Cursillos: an ecumenical experience

[Joe_Pickett]

Dear JohnnieC,
I guess it depends on where you attend Cursillo, but I am in Orange County, CA, and I would say 99% are Catholic, the others are mostly looking into being Catholic. The weekend is an unbelievable weekend where I was able to examine where I was as a Catholic. I learned that I needed more prayer, study and Christian action in my life. It totally changed my outlook on life and the Mass. I also saw love from other Catholics that I had never seen before. It made me want to do the same for others.
As a result, through prayer, my wife came back to the Church, two daughters who were non-practicing got married in the Church, and one of them came back to the Church. I give all credit to Cursillo for this, the Holy Spirit was there, and greatly changed me so that I think of Christ daily and try to do His will rather than mine. This change just may help me get to Heaven, with the help of Catholic Answers. God bless you!

 

[Nicea325]

The Cursillo movement started among Catholics in Spain; a group of laymen seeking ways to help the Church. Retreats focus on renewal in faith to be active in parish community. Mass is celebrated daily and the blessed Sacrament adored.

Quickly, other Christians adopted Cursillos [Methodist: “Walk to Emmaus”, Lutheran: “Vía De Cristo”]. Cursillos may include diverse Christians *. The impact of scripture, prayer & sacrament restores lay discipleship. A retreat one never forgets.

Your thoughts?*

If planned,organized, and with great logistics…then YES! But if it is not well organized and planned…it becomes divine chaos.

 

[maryjk]

Same here. I have wanted to go but reading this thread I would be hesitant. Is there a way to find out before hand?

Nope.

Well, you might be able to squeeze an answer out of someone. Maybe. If you really harp on it.

Otherwise, you are suppose to just go. No questions. No hesitation.

 

[ffg]

My wife and I did this retreat about 12 year ago (separate weekends). It’s called Cum Christo in Columbus OH…

More info here - cumchristo.org/

It was a nice retreat from what I remember.

 

[BlueRoses12]

Before making the decision to attend a Cursillo, I’d recommend reading two books:

Cursillo: Little Courses in Catharsis by Brian V. Janssen. Eye-opening. Pricey but worth the cost, if you’re considering taking this type of risk with your own faith life.

*The Abbey Up The Hill *by Carol Bonomo. Specifically, the chapter that recounts her Cursillo experience. Unlike the Janssen book, this is easily found in a library.

Forewarned is forearmed.

 

[gh4]

If anyone wants to know what happens in Cursillo, I am happy to share much of it.
I will NOT share any personal stuff that was said in the rollos, that’s not to be shared with anyone by anyone who heard it.

But as far as what the weekend does up to Sat. Night, it’s not a big secret, it’s all online if you search.
If you think it’s wonderful and uplifting, think again. There’s nothing uplifting on Thursday evening, Friday or Saturday, not at all. If you like to be with people 24/7 and don’t mind not having a moment to yourself, and don’t mind not getting enough sleep and eating lots of carbs, then this might be for you.
I’m sure if it’s complicated with more than one religion, that would make it even more difficult for some people.
It’s similar to Christ Renews His Parish, but it’s longer and there’s more of the “breaking down” in Cursillo.
And that was the beginning of my walk away from the Catholic Church. The ONLY thing I miss about the Catholic Church is working with St. Vincent DePaul Society, I really loved being a part of that.

 

[EvangelCatholic]

The Cursillos Cross

 

[Della]

If anyone wants to know what happens in Cursillo, I am happy to share much of it.
I will NOT share any personal stuff that was said in the rollos, that’s not to be shared with anyone by anyone who heard it.

But as far as what the weekend does up to Sat. Night, it’s not a big secret, it’s all online if you search.
If you think it’s wonderful and uplifting, think again. There’s nothing uplifting on Thursday evening, Friday or Saturday, not at all. If you like to be with people 24/7 and don’t mind not having a moment to yourself, and don’t mind not getting enough sleep and eating lots of carbs, then this might be for you.
I’m sure if it’s complicated with more than one religion, that would make it even more difficult for some people.
It’s similar to Christ Renews His Parish, but it’s longer and there’s more of the “breaking down” in Cursillo.
And that was the beginning of my walk away from the Catholic Church. The ONLY thing I miss about the Catholic Church is working with St. Vincent DePaul Society, I really loved being a part of that.

