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notsmart
Guest
Evangelicals ought to know better. They know that the bible says the man MUST love the woman. However, there is NO mention the woman MUST love the man. Not one mention of it at all.
Sorry to burst your divorce bubble OP.
You have NO biblical back up here.
Sorry to burst your divorce bubble OP.
You have NO biblical back up here.
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RubyT
Guest
Really try to imagine your life without him?
Keep in mind how hard it is to find a great guy that loves you for you. It is very hard even when we are young and beautiful.
Picture being single again, would it really make you happier. Doing everything and I mean everything by yourself. Its hard and lonely and no guarantee you will ever find the perfect love.
Imagine him loving someone else. :hug1:
So you are not IN Love but surely there IS love. A deeper love than just being in love, this is much more valuable my friend. A love forged by time is not to be taken lightly.
So you don’t get nervous around him like a new love. After being in love with anyone this feeling wears off eventually anyway. The deeper bonds prevail and are much more rewarding. Appreciate the bond you do have, the good times and the bad times that you have shared. These bonds are what truly matter. Not the initial giddiness of being in love. Take my advice you may be sorry if you lose this man.
Imagine if you were struck with a serious illness, who would be there for you?
I hope these thought provoking questions help.
Someday you will wonder why you ever felt this way.
Trust that God has you right where He knows is best.
I will pray for you.
Wishing you well my friend.
Keep in mind how hard it is to find a great guy that loves you for you. It is very hard even when we are young and beautiful.
Picture being single again, would it really make you happier. Doing everything and I mean everything by yourself. Its hard and lonely and no guarantee you will ever find the perfect love.
Imagine him loving someone else. :hug1:
So you are not IN Love but surely there IS love. A deeper love than just being in love, this is much more valuable my friend. A love forged by time is not to be taken lightly.
So you don’t get nervous around him like a new love. After being in love with anyone this feeling wears off eventually anyway. The deeper bonds prevail and are much more rewarding. Appreciate the bond you do have, the good times and the bad times that you have shared. These bonds are what truly matter. Not the initial giddiness of being in love. Take my advice you may be sorry if you lose this man.
Imagine if you were struck with a serious illness, who would be there for you?
I hope these thought provoking questions help.
Someday you will wonder why you ever felt this way.
Trust that God has you right where He knows is best.
I will pray for you.
Wishing you well my friend.
S
SarahR
Guest
OP–give it to God, be open to Him changing your heart. Sounds like a great husband you have…some of us would give anything for a guy like that.
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chevalier
Guest
Dmoondog, there is no obligation to seek the nullity decree and split up if both parties are able and willing to marry and they want to be married to each other. Marriages can be convalidated - even in a real case of fraud, which you shouldn’t presume if you aren’t sure.
Besides, maybe you’re a little too tough on yourself. Firstly, you thought you were in love - which means you were hardly pretending. Secondly, you wanted to be married to him - you didn’t just think you did. That’s hardly fraud in my book. Fraud is when you intentionally deceive someone.
Besides, maybe you’re a little too tough on yourself. Firstly, you thought you were in love - which means you were hardly pretending. Secondly, you wanted to be married to him - you didn’t just think you did. That’s hardly fraud in my book. Fraud is when you intentionally deceive someone.
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OutinChgoburbs
Guest
Dmoondog, what you might be feeling is the marriage’s"middle age." You’ve been married for 18 years. You are not going to feel the same way you felt 18 years ago.
I almost lost my husband this year.We’ve been married a few years longer than you, but we were taking each other for granted a bit. Trust me, you do not want to go through watching your husband gasp for breath, or to be told the odds are good he isn’t going to make it, or be hooked up to a vent, or sit through 48-hour sessions of slow dialysis, or come back from a tracheotomy, to realize how much he means to you.
Young love is a wonderful thing, but it cannot begin to replace mature love. Mature love chooses to love, even if he has hair in his ears, is going gray rapidly, or balding without it being sexy, or paunching out in the tummy a bit. Mature love also doesn’t notice when you can’t wear a miniskirt any more, or those pesky chin hairs that need tweezing that popped up suddenly, or that the “girls” are starting to follow gravity.
