Conservatives call on GOP leaders to step down

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livnlern said:
Funny that there was no mention of compromise when the Dems were pushing through on Obamacare.
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There wasn’t? I’m sure you’re right: the Republicans weren’t interested in compromise; they were totally focused on one goal - making Obama a one term president. How did that work out for them?
 
meltzerboy said:
I think the Obamacare package is in itself a compromise in that it doesn’t go far enough in providing universal healthcare.
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I was referring to Seekerz post regarding compromise between political parties. There wasn’t a single Rep vote for Obamacare.
 
Seekerz, late term abortionist George Tiller belonged to the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America. Maybe they support your views.
 
BroomWagon said:
Seekerz, late term abortionist George Tiller belonged to the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America. Maybe they support your views.
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I dunno. Do you know if they support trolling the internet insulting people?
 
BroomWagon said:
:confused:

Seems like you are saying the same thing as the post you quoted.

And let’s remember, those who voted for Obama made the uncharitable decision that some persons don’t have the right to live in this world since the Democrats are pushing late term, partial birth abortions along with having their million dollar fat cat abortion industry pals with players like Planned Parenthood.
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Please reread. There is an important distinction. Hans says, “…Rules him out by default…” This is not true, especially since abortion (intrinsic evil though it is) is an established right by law. People of informed conscience can still have difference in prudential judgment on how to address issues. Yes, abortion is still intrinsic evil but it is not immediately actionable as are other issues. It is not a simple as some would like to believe. That is proven since we have had “pro-life” presidents with no resulting change in the law.
 
Michael_Mayo said:
That is an overstatement. I did not vote for Obama but I do not place judgment on those who did. One can vote for him because of other lesser but more actionable issues in spite of his position on abortion. But they cannot vote for him *because *of his position on abortion.
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God places judgment, not man. One can vote for whomever they like, but not without consequences. Fr. Serpa’s answer put it plainly and is in line with all the documents when used in total and not cherry picked. So no, a Catholic who has a well formed conscience cannot vote for the pro-choice candidate without bringing accountability upon himself to be judged by God.

There are no proportionate reason to go around the listed intrinsic evils, this is what the Church has taught, is teaching and will teach forever.👍
 
seekerz said:
Thank you. Coming from someone who did not vote for Obama, maybe the truth will be more acceptable to those who find it hard to come to terms with.
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My friend, it is you who is lacking truth. Unfortunately it appears some like party and ideology more than truth.
 
Back on topic, more from Forbes:

forbes.com/sites/ralphbenko/2012/11/12/the-end-of-the-karl-rove-death-grip-signals-a-reagan-renaissance/2/

Economic growth and the equally important cultural, values, and civil liberties issues such as life, marriage, and religious liberty, are issues that were marginalized by the Bush Mandarins. Yes, the Mandarins were kind of mostly against tax increases and kind of for some tax cuts and sometimes for spending restraint, except when they weren’t. But the Mandarins were not obsessed with generating economic opportunity as was Reagan and his Revolutionaries. And the Mandarins proved far too squeamish to engage with the values issues which are both principled conservative and vote rich. But the elitist Mandarins, not the populist Revolutionaries, seized control of the party apparatus. And it was all down hill from there.
 
seekerz said:
There wasn’t? I’m sure you’re right: the Republicans weren’t interested in compromise; they were totally focused on one goal - making Obama a one term president. How did that work out for them?
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Yes Obama won. But he did it with smooth talking, scandalous ads and lies. And he was aided most unscrupulously by the main stream media.
 
Lapey said:
God places judgment, not man. One can vote for whomever they like, but not without consequences. Fr. Serpa’s answer put it plainly and is in line with all the documents when used in total and not cherry picked. So no, a Catholic who has a well formed conscience cannot vote for the pro-choice candidate without bringing accountability upon himself to be judged by God.

There are no proportionate reason to go around the listed intrinsic evils, this is what the Church has taught, is teaching and will teach forever.👍
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“The Church”? And which Church is that? 'Cause it sure ain’t the Catholic Church that I belong to. No, that Church instructs me to weigh the issues and vote MY very own personal conscience based on the morals it taught me.
 
Michael_Mayo said:
Please reread. There is an important distinction. Hans says, “…Rules him out by default…” This is not true, especially since abortion (intrinsic evil though it is) is an established right by law. People of informed conscience can still have difference in prudential judgment on how to address issues. Yes, abortion is still intrinsic evil but it is not immediately actionable as are other issues. It is not a simple as some would like to believe. That is proven since we have had “pro-life” presidents with no resulting change in the law.
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This is answered in this link:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=728672

Also, let’s not forget that in the case of voting for Obama, one is essentially voting for the Abortion Industry itself.

So it’s not a pass the buck type thing, abortions went down when Bush was in office.

Yes, abortion is actionable, it is one of 4 non-negotiables.
 
Lapey said:
My friend, it is you who is lacking truth. Unfortunately it appears some like party and ideology more than truth.
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Thanks for sharing. I will file that under: miscellaneous personal opinion garnered from the internet.
 
Carlan said:
Of course it doesn’t, where did I say it did?
We hate the sin ,however ,we never give up on the sinner!
I have a son, after he returned from Veit-Nam he put God on the shelf…my forever prayer for him is that God will bring him back prostrate at the foot of the cross of our Savior.My heart aches, but I trust God for him.

I have friends with sons and daughters who have given into active practice of their sin…their hearts ache with the prayer they have for them.

I know of women who have repented from the misery and regret of an abortion have been forgiven and I’ve prayed for them and rejoiced in their forgiveness.

We all hate the sin of those we love, but we do not hate them and give up on them because of their sin and and neither should we give up prayer and hope because of the sins of the President and other leaders of our country.
We pray for the redemption of all sin in the world.
In the world we will have trouble but remember what Jesus said , 'I have conquered the the world".
We are all called to pray not hate! Peace, Carlan
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No one here has said anything about hating people, nor has anyone show hatred to anything but the sins of all of us.

What was said is this, what good is it to vote for the representative of grave sin to office then pray for his conversion if there was a better option? That does not mean I or anyone will not pry for conversion of BO or anyone else for that matter. To conclude anything different is just presumptuous.
 
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