Disturbing Night At Youth Mass! Please Read

[justnmartr]

EddieArent:

The sanctuary is NOT a social hall. It’s offensive to the congrgation and God. I and other true keepers of the faith want to attend the house of God with sacred music (not heretical hymnns, not rock and roll. GIve me a choir singing Gregorian chant - the official music of the Latin Rite , FOR ONCE!), sacred images, and sacred revereance without hearing about what is going on in your personal life. Save that selfish stuff for the cafeteria or whereever you can meet and discuss such topics that have no reverance to God.

I read this and several thoughts came to mind. First was the statement, “I and other true keepers of the faith…” Who are you too assume that people who attend these types of masses are not keepers of the faith? You sound like a person who wants to keep the traditional music. Also in an attempt to include more people, which the constitution of the liturgy recommends, newer music is required. I am all for the traditional masses but not everyone is ready for a traditional mass. If we ease these youth into it, they will hopefully fall in love with the mass.

The other thought I had was about “selfish stuff” I agree that it should be reverent and not in the church. But sometimes people need to talk to one another in order to inform others of some of the problems they are having and to pray for them (if they are there for the right reasons). We cannot go around condemning these teenagers who atleast show up, which is more than many adults. We need to not be so critical all the time other wise we become more concerned with what others are doing and not what you are doing, which should be adoring God. We do not know what is in the hearts of men and women, so we are not fair judges.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

justnmartr:

I read this and several thoughts came to mind. First was the statement, “I and other true keepers of the faith…” Who are you too assume that people who attend these types of masses are not keepers of the faith? You sound like a person who wants to keep the traditional music. Also in an attempt to include more people, which the constitution of the liturgy recommends, newer music is required. I am all for the traditional masses but not everyone is ready for a traditional mass. If we ease these youth into it, they will hopefully fall in love with the mass.

The other thought I had was about “selfish stuff” I agree that it should be reverent and not in the church. But sometimes people need to talk to one another in order to inform others of some of the problems they are having and to pray for them (if they are there for the right reasons). We cannot go around condemning these teenagers who atleast show up, which is more than many adults. We need to not be so critical all the time other wise we become more concerned with what others are doing and not what you are doing, which should be adoring God. We do not know what is in the hearts of men and women, so we are not fair judges.

Justnmartr: The PM isn’t working or I would have contacted you privately. What does your signature mean?

 

[AnnieD]

We still have that kind of Mass to not look forward to at our church, Gregory. Our new priest wants to turn our noon mass into a contemporary Mass with a band.


Annie

 

[Anna_Elizabeth]

justnmartr:

You sound like a person who wants to keep the traditional music. Also in an attempt to include more people, which the constitution of the liturgy recommends, newer music is required.

Really? Do give us a reference. I presume you are referring to the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, but, whatever, do tell where you came up with that, please.

But sometimes people need to talk to one another in order to inform others of some of the problems they are having and to pray for them (if they are there for the right reasons).

Am I mistaken, or were some of these young people really sitting on the backs of the pews? I hope that I’m interpreting this incorrectly.

I have the uncomfortable feeling that your information here is from the same strange source from which you obtained your liturgical music information. I haven’t seen a single post that suggests that we “condemn these teenagers.”

What I have seen, especially in the Catechism, is ample evidence that the Church requires us to evaluate actions of ourselves and others in light of the teachings of Scripture, the Tradition and the Pope and the Magisterium. You effectively nullify the whole purpose of the Commandments and the Beatitudes when you abnegnate your responsibility to draw conclusions.

And as one who has spent decades working with students, I can tell you that you are doing them no favor whatsoever if you permit raucous behavior in the House of God. (And guess what? A lot of them know it and think ill of you.)

Anna

 

[misericordie]

pnewton:

I went to one lifeteen Mass and avoid them like the plague. However, none of us here know that it was an invalid Mass, even the poster, since he did not stay. As to lack of reverence, the youth I witnessed at lifeteen were extremely reverent during the Eucharistic liturgy. I prefer silence before Mass, but it is not a liturgical abuse to practice the music prior to Mass.

I do not like Lifeteen, so I do not go. I still can appreciate the diversity of our faith and applaud those priest who reach out to the young people of today, along with adults like robertaf.

But next time I **must **go, I’ll take ear plugs.

I agree: here is a gathering after a so called LIFETEEN MASS in a church:http://www.traditio.com/comment/com0306e.jpg

 

[LouisvilleCards]

I’m excited to hear that there are parishes out there that are welcoming young people and their style of music and worship. My cousin used to have trouble getting the priest at his old church to even let the youth group band play modern songs in place of some of the hymns at Mass on World Youth Day. I like a lot of things about the Catholic Church, but I can’t stand all these rules that restrict parishes from reaching out to the people around them who need the gospel because of some damn rule. Lighten up! Someone earlier said a lot of Catholic youth can be found in Protestant churches. I know for a fact that’s happening in Louisville. About 20% of the population around Louisville is Catholic, but the youth are leaving because the church they grew up in is clueless. And if you were to attend the Sunday night services the Southern Baptist church I go to and ask around, you would discover a lot of former Catholics. Praise God that he is able to use the church catholic, not just the Catholic Church, to call these people back to him! Be glad that your youth are still in church… their passion and love for God is what every church needs.

