Commentary: Islam was a religion of love, and the Taj Mahal proves it

[MartinJordan]

If you are guiding me to understand, why would you ask me to post up the verses you recommended?

Now you want me to keep reading before sharing your understanding of what you asked me to supply…

This is an author of confusion Martin

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No idea where you’re going with this. I gave you advice and you took it first, which I appreciate you did, yet you can’t go beyond one part of Jesus words with the same question.

I’ve babied enough. The choice is yours to work it out.

MJ

 

[Servant19]

No idea where you’re going with this. I gave you advice and you took it first, which I appreciate you did, yet you can’t go beyond one part of Jesus words with the same question.

I’ve babied enough. The choice is yours to work it out.

MJ

Yes, indeed I worked it out. Here are my conclusions.

Some Christians (not all, I hope) believe that the one fold foretold by Jesus excludes all Muslims (and probably all Baha’is, Buddhists and Hindus, Sikhs, and Zoroastrians) which makes some Christians (not all, I hope) followers of their own desires rather than true followers of Christ. The exclusion of probably half the population of the human race from the “fold of God” is indicative that this statement made on page 5 of this thread:

True. The Biblical and NT definition of Love is much deeper.

…is unBiblical…

The Bible does not teach that it has superior ownership of love, and the exclusion of half the human race to this love, who refuse to profess the Nicene Creed…



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[Eric_Hilbert]

Return to the topic of the OP or infractions get handed out.

 

[MartinJordan]

Yes, indeed I worked it out. Here are my conclusions.

Some Christians (not all, I hope) believe that the one fold foretold by Jesus excludes all Muslims (and probably all Baha’is, Buddhists and Hindus, Sikhs, and Zoroastrians)

You’ve still not understood and making assumptions what he means when he’s not even finished speaking by stopping at half the verse.

which makes some Christians (not all, I hope) followers of their own desires rather than true followers of Christ.

I pray for you Servant that you’ll understand our Scripture one day.

The exclusion of probably half the population of the human race from the “fold of God” is indicative that this statement made on page 5 of this thread:

Which post are you referring to? Please be specific.

…is unBiblical…

The Bible does not teach that it has superior ownership of love, and the exclusion of half the human race to this love, who refuse to profess the Nicene Creed…

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I said deeper. Superior is your** own** understanding of the definition.

MJ

 

[Servant19]

You’ve still not understood and making assumptions what he means when he’s not even finished speaking.

I pray for you Servant that you’ll one day allow Jesus to speak.

[qiuote]
The exclusion of probably half the population of the human race from the “fold of God” is indicative that this statement made on page 5 of this thread:

Again nothing to do with John 10.

I said deeper. Superior is your own definition.

MJ

Lets get more on topic.

I’ve read all of John 10 multiple times, in English, with several translations, and my conclusions are made.

I have no idea what you make of John 10 and frankly, its quite tiring.

Lets get back on topic. Poor Eric

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[MartinJordan]

I’ve read all of John 10 multiple times, in English, with several translations, and my conclusions are made.

I have no idea what you make of John 10 and frankly, its quite tiring.

I’m doing my very best to defend Jesus because he died for me (a Gentile).

Lets get back on topic. Poor Eric

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No problem.

MJ

 

[Servant19]

I’m doing my very best to defend Jesus because he died for me (a Gentile).

No problem.

MJ

Dear beloved brother Martin

I speak to you here from the heart. I hear you with your defence and indeed you should defend Jesus. He died for you, He died for me.

Hand on my heart, I tell you, with my eyes welling with tears, heartfeltedly, I am not intending to attack anyone in CAF to warrant a defence. I am not attacking Jesus to warrant Him to be defended.

By my life! Again, with tears in my eyes, please consider that how you feel for Jesus and what He sacrificed for us, is the same feeling invoked in others for Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah for what they also sacrificed for us all.

I hope and pray that the sincere and heartfelt intention of this post is not seen in any other way than for what it is in its purity and in its vulnerability.

God bless you.

With love and prayers
Kam

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[dolphinlove]

Dear beloved brother Martin

I speak to you here from the heart. I hear you with your defence and indeed you should defend Jesus. He died for you, He died for me.

Hand on my heart, I tell you, with my eyes welling with tears, heartfeltedly, I am not intending to attack anyone in CAF to warrant a defence. I am not attacking Jesus to warrant Him to be defended.

By my life! Again, with tears in my eyes, please consider that how you feel for Jesus and what He sacrificed for us, is the same feeling invoked in others for Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah for what they also sacrificed for us all.

