
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BTTG
Guest
with respect… message is for Brian
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adrift
Guest
This is a public forum it is not for you to carry on a private coversation.
If you have something to say to an individual member that is not of general interest to the board, use the private messaging system. Otherwise it is open to anyone who wishes to comment.
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