Corporal punishment, tips on how to raise children

[Debora123]

A couple people have also emphasized the importance of setting a good example to your children at all times… in the way you treat people, in what you say, and in the way you handle anger0stress.

I thought that was very good advice too. It seems like setting a good example would be a very basic thing, but honestly I hadn’t even thought about that. And I’m sure a big part of the problem is that a lot of other parents don’t either…

 

[styrgwillidar]

Pain is the immediate goal with “spanking.”

Again, no. The goal is a well-behaved, disciplined and safe child. That is the goal. Just like immunity to an illness is the goal of a vaccination. The pain is inherent in the process. If corporal punishment works for a child you only actually have to spank them a couple of times. It is knowing that spanking will be the consequence that continues to enforce discipline. That is, they modify their behavior to avoid the negative consequence. It is no different from a child who hates time-outs being compliant to avoid the time-out.

The goal is not to spank, the goal is to have the kid be obedient enough that you can keep them safe and out of trouble. Unfortunately, some kids seem to be more responsive to physical discipline than time-outs or reasoning or rewards. I’d rather reward good behavior than punish bad behavior. Again, my kid was never surprised by a spanking. She knew what she needed to do to avoid it. Her choice, there were clear and consistent consequences. My other kids were responsive to other methods.

Frankly, I’ve seen some parents using mind games, guilt trips, and verbal harassment that was far more abusive on a long term scale than two swats to the butt. Like, " stand over there away from me until you can behave, I don’t want people thinking you’re my child." or “I wish XXXX was my kid instead of you, why don’t you behave like them.” “I wish you weren’t my kid” “You’re no child of mine” “Why must you always embarass me? What’s wrong with you?”

 

[styrgwillidar]

I can totally relate to Pollynova b/c she comes from a childhood of abuse and she feels very protective of other children. It’s only natural for her to feel this way.

Pollynova is an amazing young woman and I admire her very much.

I agree with everything you wrote above btw…my son is the same. All I have to do is say no to my daughter.

Pollynova,

I was not aware of your background, I’m glad you are providing your perspective and do respect your (name removed by moderator)ut. We learn much of how to treat our kids by our parents example. My Dad was probably the most fair and just man I ever knew. I got spanked by him, but never insulted by him. I was never surprised by a spanking, every time I got one I had knowingly violated a rule where the consequences were clear. And I’ll freely admit, it was a calculated risk I took on my part. If I violate the rule,

• The consequences will be a swat to the butt, probably time-out for a while, apology,
• Chances of getting caught-- estimate at 50% or less
• Do or don’t do?

My sister once lied to my Dad saying I had hit her when I hadn’t. It was the only time I can remember that he wouldn’t listen to my side or believe me. I forget why she did it, I wasn’t even angry with her proir to her lying. But when he wouldn’t listen, I walked over and belted her right in front of him out of a sense of injustice. I was far more hurt at the injustice, his not listening than a swat or two.

As a consequence, whenever my kids were/are squabbling and I didn’t witness what happened or how it started, I don’t hold court or play detective. I don’t believe one over the other unless there’s some kind of definitive objective proof of events. For example, if there’s a fight over the tv or an object- Dads’ solution is to remove it from the equation. They can either come to an equitable arrangement themselves, or nobody gets it. I’m not Solomon.

kind of off-topic story but–
I don’t punish kids for honest mistakes, but I might over incidents where they knew better, a la you can’t plead you didn’t mean to break a lamp if you were throwing a football in the living room.
(My son has a bit of OCD, for a while he couldn’t stand to have any damp clothing. If he would get a little water on a T-shirt while washing his hands, he’d get the hair dryer and blow dry it) my son came to my at 8, told me I was gonna be real mad and he was sorry. I asked him what was up? He said I had to promise not to get mad at him because he was scared, and mom was gonna be real angry. I won’t make promises I might not be able to keep so I told him I might get upset, but I’d get over it since he was being honest. Hesitating he led me over to the ‘good’ couch. A T-shirt was draped over the couch arm. He gulped as he looked at me, then removed the shirt. Underneath was a big melted hole in the fabric on the couch arm. I just couldn’t stop laughing. He was surprised, said “I’m sorry- but, it’s ok?” “Well”, I said, “not ok but we’ll deal with it”. “Mom’s gonna be mad, do I have to tell her now?” " Nope kid, I got this one. Mom’s gonna get a new couch out of it". How do you punish a kid for not knowing the difference between the natural cotton shirts he’d used a blow dryer on a hundred times, and the non-natural that melted. He’d draped the shirt over the couch arm to dry it instead of on a towel rack in the bathroom he’d normally used. How was he supposed to know, I’d never told him. We did have a good chat about that showing why firemen, race car drivers and military pilots etc. never wear nylon or synthetic materials that melt vice burn. Just stuff like cotton, wool and nomex.

