Contraceptive mandate could face tough sledding in Supreme Court

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Dawnia said:
Emergency care is not free to people without insurance. The hospital will use all means to collect from the person that care was provided too including suing them in court. The idea that if you don’t have insurance, you won’t be billed is plainly false.
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Free health care is an absurd measuring stick.

Hospitals will attempt to collect from those who are able to pay. Whether or not someone is able to pay then becomes a question for the court to decide, assuming that the hospital doesn’t drop the matter on its own.

But clearly we are no longer discussing the availability of health care for the poor, which only a fool would deny. Now we are debating the financial hardships that hospitals and other care givers face.
 
pnewton said:
Ther is always a choice. They do not have to pay the fine. This would force the issue to the courts. Then they can close the doors and terminate all employees. This too is a preferable option than committing sin.
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Yup, it will force the issue into the courts and they’ll pay attorney fees which could dwarf the fines.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Yup, it will force the issue into the courts and they’ll pay attorney fees which could dwarf the fines.

Jim
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ANd end up closing their doors anyway. SO, they might as well be proactive and just close them ahead of time and rededicate that money to something more morally permissible. Unless, of course, you want to force doctors to provide medical care to people against their will using the force of law.
 
Will Catholics be willing to sell their souls in exchange for “free” health care?
We shall see.
 
I’m wondering if Catholics will be willing to cave in to Obama’s HHS mandate at t;he price of rejecting their Church.
 
I’m confused.

On one hand, I’m reading that the poor are the ones with no health care.

On the other hand, I’m reading that forcing everyone to buy health care will stop freeloaders on the system.

So if the poor don’t have the money to buy healthcare, how will they stop being freeloaders? Won’t they still be subsidized? Won’t it still be free to them?

I think what is really being said is that the gov is trying to enforce everyone having the same quality healthcare no matter if they pay big money or no money for it. That doesn’t appear to stop freeloaders to me, it just gives them a bigger ride.

I think the answer is more competition in the medical field. Do to medicine what was done to Ma Bell.
 
Scott_Lafrance said:
The problem is not “greedy insurance companies” only, it is also “greedy politicians and bureaucrats”.
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For what’s it’s worth, I remember, about 25 years ago, hearing a president of NOW say that the feminists didn’t understand why they weren’t getting much legislative success until a politician tipped them off that it was the insurance companies blocking them. The insurance industry didn’t want to pay for birth control.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
I want people to have access to health care, which is a basic right.

Just as people must have car insurance, so too they should have health-insurance so if the get sick or get into an accident, they won’t burden the rest of us who have purchased health insurance.

People who have no health insurance, become a burden to us all, and infringe on our freedom.

Jim
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You have already said that people who lack insurance can get care. So the notion that uninsured people do not have access to care is not accurate.

As a practitioner, I don’t mind taking care of uninsured people for a reduced fee, or for free if need be. I’m guessing there are a lot of other practitioners who are also willing to do this. So maybe this consideration will ease your worry that your uninsured neighbors will be a burden to you.

John
 
incense said:
The insurance industry didn’t want to pay for birth control.
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The insurance company would rather not have to pay for any of the claims, if they can legally get away with it and if they’re not making money. But then they’re not the ones providing the healthcare either.
 
incense said:
I’m confused.

On one hand, I’m reading that the poor are the ones with no health care.

On the other hand, I’m reading that forcing everyone to buy health care will stop freeloaders on the system.

So if the poor don’t have the money to buy healthcare, how will they stop being freeloaders? Won’t they still be subsidized? Won’t it still be free to them?

I think what is really being said is that the gov is trying to enforce everyone having the same quality healthcare no matter if they pay big money or no money for it. That doesn’t appear to stop freeloaders to me, it just gives them a bigger ride.

I think the answer is more competition in the medical field. Do to medicine what was done to Ma Bell.
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People will have to pay for health insurance according to their income.

Those under a certain income will have their insurance paid by the government.

This will prevent them from going to ER’s which is far more expensive than going to a doctors office, for common ailments.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
People will have to pay for health insurance according to their income.

Those under a certain income will have their insurance paid by the government.