So my suggestions? First, pray for your husband every day, even just a couple minutes. Second, start bringing him coffee in bed, or his undies when he’s taking a shower, or a sandwich and salad when he didn’t ask while he’s on the PC or watching the game. Start doing little things for him like that. You’ll be surprised how that helps you to love him better. Still another thing to do is PRIVATELY make a list of what you admire and cherish about the man. Carry it with you- in fact, make a copy for your pocket, and a copy for your purse.
If those things don’t help, don’t be embarrassed to seek professional counseling with a reliable therapist who is, at the least, Christian. Then, if it doesn’t work out, you know you tried everything. If you do separate, you do not need to get a divorce or a decree of nullity right away.
And you are not a fraud. Got that? You seem to be the most genuine person I’ve met online in a long time. A fraud would not worry about how somebody else felt, or if she was taking advantage.
I almost lost my husband this year.We’ve been married a few years longer than you, but we were taking each other for granted a bit. Trust me, you do not want to go through watching your husband gasp for breath, or to be told the odds are good he isn’t going to make it, or be hooked up to a vent, or sit through 48-hour sessions of slow dialysis, or come back from a tracheotomy, to realize how much he means to you.
Young love is a wonderful thing, but it cannot begin to replace mature love. Mature love chooses to love, even if he has hair in his ears, is going gray rapidly, or balding without it being sexy, or paunching out in the tummy a bit. Mature love also doesn’t notice when you can’t wear a miniskirt any more, or those pesky chin hairs that need tweezing that popped up suddenly, or that the “girls” are starting to follow gravity.
So my suggestions? First, pray for your husband every day, even just a couple minutes. Second, start bringing him coffee in bed, or his undies when he’s taking a shower, or a sandwich and salad when he didn’t ask while he’s on the PC or watching the game. Start doing little things for him like that. You’ll be surprised how that helps you to love him better. Still another thing to do is PRIVATELY make a list of what you admire and cherish about the man. Carry it with you- in fact, make a copy for your pocket, and a copy for your purse.
If those things don’t help, don’t be embarrassed to seek professional counseling with a reliable therapist who is, at the least, Christian. Then, if it doesn’t work out, you know you tried everything. If you do separate, you do not need to get a divorce or a decree of nullity right away.
And you are not a fraud. Got that? You seem to be the most genuine person I’ve met online in a long time. A fraud would not worry about how somebody else felt, or if she was taking advantage.
D
dmoondog
Guest
No really,
I am asking for prayers. Perhaps I have been ungreatful, maybe that is my sin, but I want to change if that is the case. I am also just very confused about the annullment stance of the catholic church. Instead of finding any peace, it has made me more confused than ever, and stirred up a hornets nest in my soul.
I am asking for prayers. Perhaps I have been ungreatful, maybe that is my sin, but I want to change if that is the case. I am also just very confused about the annullment stance of the catholic church. Instead of finding any peace, it has made me more confused than ever, and stirred up a hornets nest in my soul.
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chevalier
Guest
No worries, they aren’t there to make you feel miserable. You can probably realise that a forced oath is no oath or that a pretended oath is not a true, faithful oath or that some people are unable to take the oath they are taking, right?
The nullity decrees are because of that. If someone is related too closely by blood and can’t marry, there’s no marriage. Allowing divorce to happen is not a way to address the situation - the marriage simply doesn’t exit. Same with threats or cheating someone into saying yes. And same when people say the oath but they don’t really mean it, which is simulation. There are more causes of nullity, but they come down to one thing: the marriage either is there or is not. If you just pronounce the oath at gun point, you are not married and never have been. It is the same when someone cheats you into it or when the other person says he or she is marrying you but in fact he or she is making room for infidelity or excluding children. In those cases, there is simply no marriage to preserve. There is only a pretence and a pretence is not a sacrament. Sacraments are only real. This is why there is a procedure to establish whether some such situation actually took place - the Church doesn’t want people forced to remain in a pretence of a marriage. But marriage possesses the favour of the law (it presumed valid until proven otherwise) regardless of someone’s right to challenge it. Also, if the marriage is invalid but the couple want to be married (in the sense of what the Church sees as marriage), they can convalidate so long as no impediments or defects of consent (exclusions, simulations, lack of maturity, lack of understanding etc) persist. It is a good thing we have this, not a bad one. It’s certainly not there to make people fear to be married. Unless there’s sufficient reason, one shouldn’t doubt the validity of a marriage. If you have some doubts, talk to your priest, he can help you or point you to the right people.
