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Jeanne_S
Guest
Your snarky jabs at the president are not productive.Feel free to give him a call if you think you can handle this better.
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dscath
Guest
LOL…Jeanne…every criticism of your hero is a snarky jab in your eyes.
I’m not taking jabs…I have on several occasions said he’s doing the best he can, its just that his best is not up to the standards of the office.
He’s an excellent hotel and golf course owner, and reality TV star, and even politician, but a dreadful leader and not even on the scale of being a statesman, which is needed, expected, and deserved by Americans.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Cant wait to see how slow Joe handles this crisis if God forbid he gets elected. Walk a mile from Trump’s shoes befor you castigate him for incompetence. I thankful he is the president right now cannot fathom what the D ms would be doing currently
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dscath
Guest
LOL…you and 43% of other voters in America…Let’s talk on November 4th, Jeanne.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Sure just like four years ago when HC was a shoe i n
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choose_to_love
Guest
Good day, Leaf,
Is the issue Doc’s use of “most”? Weren’t there something like 30 million unemployment claims since mid-March (going from memory here)? Isn’t the point the same whether it is “most” or thirty plus million and growing if the lockdowns are extended?
Also, upthread you stated that it is a ‘crazy myth’ that isolating does not prevent death but only postpones it. What do you meant by that?
Is the issue Doc’s use of “most”? Weren’t there something like 30 million unemployment claims since mid-March (going from memory here)? Isn’t the point the same whether it is “most” or thirty plus million and growing if the lockdowns are extended?
Also, upthread you stated that it is a ‘crazy myth’ that isolating does not prevent death but only postpones it. What do you meant by that?
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
There is no question that the economic impact is immense. But if those with jobs helped out those without jobs, we could all get through this.
Some people have been saying that eventually everyone is going to be infected. In the first place, that is not true. Even at the height of the polio epidemic, just before the vaccine, only a certain fraction of the population contracted polio. Now I realize that cover-19 is a lot more infectious than polio, and probably a larger fraction of the population will eventually be infected. But the size of that fraction can be affected by isolation measures. With aggressive testing and contact tracing, it is possible to limit the number infected. And the longer we survive, the better the chances for a treatment or a vaccine. That translates into people whose death from cover-19 has been prevented, not just postponed. (I assume the poster was not referring to the eventual death that we all must suffer because we are mortal. In that sense death can only be postponed, but I don’t think he was talking about that.)
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choose_to_love
Guest
"but if those with jobs . . . " Great chance for subsidiarity to be put into practice, eh? We are specifically holding on to our stimulus payment so that we can use it to help those who are out of work - - we were thinking of getting a bunch of prepaid supermarket cards and giving them to our pastor to distribute as he sees fit. The only caveat is that I am not sure yet that my position will remain if lockdowns continue indefinitely, which seems less likely all the time.
“eventually everyone will be infected . . .” OK, I think I understand your point. I think one of the original justifications for the extreme lockdowns was that it was needed (primarily?) to prevent hospitals from being overloaded, and to spread out the incidence of those sick enough to need hospital care over time so that there was sufficient hospital capacity. IMO, both positions are relevant; that is, isolating was primarily about spreading out the impact initially, and it will also lead to fewer infections/deaths in a broad sense. However I think it is still a question of what happens when restrictions are lifted.
You mentioned the testing/tracing - - you have a good head on your shoulders, what is your preferred method(s) of addressing the pandemic? If Leaf was in charge, what would we be doing?
“eventually everyone will be infected . . .” OK, I think I understand your point. I think one of the original justifications for the extreme lockdowns was that it was needed (primarily?) to prevent hospitals from being overloaded, and to spread out the incidence of those sick enough to need hospital care over time so that there was sufficient hospital capacity. IMO, both positions are relevant; that is, isolating was primarily about spreading out the impact initially, and it will also lead to fewer infections/deaths in a broad sense. However I think it is still a question of what happens when restrictions are lifted.
You mentioned the testing/tracing - - you have a good head on your shoulders, what is your preferred method(s) of addressing the pandemic? If Leaf was in charge, what would we be doing?
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pnewton
Guest
Thanks be to God our diocese is now allowing Mass, under safe guidelines. I wish all these businesses that were opening were equally careful. More to the point, their customers are the ones that need to exercise more caution. The coming rebound, if I am right, will be due to selfish human behavior.