I hope and pray that the sincere and heartfelt intention of this post is not seen in any other way than for what it is in its purity and in its vulnerability.

God bless you.

With love and prayers
Kam

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As much as you would love for us Catholics to love all 3 as you do, we will always consider them false prophets as told in the bible. The most you can really expect from us is to respect you beliefs, religion & debate charitably.

God bless

 

[Servant19]

As much as you would love for us Catholics to love all 3 as you do, we will always consider them false prophets as told in the bible. The most you can really expect from us is to respect you beliefs, religion & debate charitably.

God bless

Thankyou dolphin love

God bless you

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[Reuben_J]

Allah manifests His love through His mercy, His justice and His forgiveness.

He shows His love through His Word which is recorded in the Holy Quran for the salvation of man.

He shows His love by guiding humanity towards His loving embrace and the Path of righteousness and humility.

Noted. Thanks Servant.

Just like a responsible master, He is merciful, forgiving and fair. He loves because he gave the Quran. He loves because he guides humans into the right path. Probably many people would do the same, given that situation.

Just a note – this love is quite different from how Christianity perceives love to be. But this is another thread.

Btw, you haven’t given me Islam’s definition of love, but you don’t have to, if it is too much in the asking.

What is elitist? Asking God to bestow love in your heart so that you may love your enemies?

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Because you said in your post, not this one, that the love is between Muslims only. What difference then, is that compared to the non-believers who also would love their own?

 

[worldcitizen]

My wife and I visited the Taj Mahal when we went to India many years ago and she is such a wonderful wife I would build her a Taj too so I understand how it does prove that love knows no boundaries and a Muslim can love just as much as anyone else and that beautiful building proves it.

I’m happy that this was brought up as often people forget that Muslims are people and know love too. But love is expressed in action here not so much in words.

The example of love invested by a Muslim proves that there is very deep and profound and eternal love within Islamic people. Often, when I have seen that building I have wished I could build one for my beautiful wife as she is so wonderful.

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[MartinJordan]

As a South Indian Tamil who’s heritage was Hindu but an Indian nonetheless visited the Taj Mahal as a child with my parents . Quite surreal no doubt was my experience. Although the guide said that through the ages people stole the gems that were embedded into the walls.

I suppose there are those who steal or perhaps through poverty they take the valuables.

Now as a Catholic since birth was taught that it was Jesus who must be loved more than anything else as he showed us the Father and being Creator give thanks always as he gave life so that we can have life, life to the fullest . Every person born is a gift from God who gave life. If one wanted to show Love they must love their wife as Jesus loves His Church but all honour goes to God. That is the True Love.

Buildings can decay but God is Forever.

MJ

 

[worldcitizen]

As a South Indian Tamil who’s heritage was Hindu but an Indian nonetheless visited the Taj Mahal as a child with my parents . Quite surreal no doubt was my experience. Although the guide said that through the ages people stole the gems that were embedded into the walls.

I suppose there are those who steal or perhaps through poverty they take the valuables.

Now as a Catholic since birth was taught that it was Jesus who must be loved more than anything else as he showed us the Father and being Creator give thanks always as he gave life so that we can have life, life to the fullest . Every person born is a gift from God who gave life. If one wanted to show Love they must love their wife as Jesus loves His Church but all honour goes to God. That is the True Love.

Buildings can decay but God is Forever.

MJ

Very true. The example of the love in building the Taj Mahal is how we should love God. With such intensity that we sacrifice all in His Path.

 

[JimmyDFG]

As a South Indian Tamil who’s heritage was Hindu but an Indian nonetheless visited the Taj Mahal as a child with my parents . Quite surreal no doubt was my experience. Although the guide said that through the ages people stole the gems that were embedded into the walls.

I suppose there are those who steal or perhaps through poverty they take the valuables.

Now as a Catholic since birth was taught that it was Jesus who must be loved more than anything else as he showed us the Father and being Creator give thanks always as he gave life so that we can have life, life to the fullest . Every person born is a gift from God who gave life. If one wanted to show Love they must love their wife as Jesus loves His Church but all honour goes to God. That is the True Love.

Buildings can decay but God is Forever.

MJ

Well said Martin

 

[JimmyDFG]

Is the Taj Mahal for the love of a mans favorite wife…or was for the love of allah or muhammad or islam?

 

[worldcitizen]

Is the Taj Mahal for the love of a mans favorite wife…or was for the love of allah or muhammad or islam?