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Friend_forever
Guest
Chevalier is right. You should not be confused. It think this annulment thing has been taken a little to lightly.Many people can seek it but only a few would be granted it.
My sister used to work as a secretary of the annulment office for the diocese and she just to say they were extreme cases.
An example would be the case of a a middle east guy that married a girl with the purpose of taking her with him and sell her in his country to make big money. Another case is to find out that the husband is homosexual and even worst, that he had a partner. I remember one that she used to talk about. This was the case in which the boyfriend wanted to have sex and the girlfriend told him that not until they were married. So he married her, went on a honey moon, had a lot of sex and then returned her to her parents when they were back since he already had “what he wanted”.
As you can see, they are not ordinary cases but extraordinary. Please get some peace.
My sister used to work as a secretary of the annulment office for the diocese and she just to say they were extreme cases.
An example would be the case of a a middle east guy that married a girl with the purpose of taking her with him and sell her in his country to make big money. Another case is to find out that the husband is homosexual and even worst, that he had a partner. I remember one that she used to talk about. This was the case in which the boyfriend wanted to have sex and the girlfriend told him that not until they were married. So he married her, went on a honey moon, had a lot of sex and then returned her to her parents when they were back since he already had “what he wanted”.
As you can see, they are not ordinary cases but extraordinary. Please get some peace.
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happymommy
Guest
I guess I don’t understand why you are even looking at the annullment stance unless divorce is something you are really thinking about doing.
I’m not sure what you want prayers for. Is it so you will start loving your husband who does whatever he can for you? I think you are making this marriage more about you and not about the two of you together. Marriage is team work. It’s not he does everything, you let him and then complain that he is not all you dreamed he would be. I hope you have never told him that you don’t love him. I can’t imagine the pain that would cause. You know, I’m having difficulty being nice, so maybe I should stop. I guess, I’m trying to understand why I should feel sorry for you. There are so many women in terrible relationships with men who beat them and abuse them. They would love to have a husband to cherish and love. I think you need to be grateful and thankful that God gave you this wonderful man. Maybe you don’t get warm fuzzies in your heart every time you look at him, but marriage is so much more than that.
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Feanaro_s_Wife
Guest
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GhostMan
Guest
It appears to me, from only what I have read here, that you are looking for a way to give yourself “permission” to leave your husband. Having returned to the Catholic Church, you’ve suddenly been introduced to the concept of annulment and are now wondering if that is a way out.
The question is: why? I suspect you’re chasing a youthful desire for unbridled love. You’re afraid of dying with unfulfilled dreams someday. You wonder if there is more out there that you are not currently experiencing.
There is, but most of it is ugly and harsh. The world is a cruel, cold place filled with tiny pockets of sanctuary. It seems that your marriage is one of these. Perhaps it doesn’t offer you the excitement or emotional highs that you crave, but it also doesn’t have the soul-crushing lows that many marriages offer.
You’ve been told the truth - feelings follow actions. You probably even know that already, most of us over 40 have been around long enough to know that as personal truth, not just general truth.
In my opinion, you are behaving foolishly. Like a man who leaves his family to chase the twenty-something. Use your energy to focus on your marriage, not on excuses to leave.
You said that you want to die. If that is true, seek counseling. Get help, you need it. The problem is deeper than an unfulfilled emotional love-life. If it is not really all that true, though; if is more hyperbole than reality - cut it out. Don’t throw out bombastic phrases that are designed to engender sympathy and turn a thread toward one that is more sympathetic to your desires.
In short - no you don’t have to divorce your husband. That was a leading title designed to guide people in a direction you want. You should not, must not, divorce him. If you feel you are a fraud, then change. If you have unfulfilled emotional needs, then he probably does too.
You are looking for permission to do something wrong - it’s not likely to come from this forum. At least, I hope so,
The question is: why? I suspect you’re chasing a youthful desire for unbridled love. You’re afraid of dying with unfulfilled dreams someday. You wonder if there is more out there that you are not currently experiencing.
