Didn't We Learn Anything From London?

[MikeWM]

and what does an arabic man look like to you …describe him please.** Also any idea where i can find out the goverments profile?**

Hmm, same argument in two threads, confusing

The main hint the US Govt. has given to a ‘profile’ is the new form to be filled in for applying for a visa. All men aged 16-45 (I think) have to fill in this additional form, no-one else. The form asks all manner of questions like which countries you have ever visited, what organisations you have ever been a member of, and what chemical knowledge you have (! - yes, including high school chemistry).

So, perhaps these are the specific people they are looking into slightly more closely. Of course, if the bomber is already in the country, like the London bombs, this isn’t much use at all.

Mike

 

[Karin]

MikeWM:

Hmm, same argument in two threads, confusing

The main hint the US Govt. has given to a ‘profile’ is the new form to be filled in for applying for a visa. All men aged 16-45 (I think) have to fill in this additional form, no-one else. The form asks all manner of questions like which countries you have ever visited, what organisations you have ever been a member of, and what chemical knowledge you have (! - yes, including high school chemistry).

So, perhaps these are the specific people they are looking into slightly more closely. Of course, if the bomber is already in the country, like the London bombs, this isn’t much use at all.

Mike

Yes it is confusing!!! And how does the goverment think it will verify these things…people do lie oops did I say that allowed?!

 

[MikeWM]

Yes it is confusing!!! And how does the goverment think it will verify these things…people do lie oops did I say that allowed?!

Well, the theory is that if you are ever found to have been less than honest at any stage, then all immigration privileges go out of the window (even if you have become a naturalised citizen, I believe).

Of course, how the govt. can actually assess the range of your knowledge of Chemistry for example, is anyone’s guess

Mike

 

[Karin]

MikeWM:

Well, the theory is that if you are ever found to have been less than honest at any stage, then all immigration privileges go out of the window (even if you have become a naturalised citizen, I believe).** Yes…but they still have to find you …that seems to be the USA problem…finding people once their visas etc. have expired. **

Of course, how the govt. can actually assess the range of your knowledge of Chemistry for example, is anyone’s guess **and how do they verify what organizations you have belonged to and what countries you have visited? Once again people do lie **
Mike

 

[Brad]

But why not just search everyone?? Then no racial factors come into play. Everyone is treated equally.

Because saving lives takes precedence over inconviencing lives.

 

[MikeWM]

Brad:

Because saving lives takes precedence over inconviencing lives.

Only in some things. If all motor vehicles were limited to 20mph in urban areas, thousands of lives would be saved every year.

Mike

 

[dumspirospero]

There is no reason in wasting time in searching elderly ladies…We know who the terrorist are…we know what they look like…we know how they dress…Not all profiling is discriminatory…some of it is beneficial and good. I don’t see 80 year old white women blowing up planes and trains…I don’t see 50 year old Hindu men blowing up anything…NO, NO, NO…I see 20-40 year old Islamo-Facists blowing up things, therefore IT IS OUR DUTY to stop them and search them and I could care less if their feelings are hurt…Furthermore, if some 20-40 year old white men start blowing up a bunch of things, then I won’t have any problem being stopped and searched anywhere I go. Grow up…This PC **** about profiling is asinine. If we are going to have screeners out their trying to prevent another 9-11, they might as well not waste their time searching harmless old ladies…I don’t care if 80 out of 100 people that enter that airport is Arab…they need to stop all 80 of them and search them. Period. Granted…a cop stopping a black male for no apparent reason while he is driving is horrid and racial profiling at its worst…but come on people…the type of profiling we need in airports, etc is not discriminatory, it is common sense!!! How do you like that Non Politically Correct Point of View?

 

[Karin]

dumspirospero:

There is no reason in wasting time in searching elderly ladies…We know who the terrorist are…we know what they look like…we know how they dress…Not all profiling is discriminatory…some of it is beneficial and good. I don’t see 80 year old white women blowing up planes and trains…I don’t see 50 year old Hindu men blowing up anything…NO, NO, NO…I see 20-40 year old Islamo-Facists blowing up things, therefore IT IS OUR DUTY to stop them and search them and I could care less if their feelings are hurt…Furthermore, if some 20-40 year old white men start blowing up a bunch of things, then I won’t have any problem being stopped and searched anywhere I go. Grow up…This PC **** about profiling is asinine. If we are going to have screeners out their trying to prevent another 9-11, they might as well not waste their time searching harmless old ladies…I don’t care if 80 out of 100 people that enter that airport is Arab…they need to stop all 80 of them and search them. Period. Granted…a cop stopping a black male for no apparent reason while he is driving is horrid and racial profiling at its worst…but come on people…the type of profiling we need in airports, etc is not discriminatory, it is common sense!!! How do you like that Non Politically Correct Point of View?

do i dare ask…what about the americans (born in this country-this makes them American) that are of arab descent…do you group them with arab visitors??

 

[dumspirospero]

Did I say anything about visitors??? If they fit the profile, then they should be searched…especially in light of London considering they were all born and raised there.

Karin:

do i dare ask…what about the americans (born in this country-this makes them American) that are of arab descent…do you group them with arab visitors??

 

[Karin]

dumspirospero:

Did I say anything about visitors??? If they fit the profile, then they should be searched…especially in light of London considering they were all born and raised there.

