Could Muhammad of been a prophet?

[TheSufi]

TheSufi - You say we should not take much or any note of Muhammad’s treatment of his wives, nor presumeably Aisha’s ironic jibe at Mohammad’s appetite for bints - well just what do YOU want us to regard and why?

I encourage all to study the life of Prophet Muhammad, he was a great example, that one should follow. Prophet Muhammad never beat his wives. Quoting bad translations isn’t proof. End of story.

I’m just asking one to be just, truthful and honest.

Presumeably you also wish us to disregard Allah as being the ‘God of Truth’, or ‘The Best/Greatest of Decievers/Planners’ - WHICH? Or is it yet another case of playing about with two ‘contradictory truths’? {Something which runs counter to my sense of rationality and logic, but which appears a common ‘dualistic’ tactic in Islam.]

Arabic speaking Christians call God, Allah. So whatever that statement means.

ps. Jesus says we should love our neighbours and demonstrates that our ‘neighbours’ are in effect all of mankind. He through His life and teachings points to wishing us to love the sinner, but to hate the sin. Satan would wish it more the other way around.

Loving all of mankind is something all Prophets taught.

 

[Mount_Carmel]

TheSufi - ‘Answered’ like a politician.

 

[LtTony]

Those are idioms, which should not be taken literally. If it was the way of Prophet Muhammad, how come none of the scholars of Islam teach to beat their wives literally??? i have kept the company of many Islamic scholars and not one of them taught me to beating women wife or not is permissible. and they have taught that the Prophet never beat his wives.

Of course today’s scholars teach that. So do Christians. But that’s probably what neither taught hundreds of years ago. The fact of the matter is Muhammad, many other early Muslims and many early Christians were mysogynists, and treated women – including their wives and daughters – poorly.
You can stick your head in the sand regarding Aisha’s description of Muhammad’s attack on her if you want. But it won’t go away – “literally.” I’d like to hear how the alleged “scholars” spin her account of the alleged prophet’s behavior as an “idiom.”

so what you understand from those hadiths ans what Islamic scholars understans from the hadiths are two different things. There is a difference between what is spoken and what is understood.

This whole charade on the subject illustrates how Islam is not the simple “logical” religion that adherents claim. It is NOT logical for a person of Aisha’s stature in Muslim lore to describe an incident, then have it discounted as a figure of speech. It is NOT logical for believers to need scholars to explain so much to them.

The quotes you use are what wife beaters like to use, but it has nothing to do with Islam. Using quotes from any scripture to justify the evils of men doesn’t mean they are interpreting it correctly.

In America, Some southern Christians use to use the bible
To justify slavery, after Ham looked upon Noah’s nakedness, upon waking from sleep, Noah said, cursed be Canaan a servant of servant shall he be.

They saw the black skin of Africans as a curse and this verse proved it, and also justifed slavery because it says a servant of servants.

Militant Christians use verses like, think not that I come to send peace but a sword, from Jesus.

It doesn’t make these Christians right.

And using those quotes don’t make it right for wife beating Muslims to beat their wives.** It is unislamic to beat your wife. Period.**

Exactly. Islam’s scripture is no more logical, no more precise than any other religion’s. Totally opposite of what Muslims claim it to be.

You can continue to misquote and misuse these quotes if you like, but you would be spreading lies about Prophet Muhammad.** And I would have a right to call you a spreader of lies and deceit.**

Totally wrong, which again points to a flaw not so much in you but in what I believe to be an arrogant belief system. (Well, more than arrogant. Down right hostile.)

One, if you think someone is a liar, provide some evidence. We to take YOUR word the poster is a liar? Each is obligated to provide some information. He did with Aisha’s hadith.
Two, maybe he isn’t “lying.” Maybe he just has a different opinion/conclusion that yours, an honest one. People can also make honest mistakes too.

If it right for you use those quotes with your twisted understanding of them, then I have the right to call all Christians Devil Lovers. Because Jesus said you should love thy enemy, and devil is one of your enemies.

LOL. Please.

I encourage all to study the life of Prophet Muhammad, he was a great example, that one should follow. Prophet Muhammad never beat his wives. Quoting bad translations isn’t proof. End of story.

I’m just asking one to be just, truthful and honest.

We have. As I said, we just have a different opinion. We respect yours, but we have our own that differs from yours.

 

[Moro_Rock]

This just illustrates that Muhammad was not Allah. Also, Muhammad was an ordinary human who occasionally had fits of anger. Muhammad lived in a culture of violence. It was normal for husbands to strike their wives if they misbehaved.

Hardly a role model for all of humanity !

