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BartholomewB
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You needn’t go to the trouble of doing all the calculations yourself. Bishop Ussher has already done them for you.
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twf
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The Big Bang theory isn’t “new age” at all. As others have said, it was first formulated by an astronomer who was also a Catholic priest, Monsignor Lemaitre…though he called it the Cosmic Egg Hypothesis. It actually provided a scientific perspective on a finite universe with a beginning…that is, a created universe. The Big Bang means the universe started… who was behind the Big Bang? As a Catholic a Christian I would say God, of course.
The atheists of the time were scandalized by the Big Bang, because they were imagining an eternal universe that had simply always existed.
The atheists of the time were scandalized by the Big Bang, because they were imagining an eternal universe that had simply always existed.
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buffalo
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Local Flood
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The_Old_Maid
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@meltzerboy2 :
But … But … it cannot be! The film had Noah kill his cousin on the Ark.
It also had him leave his granddad out in the Flood to die whilst picking berries.
Seriously, though, is there a legend that Methuselah died 7 days before the Deluge? The LORD gave Noah seven days to mourn, and then the Flood. Inquiring minds want to know!
Hmm. According to that Noah film, that would make you either Methuselah or Tubal-Cain!
But … But … it cannot be! The film had Noah kill his cousin on the Ark.
It also had him leave his granddad out in the Flood to die whilst picking berries.
Seriously, though, is there a legend that Methuselah died 7 days before the Deluge? The LORD gave Noah seven days to mourn, and then the Flood. Inquiring minds want to know!
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Aulef
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Do a better research. You will find interesting things
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The_Old_Maid
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(Raises hand …)
All you young’uns and your fancy-dancy Intelligent Design! What are you, some kind of fundagelicals???
Why, in my day, we were brought up real, true Creationists. We were taught that there were no such things as dinosaurs. Those bones were the bones of the Nephilim; the scientists just put them together all wrong. How else could the bones have survived the Deluge, except that they had a supernatural inheritance? Whereas all the sinners were pulverized by the waters, and that’s why no one ever found humans remains to this day.
Nowadays you Intelligent Designers have all these consarned newfangled ideas about how the dinosaurs survived because Noah brought their eggs aboard the Ark! You believe in dinosaurs! What … what … accommodating the world, that’s what it is. You’re just accommodating the world. Dates are small potatoes compared to critters. And you kids get off my lawn!!!
…
As you can, see, I grew up in interesting times. The fundy side of the family was so fundy that those Left Behind books look liberal in comparison. And the mainstream side of the family was so mainstream that I was allowed to read constantly, especially history and science. They compromised by agreeing … well, they almost never compromised or agreed, except that I should avoid smut.
…
So, we’re going to read? Okay, let’s read.
A few years ago I saw in passing a Sefer Ha-Aggadah. The stories argue that when the LORD created space-time, the ratios were different. Apparently more got done in the same amount of time. There was a specific example given: if Adam and Eve liked a tree and thought the Gan should have more of it, they could plant the seed or nut or shale in the morning. Then, by noontime, the seed would have grown into a mighty tree giving its fruit in its season.
But when Adam and Eve sinned, the LORD had mercy upon them. He changed the ratios of space-time so that humanity would not fall into the current and be swept away. (Mighty hard for the Messiah to accomplish what has to be done if a man is born, lives, and dies in a matter of minutes.) The result is the world we see today. Time never changed, but matter did.
The storyteller uses more poetic language, but that’s the gist of it.
Which, by the way, would explain how the universe can look 13.8 billion years old. If it were under 10,000 years, the night skies would be dark. The light of the distant stars wouldn’t have arrived here yet.
And how Clare Patterson can date the earth at 4.54 billion years. (Bill Bryson tells that one in one of his books.)
But a fundamentalist following Ussher’s chronology could have only a few thousand years after the Fall of Man.
The Jewish legend give us a way that matter simply did more in the same amount of time.
I’m guessing Einstein didn’t know that legend. It would have helped him with his frustration with
quantum entanglement. A storyteller could argue that the speed of information between particles is merely the speed at which all the material universe used to operate.
All you young’uns and your fancy-dancy Intelligent Design! What are you, some kind of fundagelicals???
Why, in my day, we were brought up real, true Creationists. We were taught that there were no such things as dinosaurs. Those bones were the bones of the Nephilim; the scientists just put them together all wrong. How else could the bones have survived the Deluge, except that they had a supernatural inheritance? Whereas all the sinners were pulverized by the waters, and that’s why no one ever found humans remains to this day.
Nowadays you Intelligent Designers have all these consarned newfangled ideas about how the dinosaurs survived because Noah brought their eggs aboard the Ark! You believe in dinosaurs! What … what … accommodating the world, that’s what it is. You’re just accommodating the world. Dates are small potatoes compared to critters. And you kids get off my lawn!!!
…
As you can, see, I grew up in interesting times. The fundy side of the family was so fundy that those Left Behind books look liberal in comparison. And the mainstream side of the family was so mainstream that I was allowed to read constantly, especially history and science. They compromised by agreeing … well, they almost never compromised or agreed, except that I should avoid smut.
…
So, we’re going to read? Okay, let’s read.
A few years ago I saw in passing a Sefer Ha-Aggadah. The stories argue that when the LORD created space-time, the ratios were different. Apparently more got done in the same amount of time. There was a specific example given: if Adam and Eve liked a tree and thought the Gan should have more of it, they could plant the seed or nut or shale in the morning. Then, by noontime, the seed would have grown into a mighty tree giving its fruit in its season.
But when Adam and Eve sinned, the LORD had mercy upon them. He changed the ratios of space-time so that humanity would not fall into the current and be swept away. (Mighty hard for the Messiah to accomplish what has to be done if a man is born, lives, and dies in a matter of minutes.) The result is the world we see today. Time never changed, but matter did.
