Deaths as Israeli forces storm Gaza aid ship

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Aquinas62 said:
It doesn’t matter, because he makes more sense than many on this topic!
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Why do you keep responding to posts not addressed to you?

For the record, English is not my first language and there are still traces of direct translation in the way I speak and write English. I thought I detected a similar tendency in the poster and was curious about his/her original language. Nothing sinister, no hidden agenda, just interest. OK?
 
I do not see why Israel cannot stop and inspect ships headed for Gaza and then let them go on if there are no weapons found. That would in a sense, I guess, partially end the blockade, but Israel does have the right to have some kind of blockade and the activists seem to be saying that any blockade at all is not acceptable.

In this flotilla incident, it seems to me it was the way the Israeli commandos conducted themselves on that one ship, that was very very wrong, indeed murderous. The other five ships were boarded peacefully and the people onboard submitted without incident.

And now the Israeli government is formulating and “setting their story” and so far the story they are peddling seems like insulting lies. One early explanation was that the commandos had only paint ball guns. But now the story has moved along and is beginning to settle and the entire media is putting out the same story, same set of explanations, of the Israeli government.
 
yellow belle said:
why do you keep responding to posts not addressed to you?
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because i can, ok?? BTW stop being so hostile, if you read my post, i was addressing the issue in a general manner, and not you specifically. I just used your question, sorry, I didn’t know it was copyrighted.
 
What is the best argument then? Condemn Israel actions out right and never look at the details that transpire before this tragedy happened.

IHH funding and sending aid to hamas controlled Gaza strip is already a question mark. An obvious indication of bad things waiting to unfold.
 
Archie said:
I do not see why Israel cannot stop and inspect ships headed for Gaza and then let them go on if there are no weapons found. That would in a sense, I guess, partially end the blockade, but Israel does have the right to have some kind of blockade and the activists seem to be saying that any blockade at all is not acceptable.

In this flotilla incident, it seems to me it was the way the Israeli commandos conducted themselves on that one ship, that was very very wrong, indeed murderous. The other five ships were boarded peacefully and the people onboard submitted without incident.

And now the Israeli government is formulating and “setting their story” and so far the story they are peddling seems like insulting lies. One early explanation was that the commandos had only paint ball guns. But now the story has moved along and is beginning to settle and the entire media is putting out the same story, same set of explanations, of the Israeli government.
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Here is that “formulated and set story” line, which by the looks of it, is more accurate than the rest of the protesters claimed as “violence free resistance”.





And here is how a paintball rifle looks like just like the infra red silhouette on image 7.

http://www.gadgetsuk.com/files//t_17113.jpg
 
Archie said:
Here is rebuttal of some of the statements of CatholicsForIsrael also by Dr. Sungenis.

catholicintl.com/articles/The%20Revolutionary%20Jew%20Review.pdf

Be aware of
the long-standing directive from Pope Gregory the Great in the sixth century, otherwise known as the Sicut Iudeis non, which states quite simply: “no one has the right to harm Jews or disrupt their worship services, but the Jews have, likewise, no right to
corrupt the faith or morals of Christians or subvert Christian societies.”
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Read this: **A Response to Robert Sungenis
**
 
O_Duirnin said:
You do realise that there hasn’t been a single suicide bombing in Israel/Palestine since February 2008, and not one to which responsibility has been attributed to Hamas since January 2005?
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I saw poctures of the security wall that Israel built/is building. I think we are copying it on our southern border. Effective.
 
trdchubi said:
School children are subjected to this kind of learning from their elders… The only paper they actually do have are hate speeches and books that tell Jews are pigs. http://www.debbieschlussel.com/archives/latesthamaskids2.jpg

and, here is how they use their medical aid…
Israel Gives Medicine. Arabs Give Back Explosives.!

http://outoftheblu.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/medbomb1.jpg?w=248&h=218

Cement and steel are supposed to be used to build houses, bridges and roads for peace. However these bags of cement , bars of steel are being used for underground tunnels, ammunition bunkers and command centers on the sole purpose of initiating attacks on Israel by hamas.

