Condemned before or after hearing the gospel of Christ?

[Reformed]

First of all, FAITH is a gift from God. One cannot ‘get’ Faith or ‘do’ Faith. It is a gift of grace. Sometimes a person can hear the word of God over and over and not understand it. However, one day, he or she finally gets an “ah-hah!” Once we reach this point, we are to do what we can for our sanctification with God’s help. Actually, none of us will know whether we are condemned or not (whether we hear the word of God or not) until the moment of death.

How are you able to love God and live a life of gratitude when you don’t know if God will be your eternal Heavenly Father, or your judge that will pour out His eternal wrath on you for your unforgiven sins?

What is this gift of faith? I believe faith has to have an object. What is your faith in? The demons believe and shudder.

 

[RobHom]

Please post the Catechism reference on how those who have not heard of Christ may be saved. I would like to compare this Sacred Tradition with Scripture. This goes beyond a theological debate on Catholic Answers Forum. This goes to the very core of Christ and Him crucified, the gospel proclamation, and eternity.

I thought you had all the answers! You said early that YOU were going to post this very the Catechism versus Scripture.

NOW, you are saying that someone else should do it???

Can you manage to be just a little more misleading and disingenuous?? Someone how the word “troll” is creeping into my thoughts where you are concerned…

 

[RobHom]

I am not a “universalist” by any stretch of the imagination, so I will express what I believe to be at issue and is part of the problem in dealing with “religion and scripture”.

Far too many people spend far too much time trying to be “literalists” and imbue excessive hyperbole to words. One has but to read the Bible or a writing of one of the ECF’s and its rather easy to discern that 30 or 40 words were used where 4 or 5 would have covered the point.

The word “condemned” is a rather strong and definitive word on its own, just like “depravity”. I think it unfortunate that many in the past found that it was necessary to expend so much time writing in hyperbolic terms…when far fewer words would have sufficed.

Just in the case of the two key words I used…the definitions of those words leave a nasty taste in the mind. They both imply total evil or the response to evil.

Frankly, one cannot be condemned for what they do not know, or never had the opportunity to know. God is not vicarious, nor does He have a sick sense of humor. To think that He condemns just because…is to embrace a false theology that is no more than a two legged stool unable to stand on its own.

 

[Reformed]

I am not a “universalist” by any stretch of the imagination, so I will express what I believe to be at issue and is part of the problem in dealing with “religion and scripture”.

Far too many people spend far too much time trying to be “literalists” and imbue excessive hyperbole to words. One has but to read the Bible or a writing of one of the ECF’s and its rather easy to discern that 30 or 40 words were used where 4 or 5 would have covered the point.

The word “condemned” is a rather strong and definitive word on its own, just like “depravity”. I think it unfortunate that many in the past found that it was necessary to expend so much time writing in hyperbolic terms…when far fewer words would have sufficed.

Just in the case of the two key words I used…the definitions of those words leave a nasty taste in the mind. They both imply total evil or the response to evil.

Frankly, one cannot be condemned for what they do not know, or never had the opportunity to know. God is not vicarious, nor does He have a sick sense of humor. To think that He condemns just because…is to embrace a false theology that is no more than a two legged stool unable to stand on its own.

This forum site seems to be a place for people to post their personal opinions as compared to growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. I’m not sure if your post can be supported in the Scriptures or Sacred Tradition. You seem to think that we should mediate on the words of Jesus. I agree, therefore, I created a thread called “Jesus Christ - Bible Study”. Please join us since you motivated me to start a Bible Study focusing on Jesus Christ as He reveals Himself to us in the gospel account of John. Do you really think I am a troll by pointing you to Jesus Christ through the Bible? Now, if you are not willing to go through the gospel of John together, then who’s the real troll on this site?

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=277468


Robhom or Reformed?

Can you manage to be just a little more misleading and disingenuous?? Someone how the word “troll” is creeping into my thoughts where you are concerned…

The Light of the Gospel

Therefore, having this ministry by the mercy of God, we do not lose heart. But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God’s word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone’s conscience in the sight of God. And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled only to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. For what we proclaim is not ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, with ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake. For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. - 2 Corinthians 4