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hosemonkey
Guest
Well said!
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Paul_G
Guest
Some say you have spoken well, However, I must disagree with you, the Roman Church did not write the scriptures the apostles did, and yes I receive much joy from reading their words. I agree with you that the creedal statements of Christendom of the time mostly did agree together (Not a complete agreement) on a definition of deity, and if you compare what the apostles wrote to what Christendom wrote you would be hard pressed to see any relation between the two.
I also agree there is something deeply wrong here. With respect, as far as being monotheistic that was the redefinition of the creeds, not the reality as I read from the scriptures.
Paul
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RebeccaJ
Guest
The Old Testament is well populated with pronouncements of One God…it is a major point and theme throughout. Christianity does not throw out the entire teachings of the Old Testament. The entire Bible is studied, as a whole, and is seen as a progression. Christ being a fulfillment of the prophesies found in the Old Testament, he revealed more about Himself as God and Man, but He did not ever say that He changed nature from what He revealed in the Old Testament, to what He taught to the Apostles.
The Apostles knew this. There is One God, and Jesus reveals to the Apostles over the time of His Ministry that One God is comprised of three divine co-eternal Beings. John addresses this very specifically.
On the other hand, using the entire Bible as a guide for What God Is, in no way can lead anyone to the polytheistic view of mormonism. Never is there a teaching that God reveals He is One of Many.
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Marc1152
Guest
Problem number one is your understanding of the History of the Church. You are right when you say the ROMAN Church didn’t write or compile the scriptures. Rome was one jurisdiction among several ( Jerusalem, Antioch, Alexandria, later Constantinople and others). There was but one Church, which was both Catholic ( universal) and Orthodox ( right faith) both Eastern and Western until about 1054 when East and West split.
None of the writers of scripture were not part of that one unified Church. For example, we can still find communities (Local Churches) founded by St. John. In our Eastern Orthodox Church we have parishes still operating founded in the first and second centuries,
And if you are having trouble accepting that the Church wrote the Scriptures then let’s just remember that THE Church compiled them. It was done formally via a local council of the Church and then later ratified by an Ecumenical Council of the entire Church. That is simply an historical fact.
Remember, there was no “Bible” for several centuries before the Church decided to set them out in a final canon. But Protestants think the Church was long gone by then. How could that be? Did we make a brief reappearance? Of course not. The Church founded on the day of Pentecost never disbanded or went away or fell away. If you adhere to the scriptures than you owe thanks to THE Church that wrote them and complied them.
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RebeccaJ
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kbmorri
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kbmorri
Guest
Yes, but you twist Jesus Christ into sounding the same in order to convert innocent people into your cult unaware of the evil you are trully professing
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kbmorri
Guest
All you have to do is prove the apostacy. You believe that the church didn’t exist until joeseph smith founded it again. So how do you get around the fact that Jesus said that the gates of hell will NOT prevail against His church and that He will be with Her till the end of times? You CANNOT PROVE the apostacy because it never happened and therefore your cult is leading many good people in the gates of hell.
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kbmorri
Guest
Again…try, just try to prove the apostasy. NO evidence, your theory on central and southern americas have been totally dissproven. Nowhere and at no time have we ever worshipped an idol. We worship God alone. You don’t even know who He is…that is the shame of it all.
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kbmorri
Guest
That is soooooooo funny.
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kbmorri
Guest
Exellent shot. Nothing but the bottom of the net!
I have tried to tell a mormon friend of mine the same thing. All he does is says that what he says is true with no factual foundation. I ask him to prove the apostacy and he changes the subject.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
Except for one thing. Often when people leave mormonism they have no grasp of Christian theology. Do not know Christian history. And continue in this belief that Christianity is FALSE. Many a former mormon reason their way to atheism in this way.
I often see the very same statements said by zerinus, why me, Paul G and every other mormon that are said by atheists who come from a mormon background.
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why_me
Guest
For questions about mormons and mormonism please go here:
lib.byu.edu/Macmillan/
Just type your request into the search and see what happens. Not all mormons know their faith that well. The same for catholics.
lib.byu.edu/Macmillan/
Just type your request into the search and see what happens. Not all mormons know their faith that well. The same for catholics.
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why_me
Guest
How many catholics know christian history? How many catholics have the intelligence to read a good history book of christianity? I am sure many but many also don’t.