This will prevent them from going to ER’s which is far more expensive than going to a doctors office, for common ailments.
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Or you could just setup a doctors office in the ER to care for common ailments. (Assuming that is the real issue, of course.)
 
Suudy said:
This is already the case. It is called Medicaid (and for the elderly, Medicare).
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Not exactly. There are many people who have no health insurance but don’t qualify for’medicaid and it varies from state to state.

If you have more than $2000 in the bank, you won’t qualify for medicaid.

The idea behind this reform is so people aren’t forced into dtitution, because they don’t have health insurance.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Not exactly. There are many people who have no health insurance but don’t qualify for’medicaid and it varies from state to state.

If you have more than $2000 in the bank, you won’t qualify for medicaid.

The idea behind this reform is so people aren’t forced into dtitution, because they don’t have health insurance.

Jim
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So it seems the problem is with the Medicaid qualifications. Why do we need Obamacare or a single payer system if we can tweak existing programs, such as Medicaid?
 
Suudy said:
So it seems the problem is with the Medicaid qualifications. Why do we need Obamacare or a single payer system if we can tweak existing programs, such as Medicaid?
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Medicaid was costing too much so the goal was to have the insurance companies contract with the various medical groups in controlling cost.

However, because both the insurance industry and medical profession are in fact “for-profit,” agencies, the system will only continue to get more and more expensive until we’re back to people not buying insurance because they can’t afford it, but don’t qualify for government assistance.

It’s why the single payer universal health-care system is all that will work.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
It’s why the single payer universal health-care system is all that will work.

Jim
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Socialized medicine will result in a decrease quality of care. The best and the brightest of the next generation will not all wish to be government employees after the commitment in education that is required. As with all too many programs to help those in need, the result is more equal healthcare for all, but it is done by lowering healthcare for most.

No, it is not the only thing that will “work”, whatever that means. The current system also works, after a fashion. We may well jump from the frying pan into the fire.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Medicaid was costing too much so the goal was to have the insurance companies contract with the various medical groups in controlling cost.
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Why are Medicaid costs so high? Nobody has address this.
JimR-OCDS said:
However, because both the insurance industry and medical profession are in fact “for-profit,” agencies, the system will only continue to get more and more expensive until we’re back to people not buying insurance because they can’t afford it, but don’t qualify for government assistance.
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The insurance industry makes a modest 2.2% (source). Even if the insurance industry became non-profit, would it drop costs enough?

The issue isn’t the “for-profit” nature of the medical industry. This issue is the costs of being in the medical industry. I posted earlier items that drive up costs. How about we address the actual costs of health care, rather than how to pay for it?
JimR-OCDS said:
It’s why the single payer universal health-care system is all that will work.
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No it won’t. A single payer system won’t do anything at all to address costs. The costs will be the same, but a different person will be writing the checks. The issue is costs, not payments.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Medicaid was costing too much so the goal was to have the insurance companies contract with the various medical groups in controlling cost.

However, because both the insurance industry and medical profession are in fact “for-profit,” agencies, the system will only continue to get more and more expensive until we’re back to people not buying insurance because they can’t afford it, but don’t qualify for government assistance.

It’s why the single payer universal health-care system is all that will work.

Jim
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I really don’t see the difference, except that everyone will be on a medicaid type structure. It certainly won’t be any cheaper, and in fact could become more expensive, as we have all heard the stories about the gov. contractors who over change the gov.

The person on medicaid actually is getting their services paid for by an insurance company. In my state medicaid is processed through at least 4 different health insurance companies that people can pick from. Medicaid itself only picks up the tab (for anything beyond premiums), before they get you enrolled in the insurance and for services that they cover but the insurance company does not. (So sometimes dental care and other procedures that the insurance company might not cover). So in essence, the government is paying for insurance for those who can’t afford it. (If you don’t qualify for medicaid, there are often state programs that cover the gap. (Like if ones income is too great for medicaid, but your employment insurance is not cost effective). In my state with my husband making 12/hr I qualified for insurance for $21 a month. In NY with my husband making 9/hr I qualified for insurance with no premium, though I did pay small co-pays for doctors (non prenatal) visits and medication ($2-$5 tops). Children under both of these states and income qualified for medicaid.
 
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