Difference between SJW and Social Justice in CCC

[J_the_Centrist]

These days there really isn’t much of a difference unfortunately. The RCC seems to have effected by much of the same superficial compassion that has entrenched most of society. In Manhattan they have a Franciscan church that celebrates “Pre Pride Mass.’” I don’t think that I have to tell you which kind of “pride” they’re referring too. It’s time, it’s time for most Christians to consider the Orthodox Church as I have, it really is the most unsullied church there is while the others, including the RCC, have changed, morphed and adapted to the times and seasons. I am sincerely not saying this to offend anyone but seriously it is time. It is time.

 

[MikeInVA]

it really is the most unsullied church there is while the others, including the RCC, have changed, morphed and adapted to the times and seasons.

While some parishes and groups may have departed from strict adherence to the Church’s teachings, the Catholic Church is still the one true Church, founded by Jesus and led by St. Peter and his successors.

 

[Crusader30]

Government should stay out of helping the poor since they only make things worse for them

 

[Crusader30]

The Church has money to build soup kitchens and vocational schools for them

 

[mrsdizzyd]

The Church has money to build soup kitchens and vocational schools for them

You aren’t being realistic about how much money the Church has at its disposal…

 

[Maximilian75]

To base a generalization about 1 billion people upon the action of 1 of them is absolutely absurd.

I’m sure the Orthodox have their share of those who go against the grain as well.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

It’s time, it’s time for most Christians to consider the Orthodox Church as I have, it really is the most unsullied church there is while the others, including the RCC, have changed, morphed and adapted to the times and seasons. I am sincerely not saying this to offend anyone but seriously it is time. It is time.

The Orthodox Church willingly chose to separate itself from Jesus’ Church. While they are certainly better off than the Protestant groups, the fact remains that they are no longer part of the Church Christ founded, and therefore no one should seek refuge in them. The superficial trappings of antiquity cannot hide the theological missteps they have taken.

The Church has been through these sorts of ups and downs before, with certain priests and bishops choosing to follow the changing tide of public opinion rather than the Rock. We have weathered each of history’s storms, and we will weather this one as well. We may be smaller for it, that’s generally what happens, but we will grow again, and the whole process will repeat itself ad-infinitum until the end of time.

 

[MonteRCMS]

Is SJW the same as “alt left”?

 

[ProdglArchitect]

We really don’t though. We barely have enough money to keep the services we already have up and running.

All told, the entire Catholic Church, with its thousands upon thousands of charitable organizations and efforts, operates on a budget smaller than Apple’s yearly profits. We do not have the bottomless money bags Protestants and anti-Catholics like to paint us a hoarding. What the Church gets, she gives away, uses to maintain historically significant structures and artwork, or uses to pay the paltry stipend given to her priests, nuns, and brothers.

 

[Genesis315]

Obviously this isn’t the thread for this, but the EOs have also gone along with the times on contraception and divorce, not to mention the doctrinal differences between the Neo-Palamism of the modern EO Churches and the doctrine these Churches proposed for centuries after the schism but prior to this movement (e.g. on things like original sin, indulgences, the canon of scripture, the numbering of the mysteries/sacraments, the delineation between mortal and venial sins, etc., etc.). EO doctrines in general can be a bit of a shell game–there is no where to point to that gives their doctrine on various topics. They also do not have the mark of “one” professed in the Creed and have generally abandoned an ecclesiology that accounts for the “catholic” in Creed. More on these two fundamental issues in a longer prior post here.

 

[J_the_Centrist]

You can not weather something you are succumbing too.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

You can not weather something you are succumbing too.

That presupposes that the entire Church is succumbing, which it is not.

 

[J_the_Centrist]

No, not all by any means but where I live it certainly is the case and I see it going on unopposed and no one seems to care or say anything about it. Perhaps you haven’t heard the many confusing things the Pope has said over the past few years. His successor will likely have a theology much like his because of all of the Cardinals he’s appointed. I can’t understand why so many Catholics can’t accept that since Vatican II the Catholic Church has been falling and falling religiously and spiritually. Sone examples of this are at the church where Francis of Assisi is buried ceremonies have been held where pagan rituals were conducted, fasting is unimportant in the RCC any longer except meat on Friday’s during Lent, the Protestant leanings the Mass has taken since Vatican II and so on. You can deny it all you like but I will reiterate, it is time.

 

[Vonsalza]

Government should stay out of helping the poor since they only make things worse for them

That’s crazy talk.

The Great Society programs initially shouldered by LBJ are depended upon by million of Americans. Housing for the poor? Medicaid? Medicare? Have these lifelines has made life worse for those Americans?

 

[J_the_Centrist]

Original sin is largely rejected but that is attributed to Augustan. In the west there was only one patriarchate, Rome, in the east there were four and they were in full largely in full agreement on the issue.