 

[Marines]

Gregory,

I would definately suggest you look into any approved Latin Masses in your area. Some may be a little farther away than you are used to but you sound like you have the guts for it.

• Joe

 

[RichT]

Adam S:

Well, i dont know who you are, your post sounded pretty sarcastic to me, and to someone else as well. Its difficult to say what someones saying over a forum - you must know that.

Also, just because you’ve done a lot with the Church doesnt mean you arent sarcastic, in fact it has no relevance whatsoever, so why throw all the things you’ve done at me? We were having a debate about what is needed from a youth mass, not throwing credentials at each other.

Anyway, back to my original post, since you have all this experience (and you are American i presume) could you tell me if you have encountered similar to what i have found? It would be interesting to hear an older (no offense intended ) opinion from a different country on my views

Cheers

Adam

With only 45 posts it is obvious you haven’t been around to long. Maybe you should take the time to get to know the regulars here before you engage into a debate over whether or not they are bing sarcastic. As you stated yourself, it is difficult to tell the tone of one’s voice on a forum.

 

[RichT]

misericordie:

I agree: here is a gathering after a so called LIFETEEN MASS in a church:http://www.traditio.com/comment/com0306e.jpg

I would like to see your photo album sometime. Did you actually take this picture? If not, do you have permission from the original photographer to use it?

 

[serendipity]

Looks like the discalaced wave of the future to me. The are not int he process of clebrating mass. They are enjoying themselves in a church. How lovely that the priest cares for them.

 

[justnmartr]

I guess clarifications must be given from my last post. First, what I said about the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy is not a directly in there. I was commenting more on the how the changes in the Mass were designed to help foster more active involvment from the congregation. That is why the CSL says it is okay to use the vernacular.

Second, I believe that sitting on the backs of pews is totally wrong. But when it come to people talking before mass starts, I have seen just as many adults do it as teenagers. That is why I had said everyone needs to learn about proper behavior, young AND old. We cannot look at the faults of the former and ignore the latter. As the one of the spiritual works of mercy says, “instruct the ignorant.” we just need to inform everyone on how the mass should be done.

Also, Anna should you read this, could you please quote where in the CCC it says to evaluate the actions of others in light of scripture and all those things mentioned. We have to remember that some cultures celebrate mass differently. Like in Italy, some of the smaller churches place a plant on the right side of the alter. Is there anything wrong with that practice. Now I am **NOT **permitting sitting on the backs of pews or talking during a time of preparation but there are just somethings we can’t look at so critically.

I have been to several masses with young people and if anyone around me is acting in a manner that is disrespectful, I let them know. I am at school studying to be a youth minister, I can tell you that any teenager that goes through the any of my programs will learn about reverence in a church.

PS. Non Draco Sunt Mihi Dux= Let not the dragon be my guide.

 

[Anna_Elizabeth]

justnmartr:

I guess clarifications must be given from my last post. First, what I said about the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy is not a directly in there.

Right

I was commenting more on the how the changes in the Mass were designed to help foster more active involvment from the congregation.

Sorry, but that is not a “clarification”. Nowhere in the CSL is there anything that REQUIRES (your word), new music, not even for the ubiquitous “active participation of the people,” much less “to include more people.” Since we are now on the same page of the CSL, however, let me suggest that perhaps you are being a bit selective. That same document makes clear the special importance of (horrors!), LATIN, and, the “pride of place” accorded Gregorian chant!

You requested references from the CCC re evaluating our own actions and those of others “in light of scripture (sic) and all those other things mentioned.” For starters, justnmrtr, those “other things” are the Tradition, the Pope and the Magisterium. I suggest that as a budding youth minister you might want to become familiar with “those other things.” Then, contact me, and I shall be glad to devise a program of CCC references to suit!

You wrote: “If we ease these youth into (the Mass), they will hopefully (sic) fall in love with the mass (sic).” I must confess I looked up Benedictine College and was especially interested in its description of itself as “The Discovery College.” Does what they describe as the “discovery method” apply also to the program of study for youth ministers? If so, it might explain your desire to “ease” the youth into the Mass. Do note that similar experiments in Catholicism and in Protestant denominations have proved disastrous.

Forgive me if I am being unduly harsh to a very young person. I am sure that you have the best of intentions, but I repeat: Young people do not respect adults who refuse to behave as adults, overlooking what everyone knows to be insulting behavior, especially when it is God that is being insulted.

And I would still like to know who among us “condemned” (your verb), the teenagers, and who is “being so critical all the time?”

Words mean things.

Anna

 

[Meggie]

I wanted to wait this out becasue arguments about teen masses really annoy me.
I was really lost last year. And I mean badly.
Lifeteen changed my life, I got so much closer to God…I go to Daily Mass now and so do some of my friends when school is off.

two teen boys were BAPTIZED into the church last Easter because of Lifeteen…

Lifeteen saved the life of my friend years ago, he had his sucide planned before he was brought to lifeteen
Lifeteen saved another friend from a life of poverty and teen pregnancy by helping her realize she didn’t need to have a boyfriend, nor give in to what he asks.
It helped my friends recover from drug and alcohol addictions, eating disorters and just about anything else you can think of.

