Depressed I can't be catholic ;-(

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Also my wife traveled all over the world as a missionary, mainly in predominately eastern orthodox countries to spread the gospel with campus crusade for Christ and has a theology degree.
hhhmmmm…Maybe you should get her to watch some “Journey Home” episodes and maybe talk to someone at the Coming Home Network

I guess I’m still trying to figure out why she won’t do this thing for you - this thing that is so important to you…maybe you don’t want to share it on an open forum and I understand that…I just can’t help but wonder…

Peace
James
 
you really need to contact the diocese about radical sanation. I don’t know why your priest told you it is “rare” or that it didn’t appply to you. It certainly does.

Please contact the judicial vicar of your diocese.
 
If the wife does not believe in the Catholic faith then it is she who is denying him something bigger than herself. What would her objection be? either she sees the Church as authoritative or not. If she does then she should convert. If not then what is the harm in getting her marriage regularized because it is important to the man she supposedly loves…
I understand the point you are trying to make, but for the purpose of our discussion let me change the religions here. Let’s say you met your future spouse at mass. She is a former worshipper of the moon god, but converted to Catholicism. You got married in the Catholic Church. A few years later your spouse, while looking through a long forgotten box, came across a copy of the Text of the Sacred Moon. After some reading and studying, your spouse decided to revert. The only thing keeping your spouse from being in communion with other moon worshippers is the fact that your marriage was not performed naked, under the light of the moon. Until your marriage is moon-validated, your spouse cannot fully participate in the sacraments of moon worship, nor may your spouse have sex with you. Moon-validation is a simple process…you simply profess your love for your spouse while dancing naked under the light of the full moon before a member of the moon-clergy and a few witnesses. This is important to your spouse, the person you supposedly love.

You on board with this?
 
I understand the point you are trying to make, but for the purpose of our discussion let me change the religions here. Let’s say you met your future spouse at mass. She is a former worshipper of the moon god, but converted to Catholicism. You got married in the Catholic Church. A few years later your spouse, while looking through a long forgotten box, came across a copy of the Text of the Sacred Moon. After some reading and studying, your spouse decided to revert. The only thing keeping your spouse from being in communion with other moon worshippers is the fact that your marriage was not performed naked, under the light of the moon. Until your marriage is moon-validated, your spouse cannot fully participate in the sacraments of moon worship, nor may your spouse have sex with you. Moon-validation is a simple process…you simply profess your love for your spouse while dancing naked under the light of the full moon before a member of the moon-clergy and a few witnesses. This is important to your spouse, the person you supposedly love.

You on board with this?
This is a really bad strawman, as a Catholic you shoul have a better understanding of what marital love is about.
 
This is a really bad strawman, as a Catholic you shoul have a better understanding of what marital love is about.
Oh no! You don’t approve of my “understanding of marital love.” How will I go on?

:rolleyes:
 
I understand the point you are trying to make, but for the purpose of our discussion let me change the religions here. Let’s say you met your future spouse at mass. She is a former worshipper of the moon god, but converted to Catholicism. You got married in the Catholic Church. A few years later your spouse, while looking through a long forgotten box, came across a copy of the Text of the Sacred Moon. After some reading and studying, your spouse decided to revert. The only thing keeping your spouse from being in communion with other moon worshipers is the fact that your marriage was not performed naked, under the light of the moon. Until your marriage is moon-validated, your spouse cannot fully participate in the sacraments of moon worship, nor may your spouse have sex with you. Moon-validation is a simple process…you simply profess your love for your spouse while dancing naked under the light of the full moon before a member of the moon-clergy and a few witnesses. This is important to your spouse, the person you supposedly love.

You on board with this?
I like this analogy…It is slightly overboard, but worthwhile to get the ole thought process going…

Of course as a Catholic we would be forbidden from any participation beyond a willingness to profess what we already know is true…Our Love for our spouse…

That said…the analogy is, as I said, a bit overboard since in the thread subject here, we are not talking about a Christian and a pagan but two Christians…people who profess faith in the Same Trinitarian God. So the dynamics would be considerably different and should be less complicated…
That is unless the wife in the OP actually DOES think of the Catholic Church in terms similar to what you describe above…Basically an unchristian cult. (some people do).

Peace
James
 
That is unless the wife in the OP actually DOES think of the Catholic Church in terms similar to what you describe above…Basically an unchristian cult. (some people do).
Remember, the OP’s wife is Baptist. I’ve known more than a few Baptists who regard the Church as an un-Christian cult.
 
This is a really bad strawman, as a Catholic you shoul have a better understanding of what marital love is about.
After almost 20 years of being happily married, I think I have a pretty good handle on what marital love is about. The fact that you and I might not share an understanding on this topic does nothing but give me confidence that I actually got it right.
 
This is a really bad strawman, as a Catholic you shoul have a better understanding of what marital love is about.
After nearly 20 years of being happily married, I think I have a pretty good handle on what marital love is about. The knowledge that you and I don’t share an understanding on this topic is a source of comfort to me.
 