So should Israel stand and ignore the movement of these materials around, when past atrocities tell them otherwise? Its common sense to banned this things when you know its going to be used against you by your “very freindly and respectful” neighbor.

Here is one use of the steel pipes:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Nvqzpq9ZfEg/SPOkHpwYtXI/AAAAAAAACqw/E0Fww62Uxsw/s400/Pipe+Bomb.jpg
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These are the kinds of things we are not supposed to see.
 
trdchubi said:
I hate to say this, but the arabs in gaza received what they deserve.
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I see that your signature refers to “catholics for Israel”…

“catholics for israel” needs to brush up on Church teaching. You will search in vain if you believe the Church ever taught that people AS A GROUP “receive what they deserve” (a notion more better known as collective punishment). An earlier poster referred back to Sicut Judeiis Non, the official Church teaching on the treatment of Jews. I strongly urge you to familiarize yourself with it. Collective punishment may be accepted by other religions and racist ideologies, but is it alien to Catholicism.
 
trdchubi said:
Here is that “formulated and set story” line, which by the looks of it, is more accurate than the rest of the protesters claimed as “violence free resistance”.
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Then I wonder why the Israelis are afraid to release the reams of footage of the attack which they are in possession of? :hmmm:
 
Again, this incident all boils down to what exactly transpired when the commandos boarded the Mavi Mamara ship. 9 people were killed, some executive style with multiple shots to the back of the head, and 56 people were wounded, some seriously.

People will either believe that this was all perfectly justified on the part of the Israelis and believe the stories uniformly put out by all mainstream media in favor of Israel.

Some of us are open to the idea that Israel handled this situation as judiciously as possible but realize the mainstream media is totally owned and controlled by persons loyal to Israel.

I do not believe Israel is right no matter what. I believe they have a very long history of of acting subversively.

Chistians are being persecutied in Israel, just as they are in Muslim countries.

The matter of the Palestinians has never been planned for or handled correctly by the Israelis when they took over the land of Israel. There were many Palestinian Christians whose homes were mowed down and who were imprisoned or killed when the Israelis took over beginning in 1948. I have a book about that. The USA stood by and watched Christian Palestinians being brutally mistreated and hered up and corraled like cattle for the slaughter.

I guess this incident just provides a way for many of us to say

Isn’t it time we take a hard look at the real actions of Israel and not have the constant spin of the mainstream media doing their bidding and having the U.S. Vice President acting as Israel’s puppet.

We do not know what happened and there will be no real investigation.

I have no sympathy for Israel as a collective, but I do have love and sympathy for the innocent people who live in Israel and in Palestine who simply want to live thier lives and are not militant and combative at all in their behavior.

The people who really run Israel are in with the people who run the USA from behind the scenes and all of those people are in with the people who run the world.

I do not believe the USA or Israel or any Islamic nation wants to take over the world, but the “brotherhood of darkness” people who really run the world do want incidents to polarize and balkanize people into factions that can be used for the next wars that they are scheming to precipitate.

The USA has been funding Islamic radicalism for many decades and there is considerable documentation to show that Israel created Hamas and that the USA CIA created al qaeda.

I know of the history of the Islamic peoples and their penchant for hidous violence and constant wars. The history of Jewish people is also one of revolution and mainly brilliant crafty subversiveness. Read the Jewish Revolutionary Spirit book by E. Michael Jones.

The USA has always denied and pretended that Israel does not have nuclear weapons, but accounts by many journalists and think tanks from all over the world estimate that Israel has anywhere from 200 to over 400 thermonuclear warheads.

The USA sends billions upon billions of dollars to a country that has nuclear weapons but lies and denies having any at all.

Maybe Israel acted rightly in the case of this flotilla, but most of the world is no longer inclined to give Israel the benefit of the doubt and more and more people know that Israel is a country full of subversive intrigue and dirty tricks among its top leaders and that there will be no real investigation and no truth and therefor no justice in this incident.

