Did You Boycott Church? "Sunday w/o women"

[KostyaJMJ]

There are others ways to save time. Stop having so many Extraordinary Ministers during Communion. Each EM represents another card vessel to be cleaned and put away, requiring mor altar servers too, and requiring 5-10 mins post-Communion time just to “finish.” If parishses cut back on homily time, and used Ems less, they could save at least 10-15 mins, which could then be used for a more reverent and proper treatment of Communion. Of course: imo.

You could also have the priest talk faster and use fewer dramatic pauses. You could also shave some minutes off of the mass by switching to faster ushers or better yet, switching to direct deposit and not passing the collection plate. There are just so many places to improve; it doesn’t seem that anyone focuses on time anymore.

Our parish used to have an elderly priest who averaged 33-36 min masses on Sundays and 15-20 on weekdays. sigh, I really miss him.

 

[Alan55]

If it cannot be said in ten minutes, than you will lose people anyway. Most people have about a ten-minute attention span, like it or not that is just true. Homilies that go on-and-on for 20, 30 and even 40 minutes are most often a waste of time and effort because the vast majority in the pews tune-out after ten minutes. It also shows a lack of efficiency if one cannot keep a homily to ten minutes or less (fifteen minutes maximum). Do not forget, in this era of longer homilies we find people know their faith less well than they did in the past; therefore, longer homilies has not worked to increase the knowledge of faith.

I agree that the Liturgy of the Word is critical, yet the most important part is the actual reading and hearing of the Bible passages. Not the homily.

There is zero doubt the most important part of the Mass is Communion and it should be treated as such. Give it more time and reverence, teach people that hearing the Word of God and than receiving God into their bodies is precisely what the Mass is all about.

There are others ways to save time. Stop having so many Extraordinary Ministers during Communion. Each EM represents another card vessel to be cleaned and put away, requiring mor altar servers too, and requiring 5-10 mins post-Communion time just to “finish.” If parishses cut back on homily time, and used Ems less, they could save at least 10-15 mins, which could then be used for a more reverent and proper treatment of Communion. Of course: imo.

At most Protestant services I’ve attended, the sermon is 30-45 minutes, well-prepared, and the highlight of the service. They work on their sermon all week, devoting many hours to ensuring that it is informative, inspiring, and engaging. I agree that a homily that is ill-prepared and poorly delivered shouldn’t go on that long. Like most Catholics, I can only endure a poor homily for 5-10 minutes before I tune it out. The cure is not to cut the sermon short but to make it better.

I’m a bit baffled by your view that many EMHC’s slow down the service. My experience is just the opposite, at least at services attended by several hundred people, which is the norm in my locale. In San Diego, where I lived up to a couple of years ago, every new church that’s built is required to seat 1000 or more.

As I said earlier, the mass includes both a Liturgy of the Word and Liturgy of the Eucharist. You don’t make the mass “more reverent and proper” by reducing the homily to 5-10 mnutes. Communion is only one aspect of the Mass, albeit an important aspect. Jesus is present in the preached word too.

 

[runningdude]

That is why I don’t understand the controversy. There are so many religions out there, why not pick one that is more in line with your views?

They need to realize that there will never be female priests in the Catholic Church. It’s never going to happen because it is theologically incorrect.

Of course it is impossible to ordain, but its not like we as Catholics can just go and tell people that they should join a Church that matches their beliefs because…

there is ONLY ONE CHURCH!

Yes sadly, we need to excommunicate these woman attempting ordination, and the men that attempt to ordain them, but we have to emphasize that ordination means they cannot seek communion or the sacraments from anyone, because to do so would deepen their departure from the Catholic faith.

Joining a protestant community, or even an “independent catholic” group (I doubt the Orthodox would have anything to do with a female “priest”) could put their souls in danger by giving them false hope. Excommunication needs to be expressed as clearly as possible, with the intend of bringing them back into the Catholic fold.

We of course need to be respectful and avoid humiliating those involved. We want to strengthen our bonds, not sever them.

