Confused and a bit worried

[Potato1237]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations, Jesus (or Mary) give us prayers to pray. Jesus says to avoid vain repetitions. Also if these prayers can help save us and others, why is there no mention of this in the bible? There is no mention of private revelations even, let alone prayers like this. Also, why would Mary say at Fatima that only she could help us? I have read online that these are the work of demons. I hate to say it but almost makes sense paired with the fact that there is little mention of Mary being holy or any private revelations in the bible. I am a Catholic, so want to know these things to expand and defend my faith.

Does anyone know these questions.

Thanks,
A.J.

 

[po18guy]

Avoid non-Catholic sources! First. Last. Always. The web is a cesspool of hatred toward the Church which Christ founded.

VAIN repetitions. Vanity is to be avoided, but Jesus taught us one, single, solitary prayer. Are we supposed to offer it once in our lifetime? Of course not.

Read Psalm 136. Is that vain repetition? No. The same poor, misnfirmed souls who blather on about Catholic “vain repetition” do not hesitate to use the Lord’s name 50 times in a single prayer. Does He not hear you the first time you call upon Him? That is much closer to vain repetition.

If private revelations bother you, disregard them. They are not required, not binding upon the faithful or any Catholic - hence they are “private” Far better to seek to understand them first before entertaining doubts about them. The Church has done all the heavy lifting for you. If you cannot trust the Church, you have a crisis of faith.

Read Luke 1 and 2. Despite what modern bible translations may say, Mary is filled with grace. No room for any more. The Holy Spirit, via Elizabeth, calls her blessed in all generations - that is God speaking to us! Let him who has ears for hearing listen.

No mention of prayer’s power in the bible? AYKM? Read Tobit 12:12-15 and James 5:16 for but two examples.

This can go on and on, but the devil is tempting you away from our Lord in the Holy Eucharist. Resist him and he will flee from you (James 4:7).

 

[Potato1237]

Thank you for the clarification. I will try to expand my knowlage of the church. God bless!

 

[po18guy]

Thank you for the clarification. I will try to expand my knowlage of the church. God bless!

Dive into your faith and fall in love with Jesus Christ - especially in the Holy Eucharist. The Eucharist is the source and summit of our faith. Thus, to leave the Catholic Church for some other, I would have to walk away from - even deny - Christ. Love of Christ does not permit me to do that.

Once you are solid in your faith, you may comfortably engage non-Catholics. But, to do so now places your own faith at risk.

 

[1Lord1Faith]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations, Jesus (or Mary) give us prayers to pray. Jesus says to avoid vain repetitions. Also if these prayers can help save us and others, why is there no mention of this in the bible?** There is no mention of private revelations even, let alone prayers like this**. Also, why would Mary say at Fatima that only she could help us? I have read online that these are the work of demons. I hate to say it but almost makes sense paired with the fact that there is little mention of Mary being holy or any private revelations in the bible. I am a Catholic, so want to know these things to expand and defend my faith…

The Bible is full of private revelation. Half of the NT is based on St Paul’s revelations. What would you say of all the prophets in the OT?

Jesus rarely spelled things out, and He never indicated scripture, OT scripture, to be the end all be all. In fact, He did the opposite. He indicates the fallacy of following *all *of scripture literally, without opening up your mind and heart to God.

How many times does the author have to say Mary is full of grace? Or Blessed in all generations? That means sinless. Untouchable by evil. Forever.

 

[1ke]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations, Jesus (or Mary) give us prayers to pray. Jesus says to avoid vain repetitions. Also if these prayers can help save us and others, why is there no mention of this in the bible? There is no mention of private revelations even, let alone prayers like this. Also, why would Mary say at Fatima that only she could help us? I have read online that these are the work of demons. I hate to say it but almost makes sense paired with the fact that there is little mention of Mary being holy or any private revelations in the bible.

I am a Catholic, so want to know these things to expand and defend my faith.

You need to stay away from whatever junk you are reading or whoever you are talking to until you have a much more solid understanding of the Catholic faith.

 

[Lenten_ashes]

Greetings friend.

I’m going to link you to a library of free apologetic material about the Church from a scriptural POV:

biblechristiansociety.com/download

If you do not know the scriptures very well it’s easy to fall prey to well intended non-catholics who think they need to save your Catholic soul. They will point you to the bible, and that’s a good thing, but the bad news is that they are not a authoritative interpreter of it. You might find yourself unnecessarily leaving the Church over misconceptions, then finding your way back 20 years from now once you see the flaws of their formation. When all that can be avoided by simply learning our faith. That is something all of us should be doing from the 10 year old lay person to scholars. We never stop learning.

In regards to “vain repetition”, first of all this is a passage that is difficult to translate. The message being conveyed here is, don’t think you need to write a whole essay and explain things to our omnipotent God when He already knows all your needs before you pray. Jesus is saying you need a correct understanding of God…our God is not the pagan god who needs to be convinced by using a ton of words.

