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Annunciata
Guest
You are right to remind us to pray… This “thing” has just hurt our beautiful Church so much that I guess I get too emotional when the things and people I love are hurt.
Satan never sleeps!!!
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Satan never sleeps!!!
T
Timidity
Guest
The more I think about it, the more I think that Mister Porter did not sin mortally, and thus these acts would not separate him from Heaven.
The actions definately involved serious matter, but to be conducted on such a large scale it seems to me that it would have to be a metal illness. That would have reduced the moral culpability.
Or maybe a demonic possession. I’m not sure if demonic possession reduces our culpability, but it seems that it would.
Maybe I find it hard to believe that someone could just be that willfully evil.
The actions definately involved serious matter, but to be conducted on such a large scale it seems to me that it would have to be a metal illness. That would have reduced the moral culpability.
Or maybe a demonic possession. I’m not sure if demonic possession reduces our culpability, but it seems that it would.
Maybe I find it hard to believe that someone could just be that willfully evil.
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Annunciata
Guest
Well Timidity, If you saw Shanley just standing there emotionless…no signs at all that he was sorry…you might re-think the statement you have just made…my pastor has even defended these men saying they are falsely accused!!!..Someone is in denial here…and it isn’t ME!!! I believe in God’s mercy totally…but some of these monsters think it’s okay!!!
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AmyS
Guest
Pedophillia is listed in the DSM-IV, the thing is pedophilles handle pedophillia differently and are differnent form eachother in some ways… In the meetings I go to with them once a month they are often asked what the percentage of chance they think they will reoffend is… They have to think about it… Some say 50%, some say 85%… some same 15% You and I would say 0% without hesitation… Some think these children want this from them, some don’t care what they want… Actually a lot of them don’t care.
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caroljm36
Guest
That’s what evil is! It is willful and knowing. Why are you trying to find an excuse for him? Believe me his defense attorney tried every legal escape hatch there was. Maybe it makes you feel better about your own charity but it says nothing about the reality of evil. Part of our charge as Catholics is to acknowledge that evil does exist and cannot be whitewashed by psychobabble. If it is a demon then it is evil by definition.
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Timidity
Guest
That could be very true. The purpose of my last statement, I guess, was to say that I find it personally hard to accept that anyone could be so intentionally evil. It’s just truly beyond my comprehension. The weakness is undoubtedly mine.
Yes, it is, though I’m not sure I’m willing to cede any moral authority to the APA.
I didn’t mean mentally ill in the strict clinical sense. I was referring to it in the true “lacks full consent of the will” sense.
Wishful thinking?
My complete inability to comprehend how someone could overcome all the pains of conscience necessary to actually do such a thing?
Perhap it’s a trick I play on myself to make forgiving easier…
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AmyS
Guest
I sure do agree with you on that, sorry for the misunderstanding… The APA has hosted conventition to discuss removing it. It is pure evil from what I seen…
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Brad
Guest
I think we have to separate the inclination towards and the acting out on that inclination.
If someone has an inclination towards pedophila, that would be a mental illness.
However, having this mental illness does not mean that the will is not controllable. Most pedophiles plot and plan and plan and plot for the ripe moment. At any point in this process, they could utilize their will to stop from going any futher.
If the will was beyond control (like the inclination towards may be beyond control w/o treatment and like a physical disability exists whether one wills it or not) then these predators would assault children in plain view. However, this is not the case - the process is usually much more methodical.
Many want to use the excuse of a “mental disorder” after they have done grave harm. Whereas they may indeed have a mental disorder, I don’t believe it always removes culpability, especially in cases such as this.
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shannin
Guest
Dear Brothers and Sisters,
I think that the priesthood attracts gay men. (I am not saying that all priests are gay.) I do think that gay Catholic men are attracted to the priesthood because it’s a way of escaping societal pressures to get married and have a family. Then, once they are in, they succomb to temptations because they never had the real calling in the first place. I’m told that the Church is becoming more selective in selecting candidates for the priesthood and that’s a good thing.