 

[runningdude]

It is a dichotomy. I presume they understand that they are already in the one, true Church instituted by Jesus Himself. On the other hand, they don’t agree with how Jesus set it up. :banghead:

 

[Holly3278]

Nope, I did not boycott Church. I knew about it beforehand and I chosen to. One of the precepts of the Church is to attend Mass on Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation:

2042 The first precept (“You shall attend Mass on Sundays and holy days of obligation and rest from servile labor”) requires the faithful to sanctify the day commemorating the Resurrection of the Lord as well as the principal liturgical feasts honoring the mysteries of the Lord, the Blessed Virgin Mary, and the saints; in the first place, by participating in the Eucharistic celebration, in which the Christian community is gathered, and by resting from those works and activities which could impede such a sanctification of these days.82

The second precept (“You shall confess your sins at least once a year”) ensures preparation for the Eucharist by the reception of the sacrament of reconciliation, which continues Baptism’s work of conversion and forgiveness.83

The third precept (“You shall receive the sacrament of the Eucharist at least during the Easter season”) guarantees as a minimum the reception of the Lord’s Body and Blood in connection with the Paschal feasts, the origin and center of the Christian liturgy.84

82 Cf. CIC, cann. 1246-1248; CCEO, cann. 881 § 1, § 2, § 4.
83 Cf. CIC, can. 989; CCEO, can. 719.
84 Cf. CIC, can. 920; CCEO, cann. 708; 881 § 3.

Emphasis in underlining mine.

So no, I would not violate one of the precepts of the Church and thereby commit a mortal sin by refusing to go to Mass because of something that the Church itself says is ok! To do so would be to reject the authority of the Church!

That said, I see nothing wrong with female lay ministers such as Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion. I do wish there were more male lay ministers though.

 

[SunnaB16]

True we say that the priest acts in persona Christi. But we also say that the priest acts in persona ecclesiae. Thus, while “[t]he priest take the place of Christ the Bridegroom,” he also takes the place of the Church, the bride, which undercuts the force of your point.

Notice that i said “Among other things,…”. So, i was was concentrating on just one of the roles of a priest.
Baptism and Marriage dont require a priest; but ***for the Mass and the other Sacraments,*** ***hes vital.*** (Hes not a full priest, of course, until hes a bishop, and can confer the Sacrament of Holy Orders.)
You can`t remove in persona Christi without bringing down the whole structure.

I was saying that I don’t understand the notion that women couldn’t function as clerics if they were called to the priesthood. (Indeed, to conflate the distinct issues of women’s capacity to serve with their call is actually to concede the feminists’ point.)

Their gender rules them out.
You can`t have the Life-giving Marital Enbrace (Spiritual) without the Male.

It gives me the horrors when the RFs claim that our Lord was bound by cultural conditions: the pagan religions had priestesses for their goddesses.
Actually, these “Womenpriests” groups are into pagan stuff, anyway.

As you say, though, we both follow the Churchs teaching on this; and thats the main thing.

 

[SimonDodd]

Notice that i said “Among other things,…”. So, i was was concentrating on just one of the roles of a priest. Baptism and Marriage dont require a priest; but for the Mass and the other Sacraments, hes vital. … You can`t remove in persona Christi without bringing down the whole structure.

Sure, I agree; but I’m not talking about soft-peddling or sidelining our appreciation of priests’ role in persona Christi. My point is that priests also act in persona ecclesiae. (Yes, at Mass too. See, e.g.,
Inter Insigniores, no. 5 ¶ 8 (CDF, 1976) (conceding the point in rejecting a somewhat different argument); Dominic Serra, The Roman Canon in Primary readings on the Eucharist 149-50 (Fisch, ed. 2004).) This undercuts your point because if you want to read the priest into the groom side of the marriage image to the extent that he acts in persona Christi, you’d have to articulate some basis for for not reading the priest into the bride side of the marriage image to the extent that he acts in persona ecclesiae.