ETA: as I’ve said. I never had to spank my middle daughter. Yet my eldest has never even mentioned it. No- how come you never spank her? No- you must like her better she never gets spanked. Even my eldest can see that they each have different approaches to me, different attitudes and behaviors warranting different treatment in return.

 

[Debora123]

Frankly, I’ve seen some parents using mind games, guilt trips, and verbal harassment that was far more abusive on a long term scale than two swats to the butt. Like, " stand over there away from me until you can behave, I don’t want people thinking you’re my child." or “I wish XXXX was my kid instead of you, why don’t you behave like them.” “I wish you weren’t my kid” “You’re no child of mine” “Why must you always embarass me? What’s wrong with you?”

My mom is a great mother and I a great person, but we all make mistakes.

I remember once when I was maybe 5 years old and my mom took me and one of my friends to the pool. My mom was impressed at how independent/mature my friend was, and how she did everything herself… dried herself and combed her own hair and got changed quickly.

Later that day, when we were home and my friend was gone, my mom got upset/frustrated with me for some reason that I can’t remember, and she said something like “Why can’t you do things quickly and by yourself like your friend? She doesn’t need a mom pushing her to do things. You do!”

That left more of a negative impression on me than any spanking ever did. Especially because I already had a lot of self confidence issues ever since I was very very young.

 

[moon1234]

It’s funny. You can’t correct an adult by hitting them. That will land you in jail and probably bring a civil lawsuit, but striking a child is considered OK even though they are smaller, weaker and immature by definition.

This is more of a modern, police state/nanny state invention. I have seen MANY people get slapped (adults) and told to straigten themselves out or else. I don’t think ANY of these “slaps” has ever left a mark physically, but it sure had the intended effect emotionally and almost always for the better.

 

[Debora123]

This is more of a modern, police state/nanny state invention. I have seen MANY people get slapped (adults) and told to straigten themselves out or else. I don’t think ANY of these “slaps” has ever left a mark physically, but it sure had the intended effect emotionally and almost always for the better.

I know back in the day, a man was allowed to hit his wife.

Are you talking about spouses slapping each other? I hope not…

 

[28562]

I know back in the day, a man was allowed to hit his wife.

Are you talking about spouses slapping each other? I hope not…

I highly doubt ANYONE on here would advocate hitting a spouse.

But, I can think of a few adults that could use a little back parking lot attitude adjustment. Probably because they didn’t get it growing up…

 

[kelvinf]

There is a definite difference between spanking and beating/abuse.

But hitting (spanking) repeatedly is beating.

 

[kelvinf]

(I just wanted to make one quick note that has 0 to do with the subject of this thread.)

I thought it was funny that this thread got a 1 star rating right after it went up. Literally, right after it went up! Lol.

The rating has since increased after a couple people must’ve voted 5 star, and then went down again after I evidently got a SECOND 1 star rating.

Considering there is nothing incriminating whatsoever about my Original Post, and all it did was wish everyone a Happy Valentine’s Day and ask for advice on disciplining my future kids, I have to conclude that the 1 star rating was a personal attack against me.

(I also don’t want to derail this thread, but I can’t help commenting on this.)

This is soooo funny! Maybe the first person (and subsequently the other person) simply didn’t like the topic. Or maybe the person(s) thought that this topic has been heatedly debated at length before. Or maybe the person(s) thought that this topic actually belongs to the Parenting subforum or whatever it is called. Or maybe they have other reasons. We are not God so we can’t really know.

I am just wondering why you concluded that it was a personal attack!? LOL

I think most people generally do not even pay attention to thread ratings anyways.

Anyway, I really don’t mean to derail this thread or anything, just wanted to give a quick shout out to the hatas. Don’t hate guys. Don’t hate. LOVE.

Negative rating does not necessarily mean hate. People have the option to rate threads negatively or positively. Even if these persons generally don’t like your threads for whatever reason does not necessarily mean that they are hatas imo.

 

[28562]

But hitting (spanking) repeatedly is beating.

A beating would be much more ‘violent’ than a spanking, at least by my common sense definition. Are you saying that if I pop my son’s butt twice instead of just once it becomes a ‘beating’ at that point?

 

[kelvinf]

A beating would be much more ‘violent’ than a spanking, at least by my common sense definition. Are you saying that if I pop my son’s butt twice instead of just once it becomes a ‘beating’ at that point?

I personally don’t think so. But the dictionary defines “beat” as to hit or strike repeatedly. The question now is: how many times = repeatedly? I dunno.

