Differences between Catholic Teaching and the Bible

[qui_est_ce]

Yes, but the teaching of the Church is that it is wrong to put meat into your mouth on a day of abstinence. This is what may defile you by so doing, just as it defiled the Jews when they were not observing their rules and regulations on dietary restrictions.

REPEAT, it is NOT THE MEAT WHICH DEFILES.

 

[sbanks]

Bobzills:
Have we moved on to your next topic. I just want to make sure we answer questions as you go along in your journey.

1. Call no man your father.
2. Women don’t wear pants
3. Headcoverings for women.
4. Meat on Fridays - seems like we have beat that one down too.

Whenever your ready to move to the next topic.

 

[rinnie]

Yes, but the teaching of the Church is that it is wrong to put meat into your mouth on a day of abstinence. This is what may defile you by so doing, just as it defiled the Jews when they were not observing their rules and regulations on dietary restrictions.

For starters Jews dont believe in the NT. They dont believe Jesus is God, They are still waiting for their God. Second Jews dont eat pork that is why Jesus said it is not what goes in to your mouth that is a sin its what comes out of it. For goodness sake what are you talking about? As far as the Church goes yes we believe in the CC. We believe that the Church was started by Christ and left to Peter, Peter becomes the pope thru years and years and yes we believe in tradition, Now there still is no differences between the churchs teachings and the bible. Now to say you dont believe in the CHurch ok. We understand that, but does that have to do with Jesus telling the jews that they can eat pork.

 

[bobzills]

Second Jews dont eat pork that is why Jesus said it is not what goes in to your mouth that is a sin its what comes out of it. For goodness sake what are you talking about?

I am talking about Scripture and the quotation from Matthew 15:11
“It is not what enters into the mouth that defiles the man, but what proceeds out of the mouth, this defiles the man.”

 

[bobzills]

I am sorry but you have no idea what you are talking about. It is one thing to argue about the RCC and disagree with the Religion, that is your right, but for goodness sake at least know what the heck you are talking about. CCC 1855 Mortal sin destroys charity in the heart of man by grave violation of Gods law it turns man away from God, who is his ultimate end and his beatitude, by preferring an inferior good to him. VENIAL SIN allows charity to subsist, even though it offends and wounds it. unquote. Now i am sorry but eating a hotdog on lent is not turning you away from God and going to send you to hell…

Well, thanks for being sorry, but I am sorry too, that your opinion that to break the law of abstinence is a venial sin has been anathematised and condemned by the Pope. …“the law of abstinence embodies a serious obligation whose transgression, objectively considered, ordinarily involves a mortal sin. The unanimous verdict of theologians, the constant practice of the faithful, and the mind of the Church place this point beyond cavil. They who would fain minimize the character of this obligation so as to relegate all transgressions, save such as originate in contempt, to the category of venial sin are anathematized by Alexander VII [Cf. Prop. 23, ap. Bucceroni, Enchiridion Morale, 145 (Rome, 1905)].”
Further…“In fine, the Trullan synod (can. 58, ap. Hefele, “History of the Councils of the Church”, V, 231, Edinburgh, 1896) inflicts deposition on clerics and excommunication on laymen who violate this law. Furthermore, theologians claim that **a grievous sin is committed as often as flesh meat is consumed in any quantity on abstinence days **(Sporer, Theologia Moralis super Decalogum, I, De observ. jejunii, # 2, assert. II), because the law is negative, and binds semper et pro semper. In other words, the prohibition of the Church in this matter is absolute.”
newadvent.org/cathen/01067a.htm

 

[bobzills]

Bobzills:
Have we moved on to your next topic. I just want to make sure we answer questions as you go along in your journey.

1. Call no man your father.
2. Women don’t wear pants
3. Headcoverings for women.
4. Meat on Fridays - seems like we have beat that one down too.

Whenever your ready to move to the next topic.

I haven’t finsihed yet with meat on Fridays and how it relates to the Scriptural quote from Matthew 15:11.

 

[bobzills]

Bobzills:
Have we moved on to your next topic. I just want to make sure we answer questions as you go along in your journey.

1. Call no man your father.
2. Women don’t wear pants
3. Headcoverings for women.
4. Meat on Fridays - seems like we have beat that one down too.

Whenever your ready to move to the next topic.

Actually, in reading through the Bible, one thing that bothers me is the passage from Ecclesiastes 7:3
"
3 Sorrow is better than laughter,
because a sad face is good for the heart. "
If sorrow is better than laughter, then why have the clown Mass. Isn’t the clown Mass put on in order to provoke laughter?

