Discordianism

[Eris_Discordia]

I had no idea you were formerly Catholic. Correction, you still are Catholic. Your baptism and first communion never leave you. Only you leave the Church.

This is true, I was baptized. I’m surprised you didn’t know, I’m sure I’ve mentioned it a lot. I left at 18, but I would be considered apostate, because I no longer participate.

I can tell you honestly that morality isn’t subjective. Either God created the world, gave us a moral code by which to live, or He didn’t and life is random chaotic happenstance. I reject the latter and embrace the former. Are you totally willing to reject Jesus as your savior? He died on the Cross, suffered a horrendous Passion, took on humanity for your sake and mine, and rose again. Can you say discordianism has a deity that took on the flesh of humanity and suffered the same poverty, cold, heat, loneliness, laughter, illness, family, love, loss, and death that you and I experience

I reject the teachings of the Church, and refuse to accept that it is the only truth out there. I cannot accept the infallibility of the Pope, because I cannot believe that one man has the truth, and that everyone else is wrong. He is human, just as we are, and cannot know the mind of God any more than we do. I cannot believe in the Bible as true, but as something that is far to open to the faulty interpretation of man. Jesus, as a historical figure, had a great amount of wisdom, and was tortured and killed because he was a rebel, and stood up for his beliefs and died for them. This is something I can absolutely respect, and I feel as though the Church fails in doing his teachings justice.

Why were you “miserable” as a Catholic? Imagine a God who loves you so much, He died for your sins. He then offers you His flesh and blood daily at communion, gives you a room to walk into with a priest to wipe away your sins and failings, gives you a mouth to sing song to Him, the Bible to know His word, 2,000 years of ecclesiastical understanding and study of Him, and in the end you will spend eternity in peace, joy, and the intimacy of God Almighty. That makes you miserable? Is it so outrageous that this God would expect you to follow rules? Your parents had rules. My classroom has rules. Rules shape, protect, and guide us. Chaos is idiotic in every context. Imagine a parent with no rules. You don’t have to go to school, can have sex at 12 years old, can stay out till 2am, can fight cheat and steal. No problem. Or in my classroom I’ll let kids insult each other, talk while I teach, lie, go home when they feel like it, you name it. Some classroom. Some childhood…some life. Your life is meant to have rules, boundaries, and morality to keep you whole and a child of God. You sound like you’re in open rebellion from God and you want to be your own God. I don’t mean to sound offensive but it sounds like you’re in a time of upheavel and rebellion. You want a God that will rubber stamp what you like and don’t like. A God who validates parking?

I’m actually not doing this for rebellion, surprisingly. If I was, then this post wold be filled with a bunch of teenage “I hate my parents! They’re so horrible!”, stereotypical teenage ranting. . I am very respectful of my mother’s faith, and while I don’t share it, I recognize that it is important to her, and would never belittle it or insult it. My mother and I have gotten through a lot, and she is my hero and one of the most important people in the world to me. She takes care of me, respects me, and respects that I don’t share her beliefs. She prays that I will come back to the Church, but she is still accepting. She is stronger than anyone else I have ever met, and I can say that honestly. She took care of my father when he was dying, worked 40+ hours a week, and sent me to Catholic school (Which is a lot better than the public schools in my area), all on a single wage, and now she is helping me get through college so I can get a better education.

Now onto my explanation of why I was miserable. As I have said, I cannot accept the moral authority of the Pope, and disagreed with the Church on a lot of major issues. I remember my breaking point, when a priest equated homosexuality and murder as being equal. As a bisexual with a majority of my friends being homosexual, it offended me. Even before that, I questioned everything about why Catholicism is the only true faith. I questioned the Church’s moral authority on a lot of issues, and I came out on the opposite side of them. I don’t feel as though the Church should regulate my life, and that I should be forced to follow things I completely disagree with. I was miserable because I was stifled, and felt like I had no control over my life, because I could not disagree. I refuse to follow something that I do not believe to be true. I was not going to confess to things I felt were not wrong, and I was not going to listen to someone other than my own self on faith. I feel as though faith is personal, and I don’t like all of the prerequisites that go along with the Church. If you believe in the Church, and everything that goes with it, it is completely acceptable, and I will respect your faith to the fullest, but for me, I couldn’t do it. I tried, sincerely, but I could not reconcile my personal beliefs with that of the Church’s. If I was absolutely sure that God, and not man, made the rules, then I would gladly follow them.