 

[Eric_Hilbert]

The topic please, with charity

 

[kimg901]

Was muhammad a prophet? Was joe smith a prophet? There are a lot of mortals claiming such things. But no more revelation was needed after Christ. He was and is the Last Revelation. So NO, Muhammad was not a real prophet of God, or any other man on this earth besides Jesus Christ.

 

[nmgauss]

Jews had a number of prophets some of which predicted the coming of the Messiah. If this Messiah came, what need would there be for later prophets?

Arabs saw what the Jews and Christians had, but it was in the Aramaic and Hebrew languages. So, they felt left out. When Muhammad started preaching the Quran in Arabic, the Arabs had their prophet. They also had a religion that had them in mind, because it was in Arabic. For the Arabs, Muhammad was their prophet.

 

[joe371]

I encourage all to study the life of Prophet Muhammad, he was a great example, that one should follow. Prophet Muhammad never beat his wives. Quoting bad translations isn’t proof. End of story.

I’m just asking one to be just, truthful and honest.

I am sure that the prophet Muhammad was a good man/teacher and a great example for Muslims. However, surely you can see why Christians could not except him as a prophet of God, based on the following:

As a Christian there is no way one could concede that Muhammad was a prophet of God (the holy Trinity) for obvious reasons. From the Islamic perspective, Jesus is not God, (second Person of the Trinity) but rather just a prophet and a good teacher who did not die on the cross. Islam denies the primary doctrine that defines Christianity?

 

[MartinJordan]

Bible is quite clear that Jesus was the son of God. Mohammadd says NO, so who do you want to believe?

Either the Bible is wrong or Mohammad is wrong.

For me Bible is cent percent the Word of God.

Agreed. Keep in mind the Bible was put together by the Church. The Church is the Pillar and Ground of TRUTH. The Church is led by the Holy Spirit and the Spirit teaches Truth and there is one Truth. That Jesus IS the ONLY begotten Son of God…God from God.

The Word was made flesh and the Word (Jesus) existed before the Bible and exceeds it.

MJ

 

[TheSufi]

I am sure that the prophet Muhammad was a good man/teacher and a great example for Muslims. However, surely you can see why Christians could not except him as a prophet of God, based on the following:

As a Christian there is no way one could concede that Muhammad was a prophet of God (the holy Trinity) for obvious reasons. From the Islamic perspective, Jesus is not God, (second Person of the Trinity) but rather just a prophet and a good teacher who did not die on the cross. Islam denies the primary doctrine that defines Christianity?

Yes, Prophet Muhammad does not fit the world view of Orthodox//Catholic theology, no more than Jesus fitting the world view of Jewish theology.

There is a point of wisdom that can be learned from this. We both believe in the second coming of Jesus, perhaps we should not let our current theological beliefs cause us to miss his second coming.

Perhaps in this we might be united is his second coming if it is soon.

And God knows best

 

[joe371]

Yes, Prophet Muhammad does not fit the world view of Orthodox//Catholic theology, no more than Jesus fitting the world view of Jewish theology.

There is a point of wisdom that can be learned from this. We both believe in the second coming of Jesus, perhaps we should not let our current theological beliefs cause us to miss his second coming.

Perhaps in this we might be united is his second coming if it is soon.

And God knows best

Your profile says that you are Sunni Islam. That said, you believe in Jesus’ second coming? Could you elaborate a bit on that?

“The issue of the crucifixion and death of Jesus (Isa) is important to Muslims as they believe that Jesus will return before the end of time. Muslims believe Jesus was not crucified, but was raised bodily to heaven by God, a belief also found in the Gospel of Basilides.”

Do you see the problem with the part in red?

 

[joe371]

Yes, Prophet Muhammad does not fit the world view of Orthodox//Catholic theology, no more than Jesus fitting the world view of Jewish theology.

There is a point of wisdom that can be learned from this. We both believe in the second coming of Jesus, perhaps we should not let our current theological beliefs cause us to miss his second coming.

Perhaps in this we might be united is his second coming if it is soon.

And God knows best

As per Islam tradition, what exactly is the purpose of Jesus’ second coming?

 

[Slaney]

Is it possible that Muhammad was a prophet of God? Can the belief in Jesus as our savoir and Muhammad as a prophet coincide? I don’t know much about Islam, but I’m quite curious about it.

Definitely not, it’s in direct opposition to God, as Saint Paul warned, " even if an Angel preach to you a different Gospel, do not believe it " Mohammed preached a different gospel, no brainer !

 

[MartinJordan]

Your profile says that you are Sunni Islam. I agree that we should not let our current theological beliefs cause us to miss his second coming.

Joe, Christianity already believed in the 2nd coming LONG before Mohammed came along. The Jews disregard this revelation. It was the Church that taught that Jesus will return.