So it is anyone no matter what nationality if you look Arab you get extra security??
Amazing…I did not see white men getting extra security after the OK City bombing???

 

[dumspirospero]

We are talking about an isolated incident…How many countless acts of terror have been perpetrated by Arab men??? Plus, after OK City, you wouldn’t have seen me complain if there was increased attention payed to young white men…but you know, it is impossible to defend against the occasional crazy person like McVeigh who may blow up a building…they come in all shapes, colors and sizes…the fact remains it was an isolated incident and he was not a part of a larger movement that is worldwide and commiting horrid acts daily throughout the world.

Karin:

So it is anyone no matter what nationality if you look Arab you get extra security??
Amazing…I did not see white men getting extra security after the OK City bombing???

 

[Della]

Karin:

So it is anyone no matter what nationality if you look Arab you get extra security??
Amazing…I did not see white men getting extra security after the OK City bombing???

But, we did see another part of the perps’ profile, angry young white men with a military background who believe the US government is evil and must be destroyed. That was the type of young white men who blew up the Murrah building. And such type of AYWM were gone over with a fine tooth comb by the government after the OK bombing, as they should have been for the general protection of the country. A good many anti-government groups dried up after that and we haven’t had another attack of that kind since.

 

[bellesjoy]

Karin, from what you have posted in this thread, you don’t want arab men profiled, or tax money wasted, yet you are complaining that not enough is being done. From a thread that was just closed, you said you are against a terrorist lists for the airlines and think the feds are going overboard.

I am having trouble understanding just what it is that you would do to protect us aside from what others have already mentined, such as protecting the borders.

I agree with other posters that we can never be 100% safe in this world. However, there are many who are not cooperating in this effort and it is not for lack of money. Portland Oregon (which was already found by the FBI to have an active terrorist cell) refuses to cooperated with the FBI in any regard. Oregon and Portland in particular have among the highest taxes in the nation, yet refuse to even address this problem.

What exactly is it that you would propose to increase our safety?

 

[Karin]

bellesjoy:

Karin, from what you have posted in this thread, you don’t want arab men profiled (i dont want anyone profiled…not just arab men), or tax money wasted, yet you are complaining that not enough is being done. From a thread that was just closed, you said you are against a terrorist lists for the airlines and think the feds are going overboard. Nope never said that I think they need to work on that terrorist list…because people that should not be on it are also the TSA makes it very difficult to get your name off the list if it does not belong there…that is what my problem with that was.

I am having trouble understanding just what it is that you would do to protect us aside from what others have already mentined, such as protecting the borders. By all means protect the borders…Mexican border is still wide open along with Canadian border…

I agree with other posters that we can never be 100% safe in this world. I also agree with that! However, there are many who are not cooperating in this effort and it is not for lack of money. Portland Oregon (which was already found by the FBI to have an active terrorist cell) refuses to cooperated with the FBI in any regard. Oregon and Portland in particular have among the highest taxes in the nation, yet refuse to even address this problem. can you explain this part a bit more…how and why etc.

 

[bellesjoy]

Portland is extremely liberal and does not support anything the present adm. tries to accomplish. Kind of the “bite off you own nose to spite you face” mentaliity. They not only don’t cooperate in the fight against terror, they brag about it. They have tax money for all kinds of causes, but not for this.

Again, what is it exactly that you would do for protection from terroist in the US?

 

[Karin]

bellesjoy:

Portland is extremely liberal and does not support anything the present adm. tries to accomplish. Kind of the “bite off you own nose to spite you face” mentaliity. They not only don’t cooperate in the fight against terror, they brag about it. They have tax money for all kinds of causes, but not for this.
this was the first I had ever heard about this.

Again, what is it exactly that you would do for protection from terroist in the US? Employ enough people to patrol the open borders that this country has (Mexico and Canada along with the miles of unguarded or under-guarded coastline) also give them enough funds to do their job … give Custom’s Officials the equipment/funds and personal that they need to secure shipping ports, Perhaps review once again the INS Immigration Policy in terms of applying for and getting visas etc.

 

[bellesjoy]

I agree with the border ideas which have already been stated, but that is not enough. How would you identify and break up cells that are here now? (many that are supported and hidden by mosques?) How would you prevent terrorists from entering “legally” at the borders or on airlines?

 

[Karin]

bellesjoy:

I agree with the border ideas which have already been stated, but that is not enough. How would you identify and break up cells that are here now?THis I have no reply for (many that are supported and hidden by mosques?) How would you prevent terrorists from entering “legally” at the borders or on airlines? I have no problem with the TSA list…but make sure it is accurate before you put people on it…also perhaps other countries should be as strict as USA as to who gets a passport…perhaps if they were not handed out so easily in other countries this would not be a problem. Sometimes people should just not be allowed to travel outside of their country…known terrorists or people part of known terrorist groups.

 

[Karin]

bellesjoy:

How would you prevent terrorists from entering “legally” at the borders or on airlines?

I replied to this with out seeing that you had the word “legally” in the sentence…why would you want terrorists to enter “legally”?

 

[bellesjoy]

Because they do enter legally with visas, especially from Canada and for student visas, does not mean I want them to! That is an illogical assumption.

Many of the 9/11 were here legally! Many more like them are still in this country. There are more hiding under the cover of mosques, in places like Portland.

What would you do in these situations?