After nearly 20 years of being happily married, I think I have a pretty good handle on what marital love is about. The knowledge that you and I don’t share an understanding on this topic is a source of comfort to me.
The fact that you see as divorce being an option based on your earlier post, you kinda don’t understand Christian Martial Love.
 
Remember, the OP’s wife is Baptist. I’ve known more than a few Baptists who regard the Church as an un-Christian cult.
Yes - This why include that statement in my post.

But by the same token…this view is not universally true of baptists…so I do not want to make an assumption about the OP’s wife and her view.

That said, and tying it back to your analogy, even if his wife is an anti-Catholic baptist, the gulf to be bridged between two people who accept Christ is far less wide than the gulf between a Christian and the worshiper of a “moon goddess”…

Don’t misunderstand…I like your analogy because it sets things off in a very stark contrast and in a way that makes one really think about the mental and spiritual difficulty that might be involved…It’s very good in that way.
I love analogies but, as I’m sure you are aware, they are always limited…In the case of this one, I see the limitation being, as I say above, in the size of the gulf between the two positions.

Peace
James
 
I asked my wife and she said she would go and fill the paper work out. *I asked her why we have conflict over something that is so important to me. Her response was when we got married we moved into my house, *when we had children she quit her job, *basically I make all the major choices in our marriage even if I am making the right choices it makes her feel like no one listens

I also found out that one of the major problems is my divorced “born again” confirmed catholic. That was angry I reached out to her that since she isn’t remarried she could go to confession and take commiunion, which she was told by her born again former catholic pastor since she is divorced she had been permently excommunicated from the catholic church. I printed off something from catholic answers about how she could return to the church.

Thanks everyone
 
I asked my wife and she said she would go and fill the paper work out.
This is wonderful news.
*I asked her why we have conflict over something that is so important to me. Her response was when we got married we moved into my house, *when we had children she quit her job, *basically I make all the major choices in our marriage even if I am making the right choices it makes her feel like no one listens
This too is good news. I say that because she has opened up and confided something deeply troubling to her. Something that you need to prayerfully consider in the broader context of your life together. After all, I’m sure it is not your desire to “lord it over her”. Rather you desire her to be happy, fulfilled and to feel truly a full partner in the life you are building together.
Hold her tightly and let her know a) how grateful you are for her understanding, and b) how important she is to you and how seriously you take her concerns…
I also found out that one of the major problems is my divorced “born again” confirmed catholic. That was angry I reached out to her that since she isn’t remarried she could go to confession and take communion, which she was told by her born again former catholic pastor since she is divorced she had been permanently excommunicated from the catholic church. I printed off something from catholic answers about how she could return to the church.
Have to admit that I don’t really understand what you are saying here.
But I’m glad you got some answers here at CA…👍
Thanks everyone
You are welcome

Peace
James
 
I asked my wife and she said she would go and fill the paper work out. *I asked her why we have conflict over something that is so important to me. Her response was when we got married we moved into my house, *when we had children she quit her job, *basically I make all the major choices in our marriage even if I am making the right choices it makes her feel like no one listens

I also found out that one of the major problems is my divorced “born again” confirmed catholic. That was angry I reached out to her that since she isn’t remarried she could go to confession and take commiunion, which she was told by her born again former catholic pastor since she is divorced she had been permently excommunicated from the catholic church. I printed off something from catholic answers about how she could return to the church.

Thanks everyone
Your 2nd paragraph isn’t clear - I think some info. got left out. Who was it that you told she could return to church? Your MIL? She thought she was excommunicated so she went and got “saved” by a fundamentalist group? Or something like that…And you told her that she isn’t excommunicated and all she has to do is confess and she can receive Christ’s body and blood again? Why would your wife have a problem with this?
 
I know am just the:) Friendly Neighborhood Methodist around here, but I think that some of us (including me!) should be holding this gentleman in our prayers. Along with his wife & her family.
It sounds like a terribly:( painful place to be in, & maybe if enough of us :gopray2:pray about it, the hearts of the wife (& her family) will be softened to realize that his spiritual needs are not going to be met unless & until he is able to return to the practice of the faith that he truly believes in (& is a part of).
:byzsoc: :gopray2: :byzsoc:
 
If he told me that he would be choosing the eucharist over being a husband to me as much as it would tear my heart and our lives in to pieces I think that it would be best for me to know that I wasn’t his first priority and that he found something he loves more. Yeah, we would probably get a divorce.
Here’s what you don’t get about Catholicism…God first…spouse second…yes…that’s the way it REALLY is supposed to be, it’s the way God designed it, so as an atheist, I’m not surprised that you don’t ‘get it’…you aren’t the center of his universe…God is the center of THE Universe.
I’m not going to go any further into it than that… :gopray2:
 
I may be able to offer perspective here. I will be marrying a baptized Catholic outside of the church in just a few months, although we are both atheists. It will be an invalid marriage.

I would not go through a convalidation. I would not cooperate in any way. The desire alone to do that would cause a huge problem in our marriage. Threatening to withhold sex would probably end it.