I tend to think it was both.

 

[JimmyDFG]

I tend to think it was both.

It takes much more than a building/tomb to validate that a religion was about love

 

[Servant19]

Noted. Thanks Servant.

Just like a responsible master, He is merciful, forgiving and fair. He loves because he gave the Quran. He loves because he guides humans into the right path. Probably many people would do the same, given that situation.

Just a note – this love is quite different from how Christianity perceives love to be. But this is another thread.

Btw, you haven’t given me Islam’s definition of love, but you don’t have to, if it is too much in the asking.

Hi Reuben,

I often wonder what is the definition of love in Christianity if it is different to the Islamic definition of love.

Here are some Islamic definitions:

“You will not enter Paradise until you believe and you will not believe until you love each other. Shall I show you something that, if you did, you would love each other? Spread peace between yourselves.”

 Source: Sahih Muslim 54

None of you has faith until he loves for his brother or his neighbor what he loves for himself.

Source: Sahih Bukhari 13, Grade: Muttafaqun Alayhi

An-Nawawi comments on this tradition, saying:

 الأولى أن يحمل ذلك على عموم الأخوة حتى يشمل الكافر والمسلم فيحب لأخيه الكافر ما يحب لنفسه من دخوله في الإسلام كما يحب لأخيه المسلم دوامه على الإسلام ولهذا كان الدعاء بالهداية للكافر مستحبا والمراد بالمحبة إرادة الخير والمنفعة ثم المراد المحبة الدينية لا المحبة البشرية

This is interpreted as brotherhood in general, **such that it includes the disbeliever and the Muslim**. So he should love for his brother, the disbeliever, what he loves for himself which is his entering Islam, just as he should love for his brother Muslim that he remains in Islam. For this reason, it is recommended to supplicate for the disbeliever to be guided. The meaning of love here is an intention for good and benefit, and this meaning is religious love, not human love.

Source: Sharh Arba’een An-Nawawi 13

Be kind to your neighbor and you will be a believer. Love for the people what you love for yourself and you will be a Muslim.

  Source: Sunan At-Tirmidhi 2305, Grade: Hasan

Please share the Christian definition

Because you said in your post, not this one, that the love is between Muslims only. What difference then, is that compared to the non-believers who also would love their own?

Can you please show me which post I even hinted at saying that this love is between Muslims only?

Please read the quotes above especially the one where I have underlined and bolded the teaching given.

Hope that helps settle the dilemma for you

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[JimmyDFG]

Can you please show me which post I even hinted at saying that this love is between Muslims only?

Please read the quotes above especially the one where I have underlined and bolded the teaching given.

Hope that helps settle the dilemma for you

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On the authority of Abu Hurayrah (RadhiyaAllahu ‘anhu) who said: The Messenger of Allah (SallaAllahu ‘alayhi wasallam) said,

“Do not envy one another, and do not inflate prices for one another, and do not hate one another, and do not turn away from one another, and do not undercut one another in trade, but [rather] be slaves of Allah and brothers [amongst yourselves]. A Muslim is the brother of a Muslim: he does not oppress him, nor does he fail him, nor does he lie to him, nor does he hold him in contempt. Taqwa (piety) is right here [and he pointed to his chest three times]. It is evil enough for a man to despise his Muslim brother. The whole of a Muslim is inviolable for another Muslim: his blood, his property, and his honour.”

The word brother is used in two ways in Bukhari. The first meaning is an actual blood brother, sharing the same mother or father. The second meaning is another Muslim.

There are a total of 209 hadiths that refer to the word “brother” and of these 96 refer to being a blood brother. This leaves 209 – 96 = 113 hadiths about spiritual brotherhood.

“The believers are nothing else than brothers. So make reconciliation between your brothers, and fear Allah, that you may receive mercy.” [Al-Hujjurat, 49:10]

 

[ProdigalSun]

The Taj Ma Hal proves nothing about the Love in Islam. Ripping out the eyes of the builder certainly does however. Many popes have taught that all three Abrahamic faiths believe and worship the same good. THay have also taught at the same time that their understanding of God is incomplete (with the Jews) and downright corrupted and heretical (by Islam). Posters that only take a bit of what JPII and BVIX about this subject and ignore the rest are being disingenuous at best and deceiving at worst. Islam’s & Bahai"s understanding of God is so far removed form the truth of Catholcism that they appear as two different God’s but they get at least one thing correct, There is only one true God.

Peace!