I’m truly sorry to hear this. Part of being a Catholic is stripping away everything in order to see the truth about ourselves and about God. The process helped teach me humility–seeing that although I am little and no one, God still loves me. I think that’s wonderful to come to understand, even if the process is a bit painful. It’s like getting a root canal sometimes and at others it’s only getting a good teeth cleaning. It helps us put things into their proper perspective.

I hope you will come back to the Church. It may be filled with us poor sinners, but it is still the place where the fullness of truth subsists. Truth can be hard to face, sometimes, but it’s good for us to do it. No one can be truly free who does not understand who he is in relation with God and with others. That’s what I’ve learned, anyway.

 

[BlueRoses12]

If anyone wants to know what happens in Cursillo, I am happy to share much of it.
I will NOT share any personal stuff that was said in the rollos, that’s not to be shared with anyone by anyone who heard it.

I agree with the simple human respect of not spilling the personal secrets of anyone who divulged them during this type of retreat, as you put it.

I do not agree with those who imply that this extends to keeping secrets about what goes on (which you also make clear).

That type of inappropriate secrecy has been asked of people after their weekend, and unfortunately they have taken it very seriously and respected it. The result has been that those who might be harmed by a weekend have no way of knowing this until it’s too late. No one has the right to ask this type of secrecy.

I don’t remember anything personal that was said during a class. I do remember that the very first class was taught by a husband-wife teaching team, and that during the first moments of the class, the husband burst into tears. Looking back, and having read the Janssen book on Cursillo, I wonder if this was spontaneous or for effect. Or a mixture of both. (Surely this wasn’t the first time he’d told his story?) Much of the point of this type of weekend is to arouse emotion to fever pitch and produce a catharsis, and that awkward episode plunged us right in, full immersion.

I’ll tell you right now what is one of the supposedly sacred secrets of the weekend. It all culminates, late Saturday night (or possibly Sunday), in a chapter-wide love bombing. Everyone in your region who ever participated in a weekend travels there for a reunion, for the fledgling newbies’ induction into The Group, to hug on you. People there will expect this to be the high point of your life. If this idea appeals to you, go for it.

If you don’t mind the feeling of giving up your adulthood and being controlled like a child, even if only briefly, you might like the weekend. It might be a good choice, if you don’t mind things like:

• Having the person who took you to the weekend, whom you’d hoped to enjoy time with, suddenly ditch you as you arrived, leaving you totally alone in a strange place with strangers
• Having to surrender your watch and medications, with the promise that others will ensure you get your meds on time (and sometimes they don’t)
• Holding hands when moving from classroom to classroom
• Having your bathroom breaks regulated and scheduled
• Being pressured to participate in lengthy hug-a-thons after each class
• Not getting one moment of solitude or silence all weekend

If you enjoy feeling intense, over-the-top emotions, you’ll love the weekend. If you adore hugging – if cuddling others during the Greeting of Peace is, for you, the high point of the Mass, and your only complaint is that it doesn’t last long enough – you’ll have the time of your life.

If the occasional heresy doesn’t bother you, you’ll fit right in. After all, sound doctrine really isn’t the point. There was quite a bit of heresy taught during my weekend, and it did bother me, but hug-seekers might find it incidental or even agree with much of it. If you believe that the words “God” and “Jesus Christ” are nothing but synonyms for the community, you’ll be right at home.

If you’re quite extroverted, or an extrovert wannabee, it will probably be a good fit. If, otoh, you’re an introvert, with perhaps a more monastic or mystical outlook, believe God made you this way, accept this about yourself and have no desire to be otherwise – it will be grating.

And if you’ve had anything problematic in your past, beware: If zealously done, the weekend, with its initial entrapment, constant surprises, modeling and pressure toward excessive openness, being plunged into a state of unbalance and bewilderment, and psychological pressure – all of which are traditional hallmarks of the weekend – could be experienced as nightmarish.