I am deeply saddened, embarrassed, **hurt **and, yes **angry **because of all the cover-ups and the amount of abuse that has obviously occurred. Catholic-haters read all the publicity and it gives them yet another reason to think that the Church is evil.
Many blessings,
Shannin
I think that the priesthood attracts gay men. (I am not saying that all priests are gay.) I do think that gay Catholic men are attracted to the priesthood because it’s a way of escaping societal pressures to get married and have a family. Then, once they are in, they succomb to temptations because they never had the real calling in the first place. I’m told that the Church is becoming more selective in selecting candidates for the priesthood and that’s a good thing.
I am deeply saddened, embarrassed, **hurt **and, yes **angry **because of all the cover-ups and the amount of abuse that has obviously occurred. Catholic-haters read all the publicity and it gives them yet another reason to think that the Church is evil.
Many blessings,
Shannin
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Franze
Guest
There are cases in protestantism and orthodoxy too, the problem isn´t celibacy, the problem is the free sex and all these theories, and the few discipline in the seminaries, greetings
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shannin
Guest
Hi Franze,
Please read my second post and see if you agree. I agree that the problem is not celibacy.
Shannin
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Franze
Guest
yes I am agree, read if you want my post in the thread about the condemn of that priest, I am ashamed because the church don´t change very deeply yet, greetings
S
shannin
Guest
Franze,
Not to change the subject, but how is the weather in Spain? :tiphat:
Blessings,
Shannin
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Lisa_N
Guest
Shannin, that is the basic philosophy in the book “Our Fathers” written by those Boston Globe reporters who broke the scandal in public. In the period when many of these priests were ordained, there was a lot more pressure to conform, marry, have kids. Those men who either had SSA or were simply confused and immature with respect to their sexuality were drawn to the priesthood for the ‘trappings.’ It is a profession of great respect, admiration, and authority and one of the few that would be open to a homosexual man. IOW in polite society, in those days, there was more likely prejudice against single men, not to mention those who might be effeminate or homosexual. This way they could stay single and no questions asked as to why. But as you said, these were men not truly called to the priesthood and thus very subject to the environment and temptations. It’s really not hard to see how this happened but what is inexcusable is not learning from this fiasco and being very selective of seminarians.
Lisa N
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Kevin_Walker
Guest
Lisa N:
It is unlikely that homosexuals are going to stop gravitating to the Catholic Church in the future, so standards will have to be strictly enforced.
The trouble is that homosexuals deny their disorder, form a secret society within the institution, and pretty soon you have homosexual priests ordaining homosexuals as priests. This is what has been happening in the American Catholic Church for decades. That is one of many reasons why zero tolerance towards homosexual Priests must be practiced.
Homosexual men tend to gravitate to any all male institution such as the military, celibant priesthoods, construction, police departments, or isolated all male occupations. The Buddhist monestaries of China and Korea have had sex scandals throughout their histories also.
It is unlikely that homosexuals are going to stop gravitating to the Catholic Church in the future, so standards will have to be strictly enforced.
The trouble is that homosexuals deny their disorder, form a secret society within the institution, and pretty soon you have homosexual priests ordaining homosexuals as priests. This is what has been happening in the American Catholic Church for decades. That is one of many reasons why zero tolerance towards homosexual Priests must be practiced.
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Church_Militant
Guest
No argument at all about his succumbing to temptation…
But to ignore that these consecrated souls are greater targets of the devil is naive to say the least dontcha think? To just look at the weight of scandal and offense that such do should tell us that we MUST pray all the more for our priests…to gain all the more graces and protection from God on their behalf. If they are to help shepherd our souls in the kingdom of God, surely we have a great responsibilty to “have their backs” in prayer in this spiritual warfare. This is part of Mystici Corporus…
Pax vobiscum,
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