Mormonism makes sense. It puts many things into a good box. It is difficult to disbelieve it. The lds church has many answers that make complete sense. And the truth claims can make sense too. When someone looses faith in the lds church it is difficult to believe in another church. There can be a feeling of incompleteness to that other faith. Thus, atheism can be the result. Or many former mormons head over to the half-way house as found in the Unitarian Universalist church.
I posted the website to the Encylopedia of Mormonism. Their doctrine of the preexistence makes sense, complete with bible references. Hence the problem.
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why_me
Guest
Since mormons believe in a pre-existence or in a premortal life, life has already begun. In the preexistence, spirits are waiting for a physical body. They achieve this physical body upon birth. So one can claim that human life begins upon birth.
Let me put it this way: Women have miscarriages all the time. Does this mean that life has ended upon miscarriage? Probably not. Since we existed before we came to this earth as spirit children of Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother, we wait for that physical body and when that physical body is achieved the spirit ‘continues to live and function in the mortal body’.
In Jer. 1:5 we read: ‘Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations’. This makes clear that God knew Jeremiah in the pre-existence. And in Eccl. 12:7, it reads: 'and the Preacher asserted ‘The spirit shall return unto God who gave it’
And so, when does life begin? Upon birth when the body receives the spirit meant for that body.
But then again, I could be wrong.
Lucifer was also a spirit being who rebelled against god. Hence he became satan. And this makes him a brother of christ and in some strange way, our brother too. We lived together in the premortal life. Satan and his followers were cast out and became demons seeking to destroy the plan of salvation. What satan envies most about us is our physical bodies. He seeks to destroy our physical bodies because he was denied such a body as were his followers.
Let me put it this way: Women have miscarriages all the time. Does this mean that life has ended upon miscarriage? Probably not. Since we existed before we came to this earth as spirit children of Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother, we wait for that physical body and when that physical body is achieved the spirit ‘continues to live and function in the mortal body’.
In Jer. 1:5 we read: ‘Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations’. This makes clear that God knew Jeremiah in the pre-existence. And in Eccl. 12:7, it reads: 'and the Preacher asserted ‘The spirit shall return unto God who gave it’
And so, when does life begin? Upon birth when the body receives the spirit meant for that body.
But then again, I could be wrong.
Lucifer was also a spirit being who rebelled against god. Hence he became satan. And this makes him a brother of christ and in some strange way, our brother too. We lived together in the premortal life. Satan and his followers were cast out and became demons seeking to destroy the plan of salvation. What satan envies most about us is our physical bodies. He seeks to destroy our physical bodies because he was denied such a body as were his followers.
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Marc1152
Guest
With all due respect, of all the popular religons out there I tseems to me that Mormonism is the easiest to dismiss right out of hand.
It is so clearly an outgrowth of 19th pop culture, the theology and historical claims is so “made up looking”, the motivations of it’s founder are so sepcious that reasonable people dont need much more to convince them to stay clear.
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pigtown
Guest
In quoting Jeremiah 1:5 you are proving that life begins before birth! My granddaughter still has about a month to go before she is born but she has life now. She’s not a blob but is a living, human being.Since mormons believe in a pre-existence or in a premortal life, life has already begun. In the preexistence, spirits are waiting for a physical body. They achieve this physical body upon birth. So one can claim that human life begins upon birth.
Let me put it this way: Women have miscarriages all the time. Does this mean that life has ended upon miscarriage? Probably not. Since we existed before we came to this earth as spirit children of Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother, we wait for that physical body and when that physical body is achieved the spirit ‘continues to live and function in the mortal body’.
In Jer. 1:5 we read: ‘Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations’. This makes clear that God knew Jeremiah in the pre-existence. And in Eccl. 12:7, it reads: 'and the Preacher asserted ‘The spirit shall return unto God who gave it’
And so, when does life begin? Upon birth when the body receives the spirit meant for that body.
But then again, I could be wrong.
Lucifer was also a spirit being who rebelled against god. Hence he became satan. And this makes him a brother of christ and in some strange way, our brother too. We lived together in the premortal life. Satan and his followers were cast out and became demons seeking to destroy the plan of salvation. What satan envies most about us is our physical bodies. He seeks to destroy our physical bodies because he was denied such a body as were his followers.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
Mormonism makes NO sense. God once was a man who was created by another God, and that God once was a man who was created by another God, and so-on to infinity. WHO WAS THE FIRST GOD? WHO created all the matter in the universe that these gods make things out of? There is nothing in the Bible that can lead anyone to believe such nonsense.