Bottom line: this weekend is known to be destabilizing and harmful for a significant portion of the public. Unfortunately it is difficult for those people, themselves, to find out in advance, because of the secrecy. We rely on the goodwill and competence of the leadership to screen out vulnerable people. They aren’t doing it.

 

[EvangelCatholic]

Licensed therapists/ clergy require confidentiality at Cursillos. It is a public confession of the faith that is life saving. Cell groups of prayer stay in touch.

 

[Della]

When I went on Cursillo it wasn’t anything like some of us have described. I didn’t have to surrender anything nor did I have to divulge personal information or keep anything secret that could possibly harm anyone. I am appalled by these accounts because that is NOT what Cursillo is supposed be about at all!!!

It’s supposed to be a SPIRITUAL retreat not a psychological cry fest. Any Cursillo leaders who are doing the things described by some of us are definitely using it like some kind of cult. I’m so sorry for those who had that kind of experience. All it’s supposed to be is self-examination in the secret of one’s own heart–not spilling one’s guts to everyone there. That’s terrible! Again, I’m so sorry some of you had that kind of experience. I too would warn people not to go if I had had that kind of experience. Holy moly!

 

[gh4]

Licensed therapists/ clergy require confidentiality at Cursillos. It is a public confession of the faith that is life saving. Cell groups of prayer stay in touch.

I’m really unsure of exactly what you are saying here…???

 

[Horton]

I made my Cursillo while in the conversion process. I look back on that time as the true defining period of discerning conversion. It was truly the ah-ha moment for me. While there were parts that were a little uncomfortable for me at first, there were so many amazing gifts I took away the discomfort was absolutely worth it. I made life-long friends, true sisters in Christ. I count that weekend as when I really felt I was a member of our parish. (I was new to the parish at that point, didn’t know too many people)

The secret stuff is not meant to be “secret” in a creepy sordid kind of way. The idea is for people to go into the weekend with an open mind and open heart to deepen their faith and love of Christ. As far as having the child-like experience of no watches, cell phones, no exterior (name removed by moderator)ut, being told when the next event was, for us it was a lesson in letting others care for us. I believe we had about 3 times the number of helpers as participants, everything was done with love and caring. I think that is another of the “secret” concepts, how to let yourself be completely cared for by others. For me the “secret” thing is not so much that the weekend has secret stuff but an inability to describe what happens to someone in making a Cursillo. Truly the only people who have been able to understand the lack of words are those who have made a Cursillo.

We enjoyed laughter, tears, joy, love, hope, charity, fun, and most of all an increase in desire to go out with piety, study, and action. We did skits, made up songs, had some moments of sorrow during rollos, but most of all we had love. For each other and for our faith. If I had to pick the one external event to confirm my decision to convert to the Catholic Church the Cursillo was it. Not only was a graced with incredible spiritual gifts I learned a great deal of what Catholics believe and why. I was also able to see that put into real action. We formed a 4th Day group right after and we meet weekly without fail. We’ve been able to bring others into our group and we incorporate Christian action in all we do.

For those who had a poor experience, I’m sorry. We were fortunate to have an incredible team for ours. It was a Catholic Cursillo although there was at least one non-Catholic and two of us in the conversion process. I don’t see everyone who was a part of my Cursillo weekend, those I do see at Mass, at other parish functions, in the community at large are always quick with a hug and cheerful greeting. I can’t wait for the next one so I can become part of the team, to show the love and concern for participants, to help them to feel the incredible joy of faithful women in a Cursillo weekend.

 

[EvangelCatholic]

I’m really unsure of exactly what you are saying here…???

Cursillios is lay evangelism. Parishioner reaching out to parishioner. Embracing Christ. Most cursillios are held in parishes so people sleep at home and return the next day. Or overnight at retreat centers. Mass is prayed every day. Clergy and religious are available for private confession/ counseling.

 

[Della]

Cursillios is lay evangelism. Parishioner reaching out to parishioner. Embracing Christ. Most cursillios are held in parishes so people sleep at home and return the next day. Or overnight at retreat centers. Mass is prayed every day. Clergy and religious are available for private confession/ counseling.