Yes we look forward to Jesus’ second coming. Because we KNOW the Church is lead by the Holy Spirit and it is the Spirit of Truth that taught us this. Amen!

MJ

 

[joe371]

TheSufi;10980559]Yes, Prophet Muhammad does not fit the world view of Orthodox//Catholic theology, no more than Jesus fitting the world view of Jewish theology.

Islamic belief is that the following words, found in the Christian New Testament, spoken by Jesus Himself, refers to Muhammad?

If you love me, Keep my commandments. And I will pray to the Father and He shall give you another comforter that he may abide with you forever.
(Bible, John 14-15/16)

But when the comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the spirit of Truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me, and he also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.
(Bible, John 15-26/27)

I have yet many things to say unto you, but you cannot bear them now. How be it when he, the spirit of Truth will come, he will guide you into all truth, for he shall speak not of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that he shall speak, and he will show you things to come. He shall glorify me, for he shall receive of mine, and he shall show it unto you.
(Bible, John 16-12/14)

islamcan.com/islamic-articles/jesus-isa-a.s.-in-islam-and-his-second-coming.shtml
“Ulema (learned scholars in Islam) have said that the person who is described by Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) to come after him - in the above verse - does not comply with any other person but Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him).”

 

[joe371]

Joe, Christianity already believed in the 2nd coming LONG before Mohammed came along. The Jews disregard this revelation. It was the Church that taught that Jesus will return.

Yes we look forward to Jesus’ second coming. Because we KNOW the Church is lead by the Holy Spirit and it is the Spirit of Truth that taught us this. Amen!

MJ

Of course! :thumbsup:I just did not know that Muslims believed in Jesus’ (as a prophet only according to the Islamic tradition) - second coming.

 

[MartinJordan]

Of course! :thumbsup:I just did not know that Muslims believed in Jesus’ (as a prophet only according to the Islamic tradition) - second coming.

Neither did till about 4 years ago. It has been my experience living among Muslims most of my life (I’m 44 now) that they did not talk about it when I dealt with them. They’ve shown me respect I’d say by not insisting on their religion and going about their lives the best they can.

However things changed in 2001 when little by little it was brought to my attention and they needed to defend their way of life because of the attacks and my muslim friends personally explained it to me. So I began to empathize with them as I also saw the attacks as radical movement. So they convinced me and I still have no doubt Muslims are sincere…but mistaken who Jesus really is.

MJ

 

[adawgj]

He seems more like a false prophet which St. Paul warns about in his letters to Timothy.

 

[joe371]

Neither did till about 4 years ago. It has been my experience living among Muslims most of my life (I’m 44 now) that they did not talk about it when I dealt with them. They’ve shown me respect I’d say by not insisting on their religion and going about their lives the best they can.

However things changed in 2001 when little by little it was brought to my attention and they needed to defend their way of life because of the attacks and my muslim friends personally explained it to me. So I began to empathize with them as I also saw the attacks as radical movement. So they convinced me and I still have no doubt Muslims are sincere…but mistaken who Jesus really is.

MJ

 

[daler]

Of course! :thumbsup:I just did not know that Muslims believed in Jesus’ (as a prophet only according to the Islamic tradition) - second coming.

“What can such expect but that God should come down to them overshadowed with clouds…” -Qur’an 2:210

“And there shall be a blast on the Trumpet, and all who are in the Heaven and all who are on the earth shall expire, save those whom God shall vouchsafe to live. Then shall there be another blast on it, and lo! arising they shall gaze around them: and the earth shall shine with the light of her Lord.” -Qur’an 39:68-69 [Note: The title Baha’u’llah can be translated as ‘the Light of the Lord’]

Biblically, we are warned of the three Woes, and “the third Woe cometh quickly”. The First Woe is determined to be Muhammd, followed by the Bab in the year 1260 AH (1844 AD). This is the Second Woe, And the Third Woe quickly came after the Second in the 1280 AH, or 1863 AD, when Baha’u’llah announced Himself to be the Promised One of all religion.
These prophetic numbers appear both in Daniel and Revelation. Note also that although the year 1280 AH is 1863 AH, this year is also 1290 lunar years from the public announcement of Muhammad, which occurred 10 years prior to the beginning of their calendar, “after the Hijra”. Hence the three dates given by Daniel: 1260, 1280, and 1290 all concur conclusively with the appearance of the First Woe in 622 AD (Muhammad), the 2nd being the Bab in the year 1260 AH, and the third in 1280 AH, which also is 1290 years following the Prophet Muhammad’s declaration till the declaration of Baha’u’llah in the Garden of Ridwan (Paradise)

“One day, the disturbing trumpet-blast shall disturb it [the universe] which the second blast shall follow… Verily, it will be but a single blast…” -Qur’an 79:6,7&