Coptic (but strongly considering Maronite)

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I was hoping to have a dialogue with those of you who are Maronite or at least familiar with that Church.

I am a convert to the Coptic Church from Protestantism (I was influenced a lot by books like “Becoming Orthodox” when I was younger but did not go EO). I was married in the Coptic church. My wife also is a Protestant convert. (She actually was active Campus Crusade for Christ, much like those “Becoming Orthodox” folks).

I love my parish and would not leave it, the people there very much are like family. But unfortately I am looking at moving away from the area due to economic reasons (way to expensive here). I also realize that there have been some areas that we have not adjusted well to the Coptic church. (The Fasting is a bit more than we can handle. I sometimes have trouble attending services due to working irregular hours etc.).

By coincidence or providence, I noticed that the Coptic mission to the city I was most interested in moving to was in a Maronite parish which looked really neat. This peaked my curiosity and I began to study the Maronites. And I’ve becomed really enthused by what I’ve read. Even buying the Catechism “Captivated by Your teaching”.

I also realize I’ve had a bit of a change of heart. I was once a great Orthodox apologist. And even occasionaly argued with Catholics (my interactions were mostly friendly though, supporting them against Protestant Polemicists etc.). But I’ve mellowed. I’ve also become more concerned with living a basic life of Faith, Theosis, a life of repentance etc. then just arguing about who has the best or most exact doctrine. (My wife right now is trying to do that with me, because she is not in favor of East Catholic conversion). I also have been more on the page of Catholics on some issues. Like I love the idea of Ravenna and reunififcation and believe the Catholic church is doing the right thing by reaching out. While most Orthodox I know are skeptical and come acrossed like they would prefer to be schismated! (My wife defitely acts this way).

I also have been reading a lot Catholic apologetics and doctrinal materials as far as getting comfortable and familiar with positions. And also really like a lot of the answers I get from hot button issues like the philoque, Peterine Primacy etc. And actually have studyied often to supply an answer to my wife who is constantly looking to debate me when the issue of future East Catholic conversion comes up.

Anyway I thought I would post this thread and get to know some of you and hopefully learn some more useful information. 🙂
 
By the way I forgot to mention I have Syriac Church experience. I was once in a Protetantized church that had apostolic lines to the Assyrian church of the East. And used a mostly english Liturgy of Addai and Mari…

There are also is a Chaldean church very close to where I live.

Unfortately I’m not that fond of the chanting of that rite. And some of those parishes seem very ethnic. And I might be out of place there. The Marionites parishes I’ve looked at are well attended by non Maronites, and quite overtly friendly.
 
I’m Eastern Orthodox (ACROD) and mostly have experience with the Carpatho-Rusyn (Ruthenian) traditions, but I have been to several other churches, and have discussed other Eastern churches with Eastern and Eastern-minded friends, both Catholic and Orthodox.

I have not attended a Coptic Orthodox Divine Liturgy. I have read about and communicated with some Oriental Orthodox, but I am not extremely familiar with specifics. What I do know, however, is that the Copts are of a different rite than the Maronites. The Maronites have a Liturgy, but they call it the Qurbono (it is spelled differently). The Maronites boast that they historically never have left communion with the Roman see.

My limited experience with the Maronites has been in going to the National Maronite Shrine in Youngstown, OH, where I took part in a Qurbono. Several things I noticed: no iconostasis, a lamb depicted on the front of the altar, a St. Therese of Lisieux (sp.) statue to one side of the sanctuary, and I believe a St. Joseph statue on the other side. There was a large Sacred Heart of Jesus painting in the narthex. Many Maronites still live in their native Lebanon. The French, who at one time resided there, have had a large impact on Maronite life, and so the end result is an interesting amalgam of Maronite and French spiritual and theological traditions. I would venture to say that the Maronites are the most “Latinized” of the Eastern Catholic Churches (you can debate yourselves on this one).

There is a Coptic Catholic Church (and I believe there once was a member on CAF of this Church) but it is very small relative to the other Churches.
 
The Maronites are awesome. If you do end up going, you’re in good hands.

St Maroun, pray for us!
St. Ephrem, pray for us!
Our Lady, Queen of hearts, pray for us!
 
Mardukm is our resident Catholic Copt, raised Coptic Orthodox. He’s very busy right now, but it might be worthwhile dropping him a line. 🙂

May God bless you in your journey!
 
Addai said:
I was hoping to have a dialogue with those of you who are Maronite or at least familiar with that Church.

I am a convert to the Coptic Church from Protestantism (I was influenced a lot by books like “Becoming Orthodox” when I was younger but did not go EO). I was married in the Coptic church. My wife also is a Protestant convert. (She actually was active Campus Crusade for Christ, much like those “Becoming Orthodox” folks).

I love my parish and would not leave it, the people there very much are like family. But unfortately I am looking at moving away from the area due to economic reasons (way to expensive here). I also realize that there have been some areas that we have not adjusted well to the Coptic church. (The Fasting is a bit more than we can handle. I sometimes have trouble attending services due to working irregular hours etc.).

By coincidence or providence, I noticed that the Coptic mission to the city I was most interested in moving to was in a Maronite parish which looked really neat. This peaked my curiosity and I began to study the Maronites. And I’ve becomed really enthused by what I’ve read. Even buying the Catechism “Captivated by Your teaching”.