 

[peary]

Well, thanks for being sorry, but I am sorry too, that your opinion that to break the law of abstinence is a venial sin has been anathematised and condemned by the Pope. …“the law of abstinence embodies a serious obligation whose transgression, objectively considered, ordinarily involves a mortal sin. The unanimous verdict of theologians, the constant practice of the faithful, and the mind of the Church place this point beyond cavil. They who would fain minimize the character of this obligation so as to relegate all transgressions, save such as originate in contempt, to the category of venial sin are anathematized by Alexander VII [Cf. Prop. 23, ap. Bucceroni, Enchiridion Morale, 145 (Rome, 1905)].”
Further…“In fine, the Trullan synod (can. 58, ap. Hefele, “History of the Councils of the Church”, V, 231, Edinburgh, 1896) inflicts deposition on clerics and excommunication on laymen who violate this law. Furthermore, theologians claim that **a grievous sin is committed as often as flesh meat is consumed in any quantity on abstinence days **(Sporer, Theologia Moralis super Decalogum, I, De observ. jejunii, # 2, assert. II), because the law is negative, and binds semper et pro semper. In other words, the prohibition of the Church in this matter is absolute.”
newadvent.org/cathen/01067a.htm

bobzilla - did you by any chance check the date on that? 1905?? 1896??? What century do you think we are living in?

 

[bobzills]

bobzilla - did you by any chance check the date on that? 1905?? 1896??? What century do you think we are living in?

But it says clearly that the prohibition is absolute? What does it mean that the prohibition is absolute and what does it mean to be anathematised if you believe that eating meat on a day of abstinence is a venial sin?

 

[peary]

But it says clearly that the prohibition is absolute? What does it mean that the prohibition is absolute and what does it mean to be anathematised if you believe that eating meat on a day of abstinence is a venial sin?

OK, let’s say you are right. What exactly, in your opinion, constitutes a ‘venial’ sin?

 

[bobzills]

OK, let’s say you are right. What exactly, in your opinion, constitutes a ‘venial’ sin?

Again, we are going off topic, but if you need to know about it, a venial sin is a sin that does not result in a complete separation from God, and meets at least one of the following criteria:

it does not concern a “grave matter”,
it is not committed with full knowledge, or
it is not committed with both deliberate and complete consent.

 

[bobzills]

I am sorry but you have no idea what you are talking about. It is one thing to argue about the RCC and disagree with the Religion, that is your right, but for goodness sake at least know what the heck you are talking about. CCC 1855 Mortal sin destroys charity in the heart of man by grave violation of Gods law it turns man away from God, who is his ultimate end and his beatitude, by preferring an inferior good to him. VENIAL SIN allows charity to subsist, even though it offends and wounds it. unquote. Now i am sorry but eating a hotdog on lent is not turning you away from God and going to send you to hell. .

Since I don;t know what I am talking about, how do you explain the Apostolic Constitution on Penance? Pope Paul VI published Paenitemini, the Apostolic Constitution on Penance, February 17, 1966. It provided for abstinence from meat for all the faithful over 14 years of age. Paenitemini, Chapter III, section C, Norm II, states: “1. The time of Lent preserves its penitential character. The days of penitence to be observed under obligation through-out the Church are all Fridays and Ash Wednesday, that is to say the first days of “Grande Quaresima” (Great Lent), according to the diversity of the rite. Their substantial observance binds gravely. 2. Apart from the faculties referred to in VI and VIII regarding the manner of fulfilling the precept of penitence on such days, abstinence is to be observed on every Friday which does not fall on a day of obligation, while abstinence and fast are to be observed on Ash Wednesday or, according to local practice, on the first day of ’Great Lent’ and on Good Friday.”

 

[rinnie]

okay first quote ccc 2174 Jesus rose from the dead on the first day of the week. because it is the first day the day of Christs Resurrection recalls the first creation, because it is the eight day following the sabbath it symbolizes the new creation ushered in by Christs Resurrection. For Christians it has become the first of all days, the first of all feasts, the Lords Day (he kuriake hemera, dies dominica) Sunday. unquote Now do you want to send check or cash. secondly mortal sin turns man away from God. venial sin allows charity to subsist even though it offends and wounds it. Eating meat on Good Friday and Ash Wed for a Catholic is wrong i dont disagree with that. But it offends and wounds it does not mean you are turning away completely from God. THere is a big difference. My point which i may have misunderstood you with the pork is we dont go by Jewish law. mortal sin is grave matter specified by the ten commandments do not kill, do not commit adultery, do not steal, venial sin does not break the covenant with God. Not believing in him also a commandment does.

 

[rinnie]

if you want the exact quote ccc One commits venial sin when in a less serious matter he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law. or when he disobeys the moral law in a GRAVE MATTER, but without full kmowledge or without complete consent. unquote.

 

[planter654]

if you want the exact quote ccc One commits venial sin when in a less serious matter he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law. or when he disobeys the moral law in a GRAVE MATTER, but without full kmowledge or without complete consent. unquote.

