Did God have a choice in creating Hell?

  • Thread starter Thread starter abucs
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Robertanthony said:
I think JP2 adressed the question of the actual existence of the fires of Hell shortly before 2000, and he commented that they weren’t real fires. I don’t know in what context he said that, if he really did say that, and if that’s binding for us Catholics. And God did prepare Hell for Satan and the myriad of angels who chose him over God, that’s a fact. There’s an abyss between Heaven and Hell, no damned could behold the Trinity if he wanted too. Some people think that Hell will be a place for sinners to engage in sin and pleasures of the senses, and that there’ll be an element of fun, and that the whole of their torment will be to not ever again be in the presence of God, whom their soul recognized as their only good once they died and faced personal judgment. I like to think that’s the case, or that their suffering will gradually decrease over eternity and that “only” the pain of loss will remain, but I think it’s not likely that either scenario will happen.
Click to expand...
Hello Robertanthony, 🙂

Thank you for your contribution to the discussion. I did research your comment about Pope John Paul the Great and the results is creating a problem of understanding for me. I hope some people can iron these things out for me here.

I did not find exactly what you are referencing but will continue to search. But, after what I did find, it would not surprise me that he did express that understanding. I came upon three Wednesday audiences dated 1991. I think they were consecutive, but, I will be back with the link. One of them is dated 21 July 1991. I am very surprised by what he said. According to the Pope hell does not exist and is a state of the soul. This of course is contrary to the Bible. The Pope writes that the biblical references are metaphorical to the spiritual realm. The only way that I could agree with the Pope is by understanding that this understanding was revealed to him in a personal revelation. Saint Augustine wrote that he would not speculate where hell is, that only by a revelation can we come to know it’s location. To come to, what I would describe as a revolutionary understanding of hell as that which the Pope presented in his audiences I would think could only be by private revelation not by deduction or even simple spiritual understanding that may arrive from spiritual growth.

In three controversial Wednesday Audiences, Pope John Paul II pointed out that the essential characteristic of heaven, hell or purgatory is that they are states of being of a spirit (angel/demon) or human soul, rather than places, as commonly perceived and represented in human language. ewtn.com/library/papaldoc/jp2heavn.htm

I find that if the Pope is incorrect it is problematic to present such an understanding because I see that such an understand demeans spiritual understanding and creates obstacles for people to come to know God. It facilitates presenting and viewing spiritual truths as abstract realities. To say, that it is much easier to then go on to day or based on this claim to deduce that Satan does not exist - as many already do. NOt to mention such an understanding of heaven, hell and purgatory poses other problems for people who are seeking God.

Any thoughts?

Peace,

Abba
 
Hell isn’t a “creation”… it is eternal separation of God. More of a state of being than a person, place, or thing. And he didn’t “create” it but allowed its existence when he allowed his creatures to have free will, the choice to accept (heaven/purgatory) or reject (hell) him. I think… :confused:
 
Abba said:
Hello Robertanthony, 🙂

Thank you for your contribution to the discussion. I did research your comment about Pope John Paul the Great and the results is creating a problem of understanding for me. I hope some people can iron these things out for me here.

I did not find exactly what you are referencing but will continue to search. But, after what I did find, it would not surprise me that he did express that understanding. I came upon three Wednesday audiences dated 1991. I think they were consecutive, but, I will be back with the link. One of them is dated 21 July 1991. I am very surprised by what he said. According to the Pope hell does not exist and is a state of the soul. This of course is contrary to the Bible. The Pope writes that the biblical references are metaphorical to the spiritual realm. The only way that I could agree with the Pope is by understanding that this understanding was revealed to him in a personal revelation. Saint Augustine wrote that he would not speculate where hell is, that only by a revelation can we come to know it’s location. To come to, what I would describe as a revolutionary understanding of hell as that which the Pope presented in his audiences I would think could only be by private revelation not by deduction or even simple spiritual understanding that may arrive from spiritual growth.

In three controversial Wednesday Audiences, Pope John Paul II pointed out that the essential characteristic of heaven, hell or purgatory is that they are states of being of a spirit (angel/demon) or human soul, rather than places, as commonly perceived and represented in human language. ewtn.com/library/papaldoc/jp2heavn.htm

I find that if the Pope is incorrect it is problematic to present such an understanding because I see that such an understand demeans spiritual understanding and creates obstacles for people to come to know God. It facilitates presenting and viewing spiritual truths as abstract realities. To say, that it is much easier to then go on to day or based on this claim to deduce that Satan does not exist - as many already do. NOt to mention such an understanding of heaven, hell and purgatory poses other problems for people who are seeking God.

Any thoughts?

Peace,

Abba
Click to expand...
My personal opionion is that satan has done a wonderful job of tricking man to doubt in hell. this will of course gain him more people. Looking at the CCC several areas continue to affirm that everyone will rise at the end and have incoruptable bodies.

These comments can be found reading 997, 998, 999, 1000, 1001, 1059 and there are probably other chapters discussing but I don’t have time to do a complete report.

Jesus isn’t joking with us and explained things like waling and knashing of teeth. Everyone will be reunited with there body and it will be incorruptable. The Good will enjoy paradise and praise God and pretty much do wonderful things we can’t imagine. The evil will experience eternal fire and pain – however you want to imagine that is up to you.

This is a debate that none of us will apparently settle or agree to in our lifetime up to the actual end of the world. So I hope and pray that at least some will come to believe that God knew from the time He created us all of this would come to be. He knew Adam and Eve would sin and He would send Jesus to pay for our sins.

The joice is ours and that is where faith comes in. No one but you can decide. People will sugar coat it for you so you don’t feel bad and continue to sin. I hope you will see why we were given the Sacraments and so many ways to save our soul after accepting Jesus. Baptism (once), Reconciliation (ongoing), Eucharist (ongoing bread of life), prayer and indulgences will help us get there. Annointing at the end if you are fortunate enough to receive.

Nobody but the Father knows so be prepared. That is the real message to live by. It really does get my attention and helps me truly love a loving God that goes to this length to bring us home to Him.

Peace and God Bless
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top