And Jesus was not against repetitious prayer because HE, HIMSELF, did it in the garden:

Matthew 26:44New International Version (NIV)

44 So he left them and went away once more and prayed the third time, saying the same thing.

AND, he gave us a model prayer in the Lord’s prayer.

In regards to apparitions, we are not required to believe in private revelation so if it bothers you just don’t believe in it.

 

[Catholic1954]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations, Jesus (or Mary) give us prayers to pray. Jesus says to avoid vain repetitions. Also if these prayers can help save us and others, why is there no mention of this in the bible? There is no mention of private revelations even, let alone prayers like this. Also, why would Mary say at Fatima that only she could help us? I have read online that these are the work of demons. I hate to say it but almost makes sense paired with the fact that there is little mention of Mary being holy or any private revelations in the bible. I am a Catholic, so want to know these things to expand and defend my faith.

Does anyone know these questions.

You should get a copy of the catechism and read it cover to cover. Private revelation is not binding. You can take it or leave it, the bible does not apply.

Thanks,
A.J.

 

[toaslan]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations… I have read online that these are the work of demons… the fact that there is little mention of Mary being holy…

Potato, you are getting some great advice already. Please notice something: you are making a choice already when you go to anti-Catholic sources for (name removed by moderator)ut about faith.

That is an important choice you are making. It is clear to me and to those who have already posted, that you are not well informed about the content of your faith.

Faith means two things: The content of the faith, and the act of faith. The content is the propositions our minds considers, such as God is Three in One. That is a proposition we can think about, and as Catholics we accept it as true. The Act of Faith is the movement of our will towards such ideas as towards goods. The will moves towards these things to embrace them as desireable and dear, as loved. We both know AND love our faith.

As faithful people we know what we believe, and we love what we believe.

The more you know, the more you will love your faith, and the happier you will be as a human being. You will also, as a side benefit, be more confident in explaining your faith to those who sadly do not believe. Most of that unbelief starts in misunderstandings–so don’t you start there too!

No matter your worldly goods, you are already rich. For you are born into the richest heritage in the world, for you are a child of the Catholic Church and as such you inherit all her rich 2,000 year old wisdom and goodness, and her 2,000 year old service to her Lord. Your parents, I presume, gave you this inheritance, and it is your place now to treasure these riches, explore them, and keep them unharmed to hand on in your turn.

 

[Potato1237]

Thank you all! God bless.

 

[Wesrock]

I just want to stress that the Church has reasons, scriptural and historical, for its beliefs and practices, and there is a lot of depth and richness to these beliefs. Catholic Answers has a lot of helpful materials in addressing the objections and accusations addressed against us. But the Church is both scriptural and historical.

It’s good that your interest has been piqued and it’s good to ask questions if you’re interested in learning. To be sure, when we say “avoid such websites” we do not mean that the Church doesn’t have answers to them (we do, and quite easily for the types of extreme and surface level accusations you’ve come across), but simply to stress that, at this point in your faith life, you delve into what the Church actually teaches and why instead of focusing on rather biased sources and accusations when you may not be at a point where you can begin to respond to them.

That was a run on sentence.

 

[BobCatholic]

VAIN repetitions. Vanity is to be avoided,

Agreed, and let me add to this.

“do not babble like the pagans do, for they think they will be heard by their many words” is one translation of Christ’s words and I like that translation.

First, they’re babbling. They’re saying words over and over, usually for hearing their voice. They think they hear their words so their god must also hear their words. That’s vain. Some say words that are not really words but just sounds, thinking they’re communicating. That’s vain.

But that’s not enough.

Second, the pagan gods don’t exist. They’re praying vain prayers, to someone that does not exist - and that’s vanity on top of vanity.

The problem is vainity, not repetition.

 

[zz912]

Agreed, and let me add to this.

“do not babble like the pagans do, for they think they will be heard by their many words” is one translation of Christ’s words and I like that translation.

First, they’re babbling. They’re saying words over and over, usually for hearing their voice. They think they hear their words so their god must also hear their words. That’s vain. Some say words that are not really words but just sounds, thinking they’re communicating. That’s vain.

But that’s not enough.

Second, the pagan gods don’t exist. They’re praying vain prayers, to someone that does not exist - and that’s vanity on top of vanity.

The problem is vainity, not repetition.

Yep. The pagans would stand in the public square and repeat the same prayers over and over, directing each one to a different “name” of a particular god, hoping that one of the names was the “correct” name of the specific god so that god would grant their petition. They would stand and make these prayers for hours. That is what He is referring to.

 

[zz912]

The Bible is full of private revelation. Half of the NT is based on St Paul’s revelations. What would you say of all the prophets in the OT?

Let’s not also forget that Paul explicitly mentions prophets and those speaking in tongues (and others who interpret) in the local churches he wrote to. NONE of these prophesies were made public, they weren’t written down, and they weren’t transmitted to the Church or other communities.

They were private revelation relating to those specific people or communities.

So there is a LOT of private revelation in scripture, or at least a lot of references to it. And Paul approves of it, but ONLY while it is under authority of the bishop and the Church and not to interfere with the Mass or public revelation.