Had to post twice… Little bit to long…

*edit: grammar

 

[Eris_Discordia]

Sorry I can’t sugarcoat when I find something to be ridiculous. As I recall other posts in this thread suggested that she go on Jerry Springer or some other talk shows. Why not complain to those people about their insults towards the great and respectable Discordian religion? Maybe I should have suggested other talk shows she could go on, in order to make sure that I include enough constructive criticism to please you and make my post worthy of being read by you, since you of course are being forced to read it.

You didn’t have to read, and you didn’t have to post. Since I am the OP, I will continue to post, because I refuse to abandon a thread I created. I will also not back down in the face of insult, and allow you to bully me. Debate me, in a respectable way, or leave. I’ve never insulted your faith, and have been respectful, I expect the same courtesy. Insult me for that, and for my faith, and for anything else. Doesn’t make you look intelligent, it makes you look like a jerk. I’m not saying that my religion is the best thing ever, and true, because while it is to me, it’s not for everyone. Don’t make it out like I was trying to convert you, or anyone else. You’re mind is so closed to learning anything about things you do not understand, so you put others down and insult them for being different. Very Christ-like of you. :tsktsk:

*edit: You have the wrong poster anyway, so I cant speak for the poster who posted

 

[cyberwolf001]

Eris I am excommunicating you for the above and de-excimmunicating you and making you a saint just cuz I can

I’m still going over this threads but it seems to be Catholics could use Discordianism to point out why having more than one Pope is a VERY bad idea. Unless of course your goal is chaos.

 

[chaunceygardner]

I have to thank the OP for providing one of the funniest threads I have ever seen on this forum. No disrespect intended. When I read the first few posts it seemed that this had to be a tongue-in-cheek creation by the author, with some veiled jabs at organized religion, at the plethora of religions in the world, at the overt seriousness of some posts on this forum, and at our gullibility in general (the “scripture” passage re: the radio). The doctrine about the hot dog buns is hilarious. At least in this religion they seem concerned with healthy dietary habits. Talk about LOL.

The big clue to this presentation is in the last doctrinal item ***Eris ***listed:

A Discordian is prohibited from believing what he reads.

Is this something like saying: “This statement is false”? Did April Fools day come early this year?

At the same time, when you eliminate the silliness, some of the core beliefs presented by our young OP are really quite reasonable, and many conform with the teachings of Jesus (perhaps a residual effect of all that Catholic upbringing).

And I can understand and appreciate why you feel the way you do about the Catholic Church, and the issues you have with its doctrines and authority. Unfortunately, most of the rules of the church and its claims to authority do come from men, not from God.

Thanks again for giving me a chuckle, as well as some things to think about. Both from what ***Eris Discordia ***told us about his “religion” but also from some of the reactions. A good lesson.

Hey Eris, do you write for The Onion? You should!

 

[Eris_Discordia]

I have to thank the OP for providing one of the funniest threads I have ever seen on this forum. No disrespect intended. When I read the first few posts it seemed that this had to be a tongue-in-cheek creation by the author, with some veiled jabs at organized religion, at the plethora of religions in the world, at the overt seriousness of some posts on this forum, and at our gullibility in general (the “scripture” passage re: the radio). The doctrine about the hot dog buns is hilarious. At least in this religion they seem concerned with healthy dietary habits. Talk about LOL.

