Contemporary music at mass

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Well the choir front and center is the Protestantization of the Church. Many Protestant Churches (not your high Anglican or Lutheran) have choirs at the focal center of the church. Music is the focus of the worship service. Actually not just music but an emotional response to the music.

If that is all that you have this might be fine. But, if you have the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass and the Real Presence of Jesus that should be the focus. The music should exist to enhance you offering the most pure and greatest form of worship.
 
And telling his listeners – the the EF is superior/offers more Grace/etc. etc. over the OF. A husband’s prayers are better than the wife’s prayers. Etc. etc . I wouldn’t call stuff like that – an “antidote” to toxicity.
 
My oldest was recently doing a lot of Renaissance music at her music lessons. Music people already know this, but the tune to “What Child is This?” is originally from a very secular popular song called Greensleeves, where the lover is complaining about his unfair treatment at the hands of his lady love. It’s basically a 16th century pop song.
 
Simplifying his statements and uncharitably interpreting them is toxic.

Fr. Ripperger makes clear both the EF and NO Mass have equal merit in so far as Jesus is offered in both. He simply says that more grace can be (not are necessarily) available due to other aspects of EF. The argument makes sense just as we could say certain prayers, like the Our Father, are better prayers in so far as it comes from Jesus Himself.

As for the husband and wife he says the husband, in so far as he is the head of the household and has authority, can have more effective prayers over the family. Catholic teaching is the Father is the head of the household. I’m sure he recognizes that individual holiness also matters. I’m sure he thinks the Blessed Virgin Mary’s prayers are more efficacious than St. Joseph’s.
 
Young Catholic converts see a very different church in practice to that which they have learned about in their conversion. The church, which in theory is the bastion of god’s revealed truth, is in modern times wishy washy with doctrine. The church that claims, in theory, to be a defender of traditional values, is in practice infected with like warm Catholics who hold none of these beliefs.

If you want to convert young people, the church should be the antidote to the modern world. I mean this very literally. The modern world is poisonous, and the church should act as the safe haven for troubled souls wondering through this troublesome age.
 
The church doesn´t defend traditional values, it defends christian values. They are independent of music styles or such minor things.
Seems you´re seeking a mental rock in a for you confusing world, what is not a reason to blame, but don´t think traditionalism is the answer. Belief is nothing linear that was stronger in the past. There are modern saints, modern martyrs, modern ways of vocation, even today.
 
whyeyeman said:
The church, which in theory is the bastion of god’s revealed truth, is in modern times wishy washy with doctrine. The church that claims, in theory, to be a defender of traditional values, is in practice infected with like warm Catholics who hold none of these beliefs.
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I suggest you read a book or two on Medieval reformers (like St. Francis) or Counter-Reformation reformers. It will do you a lot of good, and give you a sense of perspective.
 
exnihilo said:
He simply says that more grace can be (not are necessarily) available due to other aspects of EF. The argument makes sense just as we could say certain prayers, like the Our Father, are better prayers in so far as it comes from Jesus Himself.

As for the husband and wife he says the husband, in so far as he is the head of the household and has authority, can have more effective prayers over the family.
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Sorry – but no. Those are just his own erroneous beliefs.
 
whyeyeman said:
Are you a teen? Because I am…
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How good it is that you are drawn to Catholicism. Give thanks and praise to God!

In my parish a few years back, we had a teen who played the church organ masterfully (and sometimes played piano) at Mass. You would have enjoyed that.

As you get older (and wiser?) I hope you will see more beauty and grace in the world and in humanity. You are off to a good start with faith and reverence.
 
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Since Fr. Ripperger is a priest I think you are obliged to offer more than just he’s wrong. Why is he wrong?
 
Oh sorry, he is human first. Being a priest is not a protection against misunderstanding or having strange opinion…
 
No it isn’t, but if you are going to disagree then it is only right to say why. This is respect anyone should be given, not just a priest.
 
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exnihilo said:
Since Fr. Ripperger is a priest I think you are obliged to offer more than just he’s wrong. Why is he wrong?
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To say that that a husbands prayers are better – is giving the man a some type of “superiority” over the woman.
I have come across in certain toxic “trad” sites – the belief that – the man is created in the image of God-- the woman is created in the image of man. Giving the man “superiority” – and a woman’s purpose is to serve man.
INTERNATIONAL THEOLOGICAL COMMISSION
COMMUNION AND STEWARDSHIP:

Human Persons Created in the Image of God*
  1. The Bible lends no support to the notion of a natural superiority of the masculine over the feminine sex. Their differences notwithstanding, the two sexes enjoy an inherent equality. As Pope John Paul II wrote in Familiaris Consortio: “Above all it is important to underline the equal dignity and responsibility of women with men. This equality is realized in a unique manner in that reciprocal self-giving by each one to the other and by both to the children which is proper to marriage and the family….In creating the human race ‘male and female,’ God gives man and woman an equal personal dignity, endowing them with the inalienable rights and responsibilities proper to the human person” (22). Man and woman are equally created in God’s image. Both are persons, endowed with intelligence and will, capable of orienting their lives through the exercise of freedom.
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As to the “superiority” of the EF over the OF — I have not found any back-up from the Church – to say such “superiority” exists.
 
Walking_Home said:
To say that that a husbands prayers are better – is giving the man a some type of “superiority” over the woman.

I have come across in certain toxic “trad” sites – the belief that – the man is created in the image of God-- the woman is created in the image of man. Giving the man “superiority” – and a woman’s purpose is to serve man.
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I thought I explained it clearly. He says the husbands prayers have extra value because the husband is the head of the household. Do you disagree with the Catholic teaching that the husband is the head of the household? Or do you disagree that one in authority has that authority in prayer too? Because it seems so to me you have to disagree with one or the other. Lumping in other issues with no tie to Fr. Ripperger’s is an unfair and unwarranted condemnation.
Walking_Home said:
As to the “superiority” of the EF over the OF — I have not found any back-up from the Church – to say such “superiority” exists.
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What are your criticisms of Fr. Ripperger’s argument? Again, you aren’t interacting with what he said. You are basically just saying you don’t like his conclusion. You are free not to, but you can’t fairly say he is wrong if you won’t interact with his argument.
 
Isn’t the whole point of Christianity that mankind has been corrupted by original sin?
 
Splitting hairs. The “belief” that a husband’s prayers have “extra value” – is placing “superiority” of man over woman. It goes against that the woman – Is created in the image of God too.

As to the EF over the OF – his conclusions are his own.
 
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“I desire then that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling; likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire, but with what is proper for women who profess godliness—with good works. Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control.” - 1 Timothy 2:1-15
 
I see. So the whole Catholic Faith is wrong because it says the prayers of a priest, or a deacon, have extra power due to his authority. And the office being only open to men that is wrong.
 
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