The storyteller uses more poetic language, but that’s the gist of it.
Which, by the way, would explain how the universe can look 13.8 billion years old. If it were under 10,000 years, the night skies would be dark. The light of the distant stars wouldn’t have arrived here yet.
And how Clare Patterson can date the earth at 4.54 billion years. (Bill Bryson tells that one in one of his books.)
But a fundamentalist following Ussher’s chronology could have only a few thousand years after the Fall of Man.
The Jewish legend give us a way that matter simply did more in the same amount of time.
I’m guessing Einstein didn’t know that legend. It would have helped him with his frustration with
quantum entanglement. A storyteller could argue that the speed of information between particles is merely the speed at which all the material universe used to operate.
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buffalo
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Soft tissue has been found in dino bones. They said there is no way it could last 65 million years. C14 dating of dino bones has been shown to be around 28,000 years old.
Men saw dinosaurs…
Men saw dinosaurs…
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puer.dei
Guest
“They” – actual scientists – say no such thing.
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buffalo
Guest
Uh huh… “The authors believe that the cross-linking reactions they found evidence of, combined with the protection offered from being surrounded by dense mineralized bone, can explain how original soft tissues persist.” (it is enough the authors believe, right? Convincing…)
Of course they had to scramble to come up with this.
Of course they are certain of how old they are. “the team analyzed a sample from a 66-million-year-old Tyrannosaurus rex tibia to provide evidence that vertebrate blood vessels”
Some good story telling.And the biologos article doubles down on the age of the rocks.
What do we make of a 65 million year old rock having remains dating 28,000 years old? C14 must be wrong because we just know they are 65 million years old. They have to be…
BTW - soft tissue is turning up in more places.
Men saw dinosaurs.
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DanielJosephBoucher
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Thanks for all of your comments. Everyone has their own perspective. Dinosaurs really are quite a mystery.
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Dan_Defender
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Very true. St Augustine was not a young earther, he did not interpret Genesis literally.
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buffalo
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Need to read deeper into St Augustine.
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Wesrock
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St. Augustine is on record stating that a literal seven day creation need not be taken literally and even postulated an instantaneous creation. Of course he lacked any type of evidence (due to the means not being available) that the universe was billions of years old specifically. I don’t know if I’d call him an “old earther”. He had no reason to be in the sense we mean it today. But his writings on interpreting the creation narrative and scripture indicate he’d probably have been open to it if he had today’s evidence available.Dan_Defender:
Need to read deeper into St Augustine.
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buffalo
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Will you cite the specific passages and where he was as far as his journey of understanding went?
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umamibella
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They really are not. They were in most cases very large, mammoth mega sized creatures that roamed the earth at one time and have left fossil records in both material artefacts and things like imprints of feet.
What is the mystery?
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Gorgias
Guest
The ancients had access to fossils, too.
Yep. I see them every time I go to the museum. Other than that… no.
I agree. You do. He interpreted the creation story allegorically.
Read Augustine’s “On the Literal Meaning of Genesis”. He completed it in 415 AD, when he was 61.
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davidharper
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There are many verses in the bible which cannot possibly be factual. Read Matthew 27 ; 51-53.
This does not diminish the value of it. it just means that it must be interpreted in it’s historical context. The ancient authors didn’t know or care about science. They were telling stories in order to convey theological “truths” as they understood them. Genesis was originally written between approx. 950 and 700 B.C. during the period of the monarchy in ancient Israel. And it had at least three original authors.
My son in law is Jewish and I was surprised to learn that most Jews actually don’t believe in a literal interpretation at all. Most don’t believe in hell or in an afterlife. My daughter converted to Judaism to marry him. About her conversion she told me " who cares. It’s only religion". I was raised catholic but I stopped practicing as soon as I was about 16 years of age. It seems to me that if God really did create us He would have done so by means of a natural process just like evolution. He’s not a magician. He doesn’t wave his God wand and POOF! we appear.
This does not diminish the value of it. it just means that it must be interpreted in it’s historical context. The ancient authors didn’t know or care about science. They were telling stories in order to convey theological “truths” as they understood them. Genesis was originally written between approx. 950 and 700 B.C. during the period of the monarchy in ancient Israel. And it had at least three original authors.
My son in law is Jewish and I was surprised to learn that most Jews actually don’t believe in a literal interpretation at all. Most don’t believe in hell or in an afterlife. My daughter converted to Judaism to marry him. About her conversion she told me " who cares. It’s only religion". I was raised catholic but I stopped practicing as soon as I was about 16 years of age. It seems to me that if God really did create us He would have done so by means of a natural process just like evolution. He’s not a magician. He doesn’t wave his God wand and POOF! we appear.
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Wesrock
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I appreciate the rest of your post, but I can’t help but comment on this “as soon as I was old enough to think for myself”, comment, as if we are masters of critical thinking at sixteen. I’ve heard some say as young as nine. Honestly, I was the same way. I drifted away. I thought critically about science. The Faith was what my parents taught me but not my own. It wasn’t until over a decade later that I started thinking even more critically about certain suppositions I was taking for granted, and it brought me back to the Faith.
I’m not trying to undermine your own personal journey here, whatever direction you go. But maybe rethink telling it with the words “as soon as I learned to think for myself,” maybe doubly so with such a young age involved. It smacks of ironic edgy atheist memes.
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buffalo
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This cannot be factual? Why?
Moses compiled Genesis from tablets already in his possession.
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davidharper
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yes. you’re right. the phrase you mention was disrespectful. I deleted it.
too bad we can’t delete all of our past sins in this way, isn’t it?
too bad we can’t delete all of our past sins in this way, isn’t it?
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