FH and I are in love, planning our life, getting married in front of all of our friends and family. Not only did we write our own vows we wrote the whole ceremony. We have both made it clear that this is what we want more than anything. If we went through with this and he came to me several years later saying that he needed to make our marriage “real” and have it recognized by the “right” people I would feel like he was cheapening everything we said, everything we went through, and the vows that we had lived out for the last 10 years. Nope, I would probably suggest to him that if he feels like our marriage isn’t right or “valid” that we need to see a marriage counselor.

If he told me that he would be choosing the eucharist over being a husband to me as much as it would tear my heart and our lives in to pieces I think that it would be best for me to know that I wasn’t his first priority and that he found something he loves more. Yeah, we would probably get a divorce.
While I understand what you are saying, I think it is a little more complicated than just that. If your fiance were to later change his mind about the Church and you were to refuse to allow him to live in accordance with his beliefs then you would be rejecting him and throwing him out simply because his way of looking at the world changed. This is a complicated two way street here. In the one case the non-Catholic could feel rejected and hurt, as though the Catholic no longer loved them enough, while for the Catholic it might truly be a matter, not of loving his spouse any less, but rather of realizing that he has to keep his internal integrity and be true to himself and that his unchanged love for his spouse must be expressed in a way which does not go against who he is as a person. People always changed. When one marries they know that they are going to marry a changing person, and yet they still promise to love that person unconditionally and to live for that person, even when that person changes. So the situation could be looked at from the other side, if a spouse changes and wishes to return to the catholic faith is it not the non-catholic spouse who would be rejecting the catholic if they failed to allow them to do this? I guess it all kind of depends on how you view marriage and what you mean by your vows when you say them. After having seen the way that my mother lived out her vows even after she had been abused and cheated on there is no way I could marry someone who would ever mean anything less than an actual absolute commitment no matter what, despite how I might change and I fully intend to do the same. And don’t worry, my mother did not let my father walk all over her. When it became obvious that it was necessary she moved out and took all of us kids with her, moved far far away and raised us by herself. But she never spoke angrily or with resentment about our father to us. She just let us know that he had taken a wrong path in life and that we should pray for him. She would never dream of looking for another man to comfort her or take his place. She had made a truly unconditional commitment and stood by it even in the worst of situations. And watching her has helped me see that actual unconditional commitment to another is truly possible. It is truly possible and it is truly what we all deserve. To divorce someone simply because their philosophy of the world had changed to me definitely falls short of the kind of love and comitment demanded by the unconditional vows of marriage. And please understand that I am not trying to judge you personally in any way shape or form by saying this, but just trying to give you another point of view from which to think about it all. I know that however difficult it would be to deal with being married to someone who changed their beliefs drastically, because of my vows to them I would still stay with them, unless it led to a form of abuse, and even then I would refuse to live with any other man because I intend to truly mean my vows of commiting myself unconditionally to my husband, no matter where that leads me. I hope for the best, and plan for the best, choosing my husband carefully, but if it were to fall apart I will always strive to live up to my mother’s inspiring example of what true comitment and love really is. That is the kind of comitment the Church asks of spouses in marriage, the kind of love we believe is possible because of our belief in a God who has shown us the way through his own unconditional comitment and display of love for us on the cross. And my mother is absolute concrete proof that this is not just some unreachable goal, it is possible for all of us, if we just truly aim for it and set our hearts on it. I understand that this comes from a different worldview, but I cannot imagine a more beautiful life then two people living united to each other through such a mutual unconditional comitment of self.
oh, gosh… I’m kind of just rambling now. so think about it if you wish, or completely ignore it, I don’t care. But please do understand that I do not mean any of this personally.
 
I asked my wife and she said she would go and fill the paper work out. *I asked her why we have conflict over something that is so important to me. Her response was when we got married we moved into my house, *when we had children she quit her job, *basically I make all the major choices in our marriage even if I am making the right choices it makes her feel like no one listens
That is wonderful news. I’m so happy for you. I’m also happy that she opened up to you about a problem what she sees in your marriage. Please talk to her about this. It sounds like she’s been holding a lot in. It would be wonderful if she came home as well.
 
I asked my wife and she said she would go and fill the paper work out. *I asked her why we have conflict over something that is so important to me. Her response was when we got married we moved into my house, *when we had children she quit her job, *basically I make all the major choices in our marriage even if I am making the right choices it makes her feel like no one listens

I also found out that one of the major problems is my divorced “born again” confirmed catholic. That was angry I reached out to her that since she isn’t remarried she could go to confession and take commiunion, which she was told by her born again former catholic pastor since she is divorced she had been permently excommunicated from the catholic church. I printed off something from catholic answers about how she could return to the church.

Thanks everyone
This sounds good! It sounds like you had a real conversation about it. She finally shared her resistance. I never got that in my home. keep listening and talking. Her spiritual growth is important too. If she has a theology degree then she might be interested in Scott Hahn. She might be interested in the church fathers…she might be interested in Thomas Aquinas or some of the other very smart folks we have in our history.
 
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