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pnewton
Guest
One man’s snark is another’s legitimate concern. I know it is easy to blanket criticize something, like either the president, or anyone who dares to disagree with him. I too think he has done an atrocious job of leading the country due to his innate character and level of intelligence. We have lost a lot of precious time.
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Zzyzx_Road
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ZeroHedge
ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero
www.zerohedge.com
Talking about the 1957 flu pandemic. US population that year: 177m.
No vaccine then, nothing shut down, business went on as usual. Those people had a lot more gumption than we do.
My grandmother doesn’t remember a thing about this pandemic. She says polio was the concern on everyone’s mind in those days.
Closing quote from the article:
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Actually Trump is plenty intelligent. However I forgot,noRepublican president is ever that bright.Ya know Reagan the amiable dunce,GWB ,inarticulate and just not that bright…
Time get old SlowcJoe into office he will cure this virus at the same time he cures cancer,he promised,ya know
Time get old SlowcJoe into office he will cure this virus at the same time he cures cancer,he promised,ya know
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pnewton
Guest
That is an assessment I completely disagree with, based only on his own communications, actions, and thought processes.
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LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
I didn’t say that you personally had to carry the whole country on your back. But if enough people cooperate, it could be done.
That’s what I heard too.
Sometimes it is all we can do to solve today’s problems without having a solution for the problems of tomorrow.
If I were in charge the first thing I would do is find someone smarter than me and put him or her in charge.
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SugarMagnolia
Guest
Everything only postpones death, not prevents it. Death comes to every living thing eventually. Most living things try to postpone death for as long as possible.
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SugarMagnolia
Guest
Gumption will not save you if the virus inflames your lungs and makes it impossible to breathe.
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Vanny
Guest
I take this virus seriously.
But it could be years before we have a vaccine if ever.
It took five years to get a polio vaccine.
We still don’t have an Aids vaccine although after 35 years we do have treatments that have prolonged and improved the quality of life for those that have contracted it. We are used to living in an age where communicable diseases all have vaccines.
Keeping things shut down until we have a cure or a vaccine is not realistic in any way.
We won’t have a country or an economy left. We are going to have to re-open carefully, incrementally, making sure that vulnerable people are protected. And keeping an eye on outbreaks. Some states like New York may have to wait. Others can open now.
I do not share Trumps optimism regarding having a vaccine at the end of the year.
And while I am not an anti-vaxxer at all(I get my flu shot annually) some people are not going to want
to take a vaccine which has been rushed out, just like in 1976 with the Swine Flu vaccine which was rushed out and caused some bad side effects.
But it could be years before we have a vaccine if ever.
It took five years to get a polio vaccine.
We still don’t have an Aids vaccine although after 35 years we do have treatments that have prolonged and improved the quality of life for those that have contracted it. We are used to living in an age where communicable diseases all have vaccines.
Keeping things shut down until we have a cure or a vaccine is not realistic in any way.
We won’t have a country or an economy left. We are going to have to re-open carefully, incrementally, making sure that vulnerable people are protected. And keeping an eye on outbreaks. Some states like New York may have to wait. Others can open now.
I do not share Trumps optimism regarding having a vaccine at the end of the year.
And while I am not an anti-vaxxer at all(I get my flu shot annually) some people are not going to want
to take a vaccine which has been rushed out, just like in 1976 with the Swine Flu vaccine which was rushed out and caused some bad side effects.
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Dr_Meinheimer
Guest
Our society is a far cry from the men who were alive then. Look at the cries and weeping that go on here about things that were accepted far more readily in the past. We lost whatever edge we had as Americans a long time ago.
Emeraldlady
New member
Follow the model of Italy and Spain in so far as full lockdown until the infection rate is under control and slowed right down and then reopen bit by bit in 2 week increments (the time between infection and symptoms). But those countries are saying that life can never resume as before until a vaccine comes.Emeraldlady:
Are you saying we should isolate until we have a cure or vaccine?Jeanne_S:
I can tell you, we aren’t pointlessly waiting it out. We are waiting for a vaccine or cure which will inevitably come.
@Emeraldlady
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Jeanne_S
Guest
A vacinne may never come,then what?
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