I also realize I’ve had a bit of a change of heart. I was once a great Orthodox apologist. And even occasionaly argued with Catholics (my interactions were mostly friendly though, supporting them against Protestant Polemicists etc.). But I’ve mellowed. I’ve also become more concerned with living a basic life of Faith, Theosis, a life of repentance etc. then just arguing about who has the best or most exact doctrine. (My wife right now is trying to do that with me, because she is not in favor of East Catholic conversion). I also have been more on the page of Catholics on some issues. Like I love the idea of Ravenna and reunififcation and believe the Catholic church is doing the right thing by reaching out. While most Orthodox I know are skeptical and come acrossed like they would prefer to be schismated! (My wife defitely acts this way).

I also have been reading a lot Catholic apologetics and doctrinal materials as far as getting comfortable and familiar with positions. And also really like a lot of the answers I get from hot button issues like the philoque, Peterine Primacy etc. And actually have studyied often to supply an answer to my wife who is constantly looking to debate me when the issue of future East Catholic conversion comes up.

Anyway I thought I would post this thread and get to know some of you and hopefully learn some more useful information. 🙂
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I love the Maronite rite, my wife is Lebanese and her family has introduced me to it (in addition to the Catholic Church itself) - her brother is a Maronite monk infact - and if you are anywhere near the MA. area, you may consider a retreat to the Maronite Monks of Adoration, Most Holy Trinity Monastery- I am sure they would be happy to talk to you.

maronitemonks.org/Mhtm.htm

Peace
 
theguidedheart said:
I love the Maronite rite, my wife is Lebanese and her family has introduced me to it (in addition to the Catholic Church itself) - her brother is a Maronite monk infact - and if you are anywhere near the MA. area, you may consider a retreat to the Maronite Monks of Adoration, Most Holy Trinity Monastery- I am sure they would be happy to talk to you.

maronitemonks.org/Mhtm.htm

Peace
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I’ve been there and this place is truly holy and the priests and monks there are incredible. If you go, be sure to meet Fr. John Marie, he’s a brilliant; a true man of God.

Here are some pictures.
 
Madaglan:
Several things I noticed: no iconostasis
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Sometimes the EO seem to have a tendency to equate Eastern Christianity with the Byzantine tradition. The Maronite Church comes from the Syriac tradition and thus would not and should not have an iconostasis.
 
Ghosty said:
Mardukm is our resident Catholic Copt, raised Coptic Orthodox. He’s very busy right now, but it might be worthwhile dropping him a line. 🙂

May God bless you in your journey!
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Thanks! Is that name Egyptian? I’ve met hundreds of Egyptians in the last few years and of course read through the Sinaxeron a number of times (book of saints) and I’ve never heard that one…
 
theguidedheart said:
I love the Maronite rite, my wife is Lebanese and her family has introduced me to it (in addition to the Catholic Church itself) - her brother is a Maronite monk infact - and if you are anywhere near the MA. area, you may consider a retreat to the Maronite Monks of Adoration, Most Holy Trinity Monastery- I am sure they would be happy to talk to you.

maronitemonks.org/Mhtm.htm

Peace
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Yes I’ve seen that place before online. Its out of my way, being out in California, and looking at central texas, but if I ever go out that way I will have to look you folks up. Right now I am going to go on vacation in a few weeks to far north Pennsylvannia and have tentative plans to visit the parish in Olean, New York which is only a half an hour away from my inlaws.
 
Addai said:
Yes I’ve seen that place before online. Its out of my way, being out in California, and looking at central texas, but if I ever go out that way I will have to look you folks up. Right now I am going to go on vacation in a few weeks to far north Pennsylvannia and have tentative plans to visit the parish in Olean, New York which is only a half an hour away from my inlaws.
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Actually, its in Petersham, MA. I went and I live in San Diego. Well worth it!
 
Chaldean_Rite said:
You might be interested in this:
kaldu.org/3_chaldean_culture/TheAnaphora_ApostlesAddai_Mari.html

The structure of one of the Maronite Anaphoa of Peter III is compared to the Chaldean one.
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Hey Chaldean this church is right next to me.

martmaryamchurch.org/index.htm

I have a friend who is a priest in an Assyrian COE off shoot (basically combining Assyrian COE with Charismatic Protestantism). Anyway he is interested in checking this place out. I intend to go with him if I can find a way to squeeze it in my schedule (if they evening services for instance). A number of years ago I visited the Assyrians back when I was a member of his Church. That was bishop Soros church at the time. We did not get such a warm welcome. They did not want us joining them because they were in the middle of their reunification talks and were afraid outsiders could mess it up… 😦
 
Addai said:
San Diego cool. There a number of Assyrian / Chaldeans down there aren’t there? Are you familiar with Paul Younan of Peshitta.org? I understand his Assyrian church is in your neck of the woods.
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2nd to MI, we are the largest community in the US.

I have been to that website, but I don’t know Mr. Younan personally.

As far the Assyrian Church, I don’t know if you heard this news.
 
I’m a Maronite Catholic in Australia. Some people criticize it because it is too latinized. But I think it’s a cool way to practise Eastern Catholicism in a western society.

Are you currently orthodox? Do you mind converting to catholicism?
 
Charlie_Zeaiter said:
I’m a Maronite Catholic in Australia. Some people criticize it because it is too latinized. But I think it’s a cool way to practise Eastern Catholicism in a western society.

Are you currently orthodox? Do you mind converting to catholicism?
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I haven’t been that crazy of Latinization in the past, but I like a lot of the Latinization of the Marionites and Armenian Apostolic Orthodox Church.

Yes I’m curently Orthodox and seem to be pretty much on board with converting. One of the encouraged things was reading “Captivated by your teaching” as well as some web sites like this

stmaron.org/spirituality.html

The Maronites have so much of the Spirituality that I love about Orthodoxy as well as what I also admired about the Assyrians.
I also have to say I like some of the rammifications that have come out of things like Vatican II and how the Maronites have adapted it.
 
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