The big clue to this presentation is in the last doctrinal item ***Eris ***listed:

Is this something like saying: “This statement is false”? Did April Fools day come early this year?

At the same time, when you eliminate the silliness, some of the core beliefs presented by our young OP are really quite reasonable, and many conform with the teachings of Jesus (perhaps a residual effect of all that Catholic upbringing).

And I can understand and appreciate why you feel the way you do about the Catholic Church, and the issues you have with its doctrines and authority. Unfortunately, most of the rules of the church and its claims to authority do come from men, not from God.

Thanks again for giving me a chuckle, as well as some things to think about. Both from what ***Eris Discordia ***told us about his “religion” but also from some of the reactions. A good lesson.

Hey Eris, do you write for The Onion? You should!

LOL. I’m a girl , actually. Do I seem like a guy? I would love to write for the Onion. I could be creative and get a good point across! I minor in creative writing.

I’m glad it gave you a chuckle. The Principia Discordia itself is hilarious. It is actually considered by some to be a parody religion, not unlike the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It’s just not agreed upon whether it is or not, which is probably the point.

Thanks for being chill. I’m really glad I made you think.

As for me, I take the Principia with a grain of salt, of course, but I take the idea as a whole and believe in that. That’s why I call myself Discordian.

 

[Eris_Discordia]

Eris I am excommunicating you for the above and de-excimmunicating you and making you a saint just cuz I can

I’m still going over this threads but it seems to be Catholics could use Discordianism to point out why having more than one Pope is a VERY bad idea. Unless of course your goal is chaos.

yay! Thank you very much, Cyberwolf.

 

[GKC]

LOL. I’m a girl , actually. Do I seem like a guy? I would love to write for the Onion. I could be creative and get a good point across! I minor in creative writing.

I’m glad it gave you a chuckle. The Principia Discordia itself is hilarious. It is actually considered by some to be a parody religion, not unlike the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It’s just not agreed upon whether it is or not, which is probably the point.

Thanks for being chill. I’m really glad I made you think.

As for me, I take the Principia with a grain of salt, of course, but I take the idea as a whole and believe in that. That’s why I call myself Discordian.

I was 98% certain you were female.

Of course it’s a parody religion. Unlike the really serious stuff, such as the Church of the SubGenius. Slack!

GKC

 

[Eris_Discordia]

I was 98% certain you were female.

Of course it’s a parody religion. Unlike the really serious stuff, such as the Church of the SubGenius. Slack!

GKC

Never heard of it. What is this Church you speak of?

 

[GKC]

Never heard of it. What is this Church you speak of?

Unless that’s intended to be fnord, then google J. R. “Bob” Dobbs and Church of the SubGenius. You may know one of his wives.

GKC

 

[Eris_Discordia]

Ah yes, I know what it is now. I didn’t know it had a name.

 

[GKC]

Ah yes, I know what it is now. I didn’t know it had a name.

Yep. Like Bokononism.

GKC

 

[Eris_Discordia]

I need to read Vonnegut. As an English major, I am ashamed to say I haven’t read him yet… He’s on the massive list of authors I need to read.

 

[GKC]

I need to read Vonnegut. As an English major, I am ashamed to say I haven’t read him yet… He’s on the massive list of authors I need to read.

I never enjoyed him, save for “Harrison Bergeron” (and not necessarily what Vonnegut was intending in it) . CAT’S CRADLE almost made me give up science fiction, . That, and Dick’s THE THREE STIGMATA OF PALMER ELDRITCH. But I put all that behind me, 45 years ago.

GKC

 

[manualman]

Oh thank goodness the cat is out of the bag. I’m still internally debating if VHEMT is satire or not…

 

[chaunceygardner]

LOL. I’m a girl , actually. Do I seem like a guy? I would love to write for the Onion. I could be creative and get a good point across! I minor in creative writing.

Sorry about that, it was inadvertent. I tried to stay gender neutral as I wasn’t sure but slipped up at the end.