Some have slipped even tho they have come to the youth group.

But I wish any of you skeptics could go up to any of my friends and tell them that a youth Mass didn’t bring them into the church.

If you really doubt then feel free to PM me and I will tell you the details of why it means so much to me personally…

 

[misericordie]

Meggie:

I wanted to wait this out becasue arguments about teen masses really annoy me.
I was really lost last year. And I mean badly.
Lifeteen changed my life, I got so much closer to God…I go to Daily Mass now and so do some of my friends when school is off.

two teen boys were BAPTIZED into the church last Easter because of Lifeteen…

Lifeteen saved the life of my friend years ago, he had his sucide planned before he was brought to lifeteen
Lifeteen saved another friend from a life of poverty and teen pregnancy by helping her realize she didn’t need to have a boyfriend, nor give in to what he asks.
It helped my friends recover from drug and alcohol addictions, eating disorters and just about anything else you can think of.

Some have slipped even tho they have come to the youth group.

But I wish any of you skeptics could go up to any of my friends and tell them that a youth Mass didn’t bring them into the church.

If you really doubt then feel free to PM me and I will tell you the details of why it means so much to me personally…

This is good, but does not justify the irreverence in mass and as the above picture represents, the lack of modesty in the church temple. Mass is not entertainment. and the priest is not just a buddy but a spiritual leader who is to care for souls.

 

[Meggie]

that picture is of a FOOT WASHING…

…I don’t know of many parishes that have feet washings

 

[cleofet]

misericordie:

I agree: here is a gathering after a so called LIFETEEN MASS in a church:http://www.traditio.com/comment/com0306e.jpg

I don’t think we should be so critical of a Mass that is suited a little more to the younger people but I do agree it should and can still be respectful even if some people can’t appreciate the type of music used to worship. As for the picture above maybe what should be happening here and anywhere else any sort of lack of respect happens is that the Priest or other adult should step in and explain that lounging around the Alter anytime is not the respectful thing to do. It is not just teenagers that do this sort of thing though. I am in a choir and we practice in Church one night a week. Sometimes some of us get a little rowdy. Our Choir director has to take us to task for it when it happens. I don’t think it is being done purposely but we all need to remember whose house we are in.

 

[Meggie]

cleofet:

I don’t think we should be so critical of a Mass that is suited a little more to the younger people but I do agree it should and can still be respectful even if some people can’t appreciate the type of music used to worship. As for the picture above maybe what should be happening here and anywhere else any sort of lack of respect happens is that the Priest or other adult should step in and explain that lounging around the Alter anytime is not the respectful thing to do. It is not just teenagers that do this sort of thing though. I am in a choir and we practice in Church one night a week. Sometimes some of us get a little rowdy. Our Choir director has to take us to task for it when it happens. I don’t think it is being done purposely but we all need to remember whose house we are in.

Its NOT during MASS after Mass that had a Foot Washing!!!..heaven forbid someone show enthusiasm for something in the Catholic faith!!!

 

[dhgray]

Meggie:

Its NOT during MASS after Mass that had a Foot Washing!!!..heaven forbid someone show enthusiasm for something in the Catholic faith!!!

HEY! Stop it! No having enthusiam here!

The beating will continue until moral improves.

How IRREVERENT to act like Jesus. It is below us to be humble and wash feet. Infact, I stopped washing my years ago. We will have none of this acting like a Christian here. Enough, enough I say …

 

[Cindy_Lou]

justnmartr:

But sometimes people need to talk to one another in order to inform others of some of the problems they are having and to pray for them (if they are there for the right reasons).

Not exactly on point but several years ago I was a sponsor for an RCIA candidate. She would always sit with my family and I and she would tell me about her week and problems she experienced. I felt it was my duty to listen and help her pray about some of these things, but sometimes her language was atrocious and I tried to tell her it wasn’t appropriate but never seemed to get through to her. Once a family even moved away from us because of her. At Easter vigil I cried during the Rite and at the time I didn’t understand why. Now I believe it was because I hadn’t led her properly and failed her somehow. :banghead: We’ve moved to a different church and I never see her anymore…but I now believe that even when we talk to one another, we should always remember where we are and in Whose Presence we are. But I also believe that joy and gaiety are a necessary by-product of the Mass and the Holy Eucharist and it should be VERY acceptable to show it (in reference, of course) .

 

[misericordie]

dhgray:

HEY! Stop it! No having enthusiam here!

The beating will continue until moral improves.

How IRREVERENT to act like Jesus. It is below us to be humble and wash feet. Infact, I stopped washing my years ago. We will have none of this acting like a Christian here. Enough, enough I say …

Well as we all know CHRIST speaks to us especially through his church and there are liturgical norms to obey,. When a group acts like they are out on a picnic when in Church, then its called DISOBEDIENCE which well, is NOT of GOD, but self-worship. smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_28_110iv.gif smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_146_36.gif smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_1_124.gif smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_6_120.gif