At my Cursillo we slept on mats on the floor in the church basement–I’m glad I was young enough to do that at the time. I couldn’t do that now. I don’t recall having any clergy there–it was an ecumenical Cursillo not a Catholic one, so I couldn’t say what the Catholic ones entail. Our parish has CHRP encounters over weekends. So far, I haven’t gone, but I’m at the point in my life that such experiences aren’t necessary for me or practical. Bible studies are exercises in frustration for me because I know the material much better than the others–I have a B. A. in religious education, and so end up “teaching” rather than learning much of anything.

 

[gh4]

Cursillios is lay evangelism. Parishioner reaching out to parishioner. Embracing Christ. Most cursillios are held in parishes so people sleep at home and return the next day. Or overnight at retreat centers. Mass is prayed every day. Clergy and religious are available for private confession/ counseling.

The cursillo I attended was almost 100 miles away at a retreat center. We only have diocese wide cursillos. The cursillo was basically run by a priest who was at every segment of it. When we drew those posters with crayons and markers, he judged them and held up scores like they used to do for the olympics and skating and diving competitions etc. (it was horribly degrading and embarrassing) It was pretty easy to see who his favorites were.

We slept 6 or 8 to a room. With lots of bathroom lights on so everyone could find the bathroom (I brought a flashlight for that) We had bunk beds. One wanted the heat up, one wanted it down, one wanted it off… people up and down all night. I got very little sleep.

There was a deacon there, a very nice elderly gentleman, and he was in the room for most of it. Also a lady who I never did quite understand who she was was there throughout.

The other gal there from my parish said “well, now I understand how women in prison feel” on Friday night. And yup, she was right, it was like being in prison.
There wasn’t anywhere to change clothes privately. I ended up sleeping in my clothes and waiting until everyone left the room in the AM to try to have privacy to shower and change. The shower was a joke. I can’t say that I can think of much good about cursillo, horrid, just horrid.

I attended CRHP back in the late 80’s and it was wonderful! We did sleep on the floor in the undercroft, but it was fine, I was much younger then! I thought cursillo would be more like CRHP, but it sure wasn’t!

 

[EvangelCatholic]

At my Cursillo we slept on mats on the floor in the church basement–I’m glad I was young enough to do that at the time. I couldn’t do that now. I don’t recall having any clergy there–it was an ecumenical Cursillo not a Catholic one, so I couldn’t say what the Catholic ones entail. Our parish has CHRP encounters over weekends. So far, I haven’t gone, but I’m at the point in my life that such experiences aren’t necessary for me or practical. Bible studies are exercises in frustration for me because I know the material much better than the others–I have a B. A. in religious education, and so end up “teaching” rather than learning much of anything.

Have to confess that at my age, I prefer to sleep in my own bed than cots!

 

[Della]

The cursillo I attended was almost 100 miles away at a retreat center. We only have diocese wide cursillos. The cursillo was basically run by a priest who was at every segment of it. When we drew those posters with crayons and markers, he judged them and held up scores like they used to do for the olympics and skating and diving competitions etc. (it was horribly degrading and embarrassing) It was pretty easy to see who his favorites were.

We slept 6 or 8 to a room. With lots of bathroom lights on so everyone could find the bathroom (I brought a flashlight for that) We had bunk beds. One wanted the heat up, one wanted it down, one wanted it off… people up and down all night. I got very little sleep.

There was a deacon there, a very nice elderly gentleman, and he was in the room for most of it. Also a lady who I never did quite understand who she was was there throughout.

The other gal there from my parish said “well, now I understand how women in prison feel” on Friday night. And yup, she was right, it was like being in prison.
There wasn’t anywhere to change clothes privately. I ended up sleeping in my clothes and waiting until everyone left the room in the AM to try to have privacy to shower and change. The shower was a joke. I can’t say that I can think of much good about cursillo, horrid, just horrid.

I attended CRHP back in the late 80’s and it was wonderful! We did sleep on the floor in the undercroft, but it was fine, I was much younger then! I thought cursillo would be more like CRHP, but it sure wasn’t!