I’m glad it gave you a chuckle. The Principia Discordia itself is hilarious. It is actually considered by some to be a parody religion, not unlike the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It’s just not agreed upon whether it is or not, which is probably the point.

Thanks for being chill. I’m really glad I made you think.

As for me, I take the Principia with a grain of salt, of course, but I take the idea as a whole and believe in that. That’s why I call myself Discordian.

I love parody and humor especially when it sticks a pin in the inflated egos and pomposity found in certain people, systems and ideas.

I will also recommend Vonnegut, particularly the short stories. I first read “Harrison Bergeron” several decades ago and read it again in the last few months. As GKC points out, there is more than one way of understanding it.

 

[GKC]

Oh thank goodness the cat is out of the bag. I’m still internally debating if VHEMT is satire or not…

I occasionally urge it upon selected sub-groups.

GKC

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I wouldn’t get into a murder is = to being gay debate. I think both are serious sins but obviously murder is far more serious and with far more horrific consequences. Murder is about as serious as it gets. But being gay and bisexual is a sin, no question about it. I’m sorry to hear that you’ve gone down that road and that you’d embraced secular culture to this degree. Really in the end it’s either the Christian faith or its the secular religion, no real in between. The “freedom” one feels in turning his/her back on Christ Jesus is not a freedom at all but a sad prison. I’m saddened to hear that you’ve turned your back on the faith of your childhood and of your mother. Maybe like St. Monica and her son, Augustine, mom’s prayers will in fact win you back someday. I pray that is so.

I think you need to dig deep and ask yourself why you’re on a Catholic message board. I know that if I felt as you do about Catholicism and I was in your situation with your view of the world, Catholic message boards would be the very last place on earth I would be frequenting. Just a hunch, just a feeling, but I think a bit of your old Catholic skin is still in the DNA and you feel a draw to it. Maybe you’re not ready to admit it or get near it, but maybe your Catholic faith is still there in some form. I pray it is.

I challenge you to go to Ash Wednesday, open your heart to God, turn away from the futile, chaotic, sad secular generation we live in. I think it’s Chesterton (GKC could correct me and probably will ) who said words to the effect that Catholicism is the only thing that keeps a man from being a child of his generation. Food for thought. May God bless you.

This is true, I was baptized. I’m surprised you didn’t know, I’m sure I’ve mentioned it a lot. I left at 18, but I would be considered apostate, because I no longer participate.

I reject the teachings of the Church, and refuse to accept that it is the only truth out there. I cannot accept the infallibility of the Pope, because I cannot believe that one man has the truth, and that everyone else is wrong. He is human, just as we are, and cannot know the mind of God any more than we do. I cannot believe in the Bible as true, but as something that is far to open to the faulty interpretation of man. Jesus, as a historical figure, had a great amount of wisdom, and was tortured and killed because he was a rebel, and stood up for his beliefs and died for them. This is something I can absolutely respect, and I feel as though the Church fails in doing his teachings justice.

I’m actually not doing this for rebellion, surprisingly. If I was, then this post wold be filled with a bunch of teenage “I hate my parents! They’re so horrible!”, stereotypical teenage ranting. . I am very respectful of my mother’s faith, and while I don’t share it, I recognize that it is important to her, and would never belittle it or insult it. My mother and I have gotten through a lot, and she is my hero and one of the most important people in the world to me. She takes care of me, respects me, and respects that I don’t share her beliefs. She prays that I will come back to the Church, but she is still accepting. She is stronger than anyone else I have ever met, and I can say that honestly. She took care of my father when he was dying, worked 40+ hours a week, and sent me to Catholic school (Which is a lot better than the public schools in my area), all on a single wage, and now she is helping me get through college so I can get a better education.