This might be a stupid question but was lent established in the time of Jesus. What was commanded to do on the passover in Jesus time. How did the Jews prepare for it? What was the traditions or laws they fallowed in celebration of the Passover? How many days did it last. It was also a celebration was it not? Praising and thanking God? The coming to together within the community of the faithful. Weren’t all the feast days a huge celebration in giving thanks and praise to God for his abundant blessings with their crops, rain, harvest time etc. How many days of celebration. did not they last some for weeks. The beginning and end were they commanded by God when it started etc.

Is the Catholic teaching and celebration be followed as done with what is written in the Bible?

I don’t know how CC deceided if there were changes made according to the command of God and God’s laws in celebrating his feast days that were pleasing and acceptable to God in our worshipping God? do the Jews today who believe in Jesus still celebrate it the same way?

Thanks God Bless

God Bless

 

[rinnie]

I am talking about Scripture and the quotation from Matthew 15:11
“It is not what enters into the mouth that defiles the man, but what proceeds out of the mouth, this defiles the man.”

I am sorry, not sarcastic sorry, sometimes i just get a little frustrated, let me try this. okay in Matthew, 15 See the jews went by the OT. Now Jesus changed alot of things. one the pork law. see what i mean, that is what he meant when he said dont worry about what my disciples are eating the jews believed pork to be unclean, that when Jesus more or less said its not what you eat that is going to send you to hell, its what you do and say. see what i mean? Now this is a true story,my Dad lived by this jewish man sammy, now he would never eat pork, my Dad asked him why, this is what HE said. do you remember when Jesus was casting out demons, and a pig ran by and Jesus cast the demon into the animal. Okay this guy took that as pork being forbidden still, he felt pork was still unclean. get it unclean (unclean spirit) he didnt understand what Jesus was saying. Now the Jews did believe that Jesus existed and was a great teacher, that is what this man told my Dad. but we all know they dont believe that Jesus was the Messiah. Does that help any? AGAIN I AM SORRY FOR COMMING ON RATHER STRONG. when i read it again i could see that it may have been seen that way. Now again that is what this man told my Dad. I am not speaking for all Jews.

 

[planter654]

Bobzills:
Have we moved on to your next topic. I just want to make sure we answer questions as you go along in your journey.

1. Call no man your father.
2. Women don’t wear pants
3. Headcoverings for women.
4. Meat on Fridays - seems like we have beat that one down too.

Whenever your ready to move to the next topic.

I am just asking is the name Pope not mean Father?

Thanks God Bless

 

[rinnie]

This might be a stupid question but was lent established in the time of Jesus. What was commanded to do on the passover in Jesus time. How did the Jews prepare for it? What was the traditions or laws they fallowed in celebration of the Passover? How many days did it last. It was also a celebration was it not? Praising and thanking God? The coming to together within the community of the faithful. Weren’t all the feast days a huge celebration in giving thanks and praise to God for his abundant blessings with their crops, rain, harvest time etc. How many days of celebration. did not they last some for weeks. The beginning and end were they commanded by God when it started etc.

Is the Catholic teaching and celebration be followed as done with what is written in the Bible?

I don’t know how CC deceided if there were changes made according to the command of God and God’s laws in celebrating his feast days that were pleasing and acceptable to God in our worshipping God? do the Jews today who believe in Jesus still celebrate it the same way?

Thanks God Bless

God Bless

See I dont know anything much about the Jewish law. So i really cant say, But this is what i learned about Passover before Jesus was crucified, okay noon was when they slaughtered the lambs for Passover. Now go back to old law remember the blood on the doors, Now 12 noon is when they made the decision to slaughter Jesus. See how it ties in together, The Lamb, the blood, Now I am the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. See go back to the OT now go to the NT Jesus fullfilled it. Now i am not the Pope, I dont have the gift of the Holy Spirit to give me divine wisdom, but i guess you could call this lent today, but these People didnt realize what was going on until Jesus had risen to prove he was Christ. see what i mean? So to say was it lent back then i would say no. Hope that answers your question.

 

[planter654]

See I dont know anything much about the Jewish law. So i really cant say, But this is what i learned about Passover before Jesus was crucified, okay noon was when they slaughtered the lambs for Passover. Now go back to old law remember the blood on the doors, Now 12 noon is when they made the decision to slaughter Jesus. See how it ties in together, The Lamb, the blood, Now I am the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. See go back to the OT now go to the NT Jesus fullfilled it. Now i am not the Pope, I dont have the gift of the Holy Spirit to give me divine wisdom, but i guess you could call this lent today, but these People didnt realize what was going on until Jesus had risen to prove he was Christ. see what i mean? So to say was it lent back then i would say no. Hope that answers your question.

thnak you very much for your answer! God Bless you

 

[rinnie]

I am just asking is the name Pope not mean Father?

Thanks God Bless

Yes we call him the Holy Father. according to the Jerome Biblical Comentary the use of the title father began in monasteries as a form of address to the abbot as father of the monastic family. it was then extended to other monks who served spiritual directors and later generally applied to clergy.