Difficult to feel a completeness in another faith? Really? That is nothing but pure mormon propaganda.
Have you ever been to a UU church? They are not a halfway house. That is a ridiculous thing to believe let alone say.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
This is God telling Jeremiah that he formed his soul. Before he was BORN, He dedicated the life to be to a purpose. This says nothing about the pre-existence that mormons believe in.In Jer. 1:5 we read: ‘Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations’. This makes clear that God knew Jeremiah in the pre-existence. And in Eccl. 12:7, it reads: 'and the Preacher asserted ‘The spirit shall return unto God who gave it’
And so, when does life begin? Upon birth when the body receives the spirit meant for that body.
But then again, I could be wrong.
Lucifer was also a spirit being who rebelled against god. Hence he became satan. And this makes him a brother of christ and in some strange way, our brother too. We lived together in the premortal life. Satan and his followers were cast out and became demons seeking to destroy the plan of salvation. What satan envies most about us is our physical bodies. He seeks to destroy our physical bodies because he was denied such a body as were his followers.
Satan was an angel. Really why me, for someone who claims to be Catholic you should know this stuff.
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mangy_dog
Guest
Because mormonism is a cult/sect that denies that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh - is precisely the reason it sets them into the anti-christian category.
Please notice the words I used, “Jesus Christ is come in the flesh” (Douay-Rheims). This is not only a passage affirming the Lord’s Incarnation, it is a “test”.
Personally, once the conversation with mormons turns from amiable to profane or blasphemous, I use the tools and weapons available to me. The words, “Jesus Christ is come in the flesh” will test the spirit within each person. A person that does not speak with the Spirit of God, cannot bring themselves to physically utter these words. Usually when I say them, they will say something like, “of course” or “we believe that too”. At which point I indicate that these words need to be repeated verbatim, without variation, to confirm that the spirit with which you speak is not of the anti-christ. It never fails…they are not able to pronounce the words without changing or varying the text. Same thing goes with jehovah witnesses.
I once had two jehovah witnesses pack-up and leave quicker than I’ve ever seen anyone move, simply because I said those words.
Mormons and jehovah’s witnesses are not only not christians but they are anti-christians.
A blessed St. Benedict crucifix has a similar effect to that of TV vampires. I could go on and on about different encounters, some of them quite scary, but all of these have been defeated with the spiritual weapons that have been given to us. The Rosary, St. Benedict Crucifix medal, prayers of excorcism: Vade retro satana…and Sancte Michael Arcangele…etc etc etc.
I urge you my catholic brothers and sisters - don’t get wrapped around the axle with doctrines of demons; hate the sin and pray for & love the sinner.
Be charitable in your approach but when the iniquities and snares of the devil make themselves obvious…the gloves come off.
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.
Please notice the words I used, “Jesus Christ is come in the flesh” (Douay-Rheims). This is not only a passage affirming the Lord’s Incarnation, it is a “test”.
Personally, once the conversation with mormons turns from amiable to profane or blasphemous, I use the tools and weapons available to me. The words, “Jesus Christ is come in the flesh” will test the spirit within each person. A person that does not speak with the Spirit of God, cannot bring themselves to physically utter these words. Usually when I say them, they will say something like, “of course” or “we believe that too”. At which point I indicate that these words need to be repeated verbatim, without variation, to confirm that the spirit with which you speak is not of the anti-christ. It never fails…they are not able to pronounce the words without changing or varying the text. Same thing goes with jehovah witnesses.
I once had two jehovah witnesses pack-up and leave quicker than I’ve ever seen anyone move, simply because I said those words.
Mormons and jehovah’s witnesses are not only not christians but they are anti-christians.
A blessed St. Benedict crucifix has a similar effect to that of TV vampires. I could go on and on about different encounters, some of them quite scary, but all of these have been defeated with the spiritual weapons that have been given to us. The Rosary, St. Benedict Crucifix medal, prayers of excorcism: Vade retro satana…and Sancte Michael Arcangele…etc etc etc.
I urge you my catholic brothers and sisters - don’t get wrapped around the axle with doctrines of demons; hate the sin and pray for & love the sinner.
Be charitable in your approach but when the iniquities and snares of the devil make themselves obvious…the gloves come off.
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.
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