I never heard of the OC accepting contraception officially and you are wrong on divorce. The OC has accepted divorce up to three times. The first you get married in a church, second only a minor ceremony is allowed and after three times the Church will not allow anymore.

“Catholic” is used in the Creed, I’ve heard it in every Orthodox Church I’ve been to.

However, you’re right this is hardly the place for this discussion. It’s just my two cents.

 

[Vonsalza]

Obviously this isn’t the thread for this, but the EOs have also gone along with the times on contraception and divorce…

No they haven’t… Now, they’re not quite as self-limited as the RCC is on the topics. They have this weird concept of forgiveness and mercy when it comes to those two concepts.

But if someone is saying they’re as permissive as, say, one of the liberal mainlines? Then that person doesn’t know what they’re talking about.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

No, not all by any means but where I live it certainly is the case and I see it going on unopposed and no one seems to care or say anything about it.

A small subset of the world population, and hardly indicative of the whole. I agree with you, the Church in the west is doing poorly, but elsewhere it is growing full of very Orthodox people. You cannot judge the health of the Church based solely on the West.

Perhaps you haven’t heard the many confusing things the Pope has said over the past few years.

Nope, I’ve heard most of them. I agree, I dislike his method of presentation, and I frequently wish he would come down harder on these dissident bishops, priests, and other religious. That said, all the things he’s supposedly said that contradict the Church have been shown to be misrepresentations (“Who am I to judge?” ), or flat out fabrications. (“There is no Hell.”) In his general audiences, he has shown a continued dedication to the historical dogmas of the Church.

I can’t understand why so many Catholics can’t accept that since Vatican II the Catholic Church has been falling and falling religiously and spiritually.

Once again, only in the west, and you cannot place this decline solely at the foot of V2. The culture as a whole has shifted in a more dramatic way than probably any other time in history. It has, wholesale, adopted a more severe anti-Christian, and especially anti-Catholic, stand that is bound to influence those who do not put int he effort to grow in the faith.

I agree that catechesis has been lacking for quite a while, but we are correcting that with amazing results. That also cannot be said to be the fault of V2, since those documents call for the growth of Catechesis. You cannot blame V2 for the people who misapply / ignore it.

Sone examples of this are at the church where Francis of Assisi is buried ceremonies have been held where pagan rituals were conducted, fasting is unimportant in the RCC any longer except meat on Friday’s during Lent, the Protestant leanings the Mass has taken since Vatican II and so on. You can deny it all you like but I will reiterate, it is time.

Cite a source for the “pagan rituals.” Also, bear in mind that even if they did actually happen, that doesn’t reflect the Church or her teaching, only the misguided work of certain members.

Fasting is no unimportant, it’s just not mandated. Once again, that is also primarily in the West.

You are basing your entire view of the Church’s health on your personal experiences and presuppositions about Pope Francis. You are also only focusing on the Church in the West, which is hardly indicative of the entire world.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

No they haven’t… Now, they’re not quite as self-limited as the RCC is on the topics. They have this weird concept of forgiveness and mercy when it comes to those two concepts.

It is not self-limiting to follow the words of the Lord, and artificial mercy and forgiveness cannot outweigh the clearly-named sin of remarrying after divorce. “What God has joined let no man undo.” The Orthodox Church’s “mercy and forgiveness” on this subject is in direct contradiction to Christ’s explicit teaching on the subject.

But if someone is saying they’re as permissive as, say, one of the liberal mainlines? Then that person doesn’t know what they’re talking about.

This I will agree with you on.

 

[Vonsalza]

Vonsalza:

No they haven’t… Now, they’re not quite as self-limited as the RCC is on the topics. They have this weird concept of forgiveness and mercy when it comes to those two concepts.

It is not self-limiting to follow the words of the Lord, and artificial mercy and forgiveness cannot outweigh the clearly-named sin of remarrying after divorce. “What God has joined let no man undo.” The Orthodox Church’s “mercy and forgiveness” on this subject is in direct contradiction to Christ’s explicit teaching on the subject.

They obviously think your understanding of the teaching may be off. Peter and Paul certainly seemed to have have altered “Christ’s explicit teaching” in their own writings - a la “Pauline and Petrine Privilege” and "

Vonsalza:

But if someone is saying they’re as permissive as, say, one of the liberal mainlines? Then that person doesn’t know what they’re talking about.

This I will agree with you on.

Thanks.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

They obviously think your understanding of the teaching may be off. Peter and Paul certainly seemed to have have altered “Christ’s explicit teaching” in their own writings.

There is a stark difference between altering and expanding upon. Peter and Paul never contradicted Jesus. The Orthodox approach to Divorce and remarriage does.