 

[steve_b]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations, Jesus (or Mary) give us prayers to pray. Jesus says to ***avoid vain repetitions. ***

• Do Catholics Pray “Vain Repetitions?”
• The Rosary , prayers. Hail Mary & Our Father are from scripture

P:

Also, why would Mary say at Fatima that only she could help us? I have read online that these are the work of demons.

Always be careful to read from reputable web sites
P:

I hate to say it but almost makes sense paired with the fact that*** there is little mention of Mary being holy or any private revelations in the bible. ***I am a Catholic, so want to know these things to expand and defend my faith.

Re: Mary being holy

If one is full of grace they are also holy
Mary: “Full of Grace”

Re: private revelation,
The book of revelation, is a detailed revelation John had on the Lord’s day
beginning with Revelation 1:10 , till the end of the book
%between%

 

[Markie_Boy]

I’m wondering why in some private revelations, Jesus (or Mary) give us prayers to pray. Jesus says to avoid vain repetitions. Also if these prayers can help save us and others, why is there no mention of this in the bible? There is no mention of private revelations even, let alone prayers like this. Also, why would Mary say at Fatima that only she could help us? I have read online that these are the work of demons. I hate to say it but almost makes sense paired with the fact that there is little mention of Mary being holy or any private revelations in the bible. I am a Catholic, so want to know these things to expand and defend my faith.

Does anyone know these questions.

Thanks,
A.J.

What you are saying here makes simple sense.

I avoid repeated prayers, they are not helpful often for me other than thinking thru the Lord’s Prayer sometimes, as it is a great template for prayer.

I put no stock in private revelations - it’s not mandatory by any means - and I can find plenty of Biblical reason to avoid them.

Some things the church does really seem to conflict with scripture.

I am not a Sola Scriptura guy - but when teaching goes against scripture - I go with scripture.

 

[Church_Militant]

Reading the a-C websites again Potato?

These links should help…

• Is repetitious prayer bad?
• Vain Repetition
• The Rosary
• Do Catholics Pray “Vain Repetitions?”

 

[Church_Militant]

What you are saying here makes simple sense.

I avoid repeated prayers, they are not helpful often for me other than thinking thru the Lord’s Prayer sometimes, as it is a great template for prayer.

I put no stock in private revelations - it’s not mandatory by any means - and I can find plenty of Biblical reason to avoid them.

**Some things the church does really seem to conflict with scripture.

I am not a Sola Scriptura guy - but when teaching goes against scripture - I go with scripture.**

No… it does not, Markie. You don’t know your faith very well.

Feel free to open a thread and enumerate these alleged places where Catholic teaching “goes against scripture” because I’ve read the Bible through several times over and I sure haven’t seen it.

If repeated prayers are wrong then why did Christ Himself pray the same thing repeatedly in the Garden of Gethsemane?

 

[Markie_Boy]

Please - I did not say repeated prayers are wrong. They are not in and of themselves, and if you can do them with heart and mind, it’s OK. No argument, it’s just not for me.

As for revelations like Fatima, I think Galatians 1:8-9 gives us warning of such things.

Things like this are not clear where they are from, unless you take them at face value. The message is not clearly in line with scripture to me, as Acts 4:12 seems to not concur with Fatima.

The enemy is powerful and sly - I choose to not play with things like this.

I am not trying to be a n-C, but that is what I see.

Fact is - even the church does not dogmatically declare Fatima as essential as far as I know, nor do they demand repeated prayers.

A little liberty on things that are not clear, please?

 

[Lenten_ashes]

What you are saying here makes simple sense.

I avoid repeated prayers, they are not helpful often for me other than thinking thru the Lord’s Prayer sometimes, as it is a great template for prayer.

I put no stock in private revelations - it’s not mandatory by any means - and I can find plenty of Biblical reason to avoid them.

Some things the church does really seem to conflict with scripture.

I am not a Sola Scriptura guy - but when teaching goes against scripture - I go with scripture.

Hi Markie.

Jesus was ultimately saying the disposition of the heart is important, not babbling on and on like Pagans. The pagan “gods” needed long explanations, our majestic God does not.

Jesus gives us a model prayer in the Lord’s prayer. I don’t see him giving us this prayer if it were only intended to be prayed once in our life. Jesus also prayed the same thing three times in the garden.

Look at what’s happening in heaven…they are saying the same thing over and over and over:

Revelation 4:8New International Version (NIV)

8 Each of the four living creatures had six wings and was covered with eyes all around, even under its wings. Day and night they never stop saying:

“‘Holy, holy, holy

is the Lord God Almighty,’[a]

who was, and is, and is to come.”

This idea that saying the same prayer is wrong based on the vain repetition passage is a false protestant understanding of that passage. Once again they do not take into account the totality of the scripture and Church tradition that gave us said scripture.

I think you may be asked at some point to say a rosary for penance or in a group with RCIA folks. Hopefully it’s not a problem for you.

Personally, I’m not a big rosary person either, but I have no objection to it and will do it when necessary. And I frequently ask the blessed mother to pray for me.