As you say, though, we both follow the Churchs teaching on this; and thats the main thing.

Right, exactly. It’s fine to debate moot points, so long as it’s in the shadow of a recognition of what the Church teaches. The trouble starts when people discuss this severed from such an acknowledgment, or indicate that they’d like to change the doctrine.

 

[irishpatrick]

At most Protestant services I’ve attended, the sermon is 30-45 minutes, well-prepared, and the highlight of the service. They work on their sermon all week, devoting many hours to ensuring that it is informative, inspiring, and engaging. I agree that a homily that is ill-prepared and poorly delivered shouldn’t go on that long. Like most Catholics, I can only endure a poor homily for 5-10 minutes before I tune it out. The cure is not to cut the sermon short but to make it better.

I’m a bit baffled by your view that many EMHC’s slow down the service. My experience is just the opposite, at least at services attended by several hundred people, which is the norm in my locale. In San Diego, where I lived up to a couple of years ago, every new church that’s built is required to seat 1000 or more.

As I said earlier, the mass includes both a Liturgy of the Word and Liturgy of the Eucharist. You don’t make the mass “more reverent and proper” by reducing the homily to 5-10 mnutes. Communion is only one aspect of the Mass, albeit an important aspect. Jesus is present in the preached word too.

I say this with all respect: all the Protestants have is the sermon. Their entire "service"centers around the Bible passages for that day and than a lenthy sermon that is supposed to be based in those same passages…that is really 90% of what they offer. Not so for the Catholic Churches.

In Catholic Churches we not only hear the Word of God, we have an actual physical encounter with God. The Creator of us and of all things comes to us in HIs Real Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity during Communion…there is nothing like it on earth…it is the actual physical Communing with Almighty God! It is not just hearing and learning about His Word (which of course is very important). Catholics, the moment they receive Communion, are literally and absolutely in true and real Communion with Jesus and the Saints, including Our Lady Mary.It is the most awesome thing on earth. Nothing, literally NOTHING comes close. Heaven opens to us during Communion–every time!

During the Liturgy of the Word the truly important part is the “hearing” of the Word. That needs to be followed by a short homily to expand on what GOD just said to our minds and hearts when we heard the Word of God. There is no need for long homilies, God’s Word says it all very well and quite well enough.

Everything about the Mass builds to Communion.

As for EMs, just watch how long it takes to prepare for all those vessels, to than call all the EMs to the altar, to than allow the EMs to receive the Lord, than the EMs dispurse to their “stations,” than afterwards they all gather back at that altar and the process of gathering the vessels, cleaning them, putting them away, putting the Lord away in the Tabernacle…it all takes a minimum 10 mins away, of not more…go ahead and time it.

Now, remove all that, have two people (Priest, Deacon, EM) at the center of the Church for people to go to to receive the Lord. There will be less training needed for EMs, less abuse of EMs in the Liturgy and less need for altar servers (which means maybe most churches could go back to male only altar servers).

Make the Mass about the Lord, not about people. Communion has turned into a ritual about people, rather than about the Lord.

Of course: IMO.

 

[GKCT]

I did not take part in the boycott, didn’t even know there was one. What was it for–too many EMs or something else?
If our Mass lasted another 15 minutes, it wouldn’t matter as there is enough time left to start another Mass. Seems like everyone is in such a hurry–even some of the priests, it’s too bad. Ours is a large parish and the priests have much to do outside of saying Mass, but should reserve Sundays for a reverent Mass.
I just became a lector at our church and consider it an honor to read the Word of God, but I will not become an EM.
Without women participating in various functions of the church, not much would get done. We need more men participating. We need more priests and deacons who want to serve and not be served.
By the way, I am in no way a women’s libber.

 

[AnotherVoice]

From the article; “Women’s Ordination Worldwide (WOW) stands in solidarity with Catholic women in Ireland who call for a widespread boycott of Mass on Sunday, September 26, 2010.”

They call women to join in sin so they can play a larger role in the church???