It is wrong to just always say Israel is right no matter what. And just for the record, the teachings of the Roman Catholic church do not believe that Israel or its people today in Israel, or Jews all over the world who have rejected the Gospel and Christ, are “special” and must be treated favorably no matter what.

We are commanded by our Lord Jesus Christ to seek Truth and Justice. We are to seek truth, love truth, and expose evil deeds to the the Light of Christ. We are to expose and oppose evil.

Always automatically siding with Israel and regarding them as the victims and poor little country of continually persecuted people is not seeking truth and justice.

Jesus Christ is Truth and He is the only way to the Father and to heaven.
 
trdchubi said:
Here is that “formulated and set story” line, which by the looks of it, is more accurate than the rest of the protesters claimed as “violence free resistance”.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/06/01/article-1282989-09D6766E000005DC-871_634x577.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/06/01/article-1282989-09D686E9000005DC-846_634x612.jpg

And here is how a paintball rifle looks like just like the infra red silhouette on image 7.

http://www.gadgetsuk.com/files//t_17113.jpg
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The Israelis confiscated all the media taken by those on the ships. Theyve still not had their mobile phones, cameras etc returned to them.

The Israelis have been controlling what images are released.

But I ask myself, why would I believe the manufactured illusion of what happened when it’s being proported by the same people who forged foreign nationals passports in order to murder a man in his hotel room.
 
Target assassination is the same whether you send someone to meet His Creator from a drone or by hand. The later is messy and many “innocent” civilians might have to die along with your intended target. If the U.S. can hunt down terrorists, why can’t Israel?
Guyonthestreet said:
The Israelis confiscated all the media taken by those on the ships. Theyve still not had their mobile phones, cameras etc returned to them.

The Israelis have been controlling what images are released.

But I ask myself, why would I believe the manufactured illusion of what happened when it’s being proported by the same people who forged foreign nationals passports in order to murder a man in his hotel room.
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MugenOne said:
Target assassination is the same whether you send someone to meet His Creator from a drone or by hand. The later is messy and many “innocent” civilians might have to die along with your intended target. If the U.S. can hunt down terrorists, why can’t Israel?
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The Jews did that by stealing passports and identities and using other forgeries without the permission of the countries of the victims of that plot. The Americans attacked above board with weaponry recognized as legitimate.

Want to love Israel? Go ahead. As for myself, I have no use for the State of Israel, though I recognize that most of its people are innocent victims of its perpetually mendacious government. 😦
 
MugenOne said:
Target assassination is the same whether you send someone to meet His Creator from a drone or by hand. The later is messy and many “innocent” civilians might have to die along with your intended target. If the U.S. can hunt down terrorists, why can’t Israel?
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I didnt say they couldnt.

That wasnt my point.
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
The Jews did that by stealing passports and identities and using other forgeries without the permission of the countries of the victims of that plot. The Americans attacked above board with weaponry recognized as legitimate.

Want to love Israel? Go ahead. As for myself, I have no use for the State of Israel, though I recognize that most of its people are innocent victims of its perpetually mendacious government. 😦
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First- The ACLU and the UN have actually challenged the legitimacy of drones. msnbc.msn.com/id/37474231/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/
Second- America had no problem carrying out such attacks in Pakistan back before they were cooperating.
 
tjm190 said:
First- The ACLU and the UN have actually challenged the legitimacy of drones. msnbc.msn.com/id/37474231/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/
Second- America had no problem carrying out such attacks in Pakistan back before they were cooperating.
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Though I very much respect the ACLU and the UN, I am surprised that you would cite their opinions. So many on this Forum consider anything either says as worthless.

My opinion of the Israeli underhandedness in obtaining those documents stands, but if you are comfortable with what they do, I won’t try to disuade you from your positive image of them. It is enough that we all see and recognize where each of us stands on the incident and on that country.
 
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