Now onto my explanation of why I was miserable. As I have said, I cannot accept the moral authority of the Pope, and disagreed with the Church on a lot of major issues. I remember my breaking point, when a priest equated homosexuality and murder as being equal. As a bisexual with a majority of my friends being homosexual, it offended me. Even before that, I questioned everything about why Catholicism is the only true faith. I questioned the Church’s moral authority on a lot of issues, and I came out on the opposite side of them. I don’t feel as though the Church should regulate my life, and that I should be forced to follow things I completely disagree with. I was miserable because I was stifled, and felt like I had no control over my life, because I could not disagree. I refuse to follow something that I do not believe to be true. I was not going to confess to things I felt were not wrong, and I was not going to listen to someone other than my own self on faith. I feel as though faith is personal, and I don’t like all of the prerequisites that go along with the Church. If you believe in the Church, and everything that goes with it, it is completely acceptable, and I will respect your faith to the fullest, but for me, I couldn’t do it. I tried, sincerely, but I could not reconcile my personal beliefs with that of the Church’s. If I was absolutely sure that God, and not man, made the rules, then I would gladly follow them.

Had to post twice… Little bit to long…

*edit: grammar

 

[Le_Cracquere]

I must admit that I’ve always been fond of the Discordians’ initiation ceremony (for those Discordians whose boat such ceremonies float):

"The Priest begins:

I, [complete Holy Name, with Mystical Titles, and degrees, designations, offices, etc.], Ordained Priest of the Paratheo-anametamystikhood of Eris Esoteric, with the Authority invested at me by the High Priest of It, Office of the Polyfather, The House of the Rising Podge, POEE Head Temple; Do herewith Require of Ye:
1) ARE YE A HUMAN BEING AND NOT A CABBAGE OR SOMETHING?
The Initiate answers ‘YES.’
2) THAT’S TOO BAD. DO YE WISH TO BETTER THYSELF?
The Initiate answers ‘YES.’
3) HOW STUPID. ARE YE WILLING TO BECOME PHILOSOPHICALLY
ILLUMINIZED?
The Initiate answers ‘YES.’
4) VERY FUNNY. WILL YE DEDICATE YESELF TO THE HOLEY ERISIAN
MOVEMENT?
The Initiate answers ‘PROBABLY.’ "

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

It sounds funny on the surface but in the eternal scheme of things it’s pretty sad stuff. We’re given a life by God to use in praise of His glorious name, given a mind with which to know and love God deeply, and we have the opportunity to theologically grow. Instead someone cooks up this silly initiation and makes light of real religion and it seems a semi-mockery of the renewal of baptismal vows at a baptism rite. Pitiful…

I must admit that I’ve always been fond of the Discordians’ initiation ceremony (for those Discordians whose boat such ceremonies float):

"The Priest begins:

I, [complete Holy Name, with Mystical Titles, and degrees, designations, offices, etc.], Ordained Priest of the Paratheo-anametamystikhood of Eris Esoteric, with the Authority invested at me by the High Priest of It, Office of the Polyfather, The House of the Rising Podge, POEE Head Temple; Do herewith Require of Ye:
1) ARE YE A HUMAN BEING AND NOT A CABBAGE OR SOMETHING?
The Initiate answers ‘YES.’
2) THAT’S TOO BAD. DO YE WISH TO BETTER THYSELF?
The Initiate answers ‘YES.’
3) HOW STUPID. ARE YE WILLING TO BECOME PHILOSOPHICALLY
ILLUMINIZED?
The Initiate answers ‘YES.’
4) VERY FUNNY. WILL YE DEDICATE YESELF TO THE HOLEY ERISIAN
MOVEMENT?
The Initiate answers ‘PROBABLY.’ "

 

[Lion_of_Narnia]

I’ve read some Robert Anton Wilson and feel he is a highly intelligent man who’s gon a little bit off the deep end from occultism, drugs, and personal tragedy (his daughter Luna’s brutal murder)–also he’s a VERY alienated from his Catholic upbringing