If you don’t mind my saying so, I don’t see how one weekend of personal restrictions and bodily discomforts equals it being a totally unprofitable experience. People have died in prisons and been martyred for the faith. What’s a few missed hours of sleep and poor meals compared to that? Jesus is worth all the suffering we can endure and then some. I write this in all charity and to give all this a bit of perspective.

As for the drawings that were judged, when my group did it, our drawing was technically the best (I’m something of an artist). But there was another, simpler drawing that matched the lesson perfectly, so it “won.” What did that show me? That perfection isn’t about who can do something better, but about what teaches us some virtue the best. It was a humbling moment for me, but a worthwhile lesson I never forgot.

There are men and women who live lives of restrictions and personal denial so they can serve God and others. Most of us are not called to that kind of vocation, but it is legitimate. Cursillo is a taste of that kind of vocation. It gave me an appreciation of what some of my brethren are willing to sacrifice in order to follow God’s call in their lives. When you think about it, we all have restrictions and personal sacrifices in our lives no matter who we are or what we do. Having them disciplines us and teaches us to appreciate what we have and understand our place in God’s overall plan for humanity.

 

[Della]

Have to confess that at my age, I prefer to sleep in my own bed than cots!

I hear ya. At my age, and with FMS and arthritis, I need a good bed not a mere cot these days. My dh and I go weekend camping a few times each summer. I have to bring along extra bedding so I can be comfortable enough to sleep, otherwise it’d be penance not fun/relaxing.

 

[gh4]

If you don’t mind my saying so, I don’t see how one weekend of personal restrictions and bodily discomforts equals it being a totally unprofitable experience. People have died in prisons and been martyred for the faith. What’s a few missed hours of sleep and poor meals compared to that? Jesus is worth all the suffering we can endure and then some. I write this in all charity and to give all this a bit of perspective.

As for the drawings that were judged, when my group did it, our drawing was technically the best (I’m something of an artist). But there was another, simpler drawing that matched the lesson perfectly, so it “won.” What did that show me? That perfection isn’t about who can do something better, but about what teaches us some virtue the best. It was a humbling moment for me, but a worthwhile lesson I never forgot.

There are men and women who live lives of restrictions and personal denial so they can serve God and others. Most of us are not called to that kind of vocation, but it is legitimate. Cursillo is a taste of that kind of vocation. It gave me an appreciation of what some of my brethren are willing to sacrifice in order to follow God’s call in their lives. When you think about it, we all have restrictions and personal sacrifices in our lives no matter who we are or what we do. Having them disciplines us and teaches us to appreciate what we have and understand our place in God’s overall plan for humanity.

Of course we all have personal restrictions and we all make personal sacrifices. But undressing in front of other women is not a sacrifice that I will make for anyone, ever. I got so tired of hearing everyone talk talk talk talk talk that I was ready to throw up. I have a very quiet home and live alone, so this much time with people and not a minute to myself was very bad. I don’t need someone to walk with me to get a tylenol and watch me take a pill for a headache. They “forgot” to tell me when it was time to take medications, that’s DANGEROUS.
The leader of the giving group didn’t know how to say a Hail Mary, and she was a cradle catholic. I promise you that Jesus did not form in any wound. And this woman had children, I wondered if she really thought she had a wound where she carried them.
No, when I’m backed into a corner, I either remove myself from that corner, or I fight back and so I didn’t want to argue with these people, I removed myself
And I was the only person on that weekend (except for the priest) who wasn’t married. All the talks were geared to women with husbands and husbands who had made their cursillo. Not one word about a widow/single person and how everything would affect them. Nope, not a nice place at all. I had months of nightmares over it. And if you don’t get it, they aren’t very nice about it either. They don’t sit down and talk you through it or explain anything, it’s always more of the “you just have to experience it” **** even when you are there. And quite frankly, that’s BS and a cheap chicken way out of it.

I’m sure there are those who have had wonderful weekends. But that was NOT my experience and I believe that before people attend a weekend, they should hear more than “you have to experience it” when they have questions.

And if you want to have a conversation about sacrifices, I would be most happy to go toe to toe with you on that one. Please don’t think that I haven’t make some huge sacrifices in my life just because I find the cursillo stuff very hurtful. You know, we are all different and there are different stroked for different folks.