 

[Gem02]

It’s funny. You can’t correct an adult by hitting them. That will land you in jail and probably bring a civil lawsuit, but striking a child is considered OK even though they are smaller, weaker and immature by definition.

This.

“Spanking”, which is just a cute word for repeatedly striking a child on a tender area of their body, is just wrong. If you can’t do it to an adult who you dislike or disagree with then why can you do it to a child.

 

[kelvinf]

This.

“Spanking”, which is just a cute word for repeatedly striking a child on a tender area of their body, is just wrong. If you can’t do it to an adult who you dislike or disagree with then why can you do it to a child.

Because the same holds true for time-outs!

 

[pnewton]

This.

“Spanking”, which is just a cute word for repeatedly striking a child on a tender area of their body, is just wrong. If you can’t do it to an adult who you dislike or disagree with then why can you do it to a child.

Because God gave the raising of children to parents, not the State or busy-bodies that want to tell others how to raise children. It is this principle the OP needs to remember. Raise children according to your conscience, ignoring both the “spare the rod” crowd and the “spanking is child abuse” crowd.

FYI - Until lately such a strike to an adult would not have brought any response from police. Only in the last few years has the idea of assult by contact been anything deemed offensive. Even a punch to the face used to only be a minimum misdemeanor.

 

[Gem02]

This is more of a modern, police state/nanny state invention. I have seen MANY people get slapped (adults) and told to straigten themselves out or else. I don’t think ANY of these “slaps” has ever left a mark physically, but it sure had the intended effect emotionally and almost always for the better.

Its a police state if you have to hit someone to comply.
Spanking an adult would land you in jail, its called assault. Now if I had a boss that thought he could hit me in order to get me to work better than I sue him, plain and straight. If you like the idea of hitting other adults come to NYC where I live and see how far you get with that nonsense. There will be plenty here who would like to agree with your form of compliance.

 

[pnewton]

Its a police state if you have to hit someone to comply.
Spanking an adult would land you in jail, its called assault. Now if I had a boss that thought he could hit me in order to get me to work better than I sue him, plain and straight. If you like the idea of hitting other adults come to NYC where I live and see how far you get with that nonsense. There will be plenty here who would like to agree with your form of compliance.

This argument that spanking children is bad because we can not hit the adults is an unfounded conclusion. Rather, we have examples to the contrary. We can ground a child, but to do that to an adult is kidnapping, or unlawful restraint. We can force a child to attend school and do chores without compensation but for an adult that is slavery. We can vaccinate a child whether he likes it or not, but adults have what is called right to body integrity.

I bet we could go on with more thought. The point is, there is a logical disconnect. Adults are not children. Something can apply to children but not adults. In fact, many things apply to children and not adults.

Can we not agree that this argument has a serious logic flaw?

 

[28562]

I personally don’t think so. But the dictionary defines “beat” as to hit or strike repeatedly. The question now is: how many times = repeatedly? I dunno.

I see what you are saying…I think there are lots of words where the real life, common sense definition is different than the dictionary definition.

This.

“Spanking”, which is just a cute word for repeatedly striking a child on a tender area of their body, is just wrong. If you can’t do it to an adult who you dislike or disagree with then why can you do it to a child.

Why is it wrong?

 

[pollynova]

Are the following punishments abusive?

Running a child’s hand under very hot or cold water
Having to drink a spoonful of hot sauce
giving an “indian burn”
hair pulling
ear pulling
pinching the pressure point between the neck and shoulder
shaking

 

[Debora123]

(I also don’t want to derail this thread, but I can’t help commenting on this.)

This is soooo funny! Maybe the first person (and subsequently the other person) simply didn’t like the topic. Or maybe the person(s) thought that this topic has been heatedly debated at length before. Or maybe the person(s) thought that this topic actually belongs to the Parenting subforum or whatever it is called. Or maybe they have other reasons. We are not God so we can’t really know.

I am just wondering why you concluded that it was a personal attack!? LOL

I think most people generally do not even pay attention to thread ratings anyways.

Negative rating does not necessarily mean hate. People have the option to rate threads negatively or positively. Even if these persons generally don’t like your threads for whatever reason does not necessarily mean that they are hatas imo.

Haha.

I suppose you could be right, but I highly doubt it. Especially after I learned of another member on here who always has a “hater” give all her threads (even the completely non incriminating ones) 1 star ratings as soon as they go up. So I know for a fact some people on here rate threads like that simply because they don’t like the person.

It’s pretty funny actually.

 

[Debora123]

I personally don’t think so. But the dictionary defines “beat” as to hit or strike repeatedly. The question now is: how many times = repeatedly? I dunno.

I always imagined “beating” to be when you actually caused physical damage to the person.

I wouldn’t consider it a round of bootie spanking.