There is, but most of it is ugly and harsh. The world is a cruel, cold place filled with tiny pockets of sanctuary. It seems that your marriage is one of these. Perhaps it doesn’t offer you the excitement or emotional highs that you crave, but it also doesn’t have the soul-crushing lows that many marriages offer.
You’ve been told the truth - feelings follow actions. You probably even know that already, most of us over 40 have been around long enough to know that as personal truth, not just general truth.
In my opinion, you are behaving foolishly. Like a man who leaves his family to chase the twenty-something. Use your energy to focus on your marriage, not on excuses to leave.
You said that you want to die. If that is true, seek counseling. Get help, you need it. The problem is deeper than an unfulfilled emotional love-life. If it is not really all that true, though; if is more hyperbole than reality - cut it out. Don’t throw out bombastic phrases that are designed to engender sympathy and turn a thread toward one that is more sympathetic to your desires.
In short - no you don’t have to divorce your husband. That was a leading title designed to guide people in a direction you want. You should not, must not, divorce him. If you feel you are a fraud, then change. If you have unfulfilled emotional needs, then he probably does too.
You are looking for permission to do something wrong - it’s not likely to come from this forum. At least, I hope so,
W
whatevergirl
Guest
I like this line of yours, GhostMan:
*The world is a cruel, cold place filled with tiny pockets of sanctuary. *
I might have to steal that one for a later date.
*The world is a cruel, cold place filled with tiny pockets of sanctuary. *
I might have to steal that one for a later date.
D
dmoondog
Guest
It appears to me, from only what I have read here, that you are looking for a way to give yourself “permission” to leave your husband. Having returned to the Catholic Church, you’ve suddenly been introduced to the concept of annulment and are now wondering if that is a way out.
The question is: why? I suspect you’re chasing a youthful desire for unbridled love. You’re afraid of dying with unfulfilled dreams someday. You wonder if there is more out there that you are not currently experiencing.
There is, but most of it is ugly and harsh. The world is a cruel, cold place filled with tiny pockets of sanctuary. It seems that your marriage is one of these. Perhaps it doesn’t offer you the excitement or emotional highs that you crave, but it also doesn’t have the soul-crushing lows that many marriages offer.
You’ve been told the truth - feelings follow actions. You probably even know that already, most of us over 40 have been around long enough to know that as personal truth, not just general truth.
In my opinion, you are behaving foolishly. Like a man who leaves his family to chase the twenty-something. Use your energy to focus on your marriage, not on excuses to leave.
You said that you want to die. If that is true, seek counseling. Get help, you need it. The problem is deeper than an unfulfilled emotional love-life. If it is not really all that true, though; if is more hyperbole than reality - cut it out. Don’t throw out bombastic phrases that are designed to engender sympathy and turn a thread toward one that is more sympathetic to your desires.
In short - no you don’t have to divorce your husband. That was a leading title designed to guide people in a direction you want. You should not, must not, divorce him. If you feel you are a fraud, then change. If you have unfulfilled emotional needs, then he probably does too.
You are looking for permission to do something wrong - it’s not likely to come from this forum. At least, I hope so,
thank you, I think I need to hear this. But what if it is all true, What if it is true that I am a manipulater looking for sympathy. Can Ichange. I keep trying and failing. It really sucks.
The question is: why? I suspect you’re chasing a youthful desire for unbridled love. You’re afraid of dying with unfulfilled dreams someday. You wonder if there is more out there that you are not currently experiencing.
There is, but most of it is ugly and harsh. The world is a cruel, cold place filled with tiny pockets of sanctuary. It seems that your marriage is one of these. Perhaps it doesn’t offer you the excitement or emotional highs that you crave, but it also doesn’t have the soul-crushing lows that many marriages offer.
You’ve been told the truth - feelings follow actions. You probably even know that already, most of us over 40 have been around long enough to know that as personal truth, not just general truth.
In my opinion, you are behaving foolishly. Like a man who leaves his family to chase the twenty-something. Use your energy to focus on your marriage, not on excuses to leave.
You said that you want to die. If that is true, seek counseling. Get help, you need it. The problem is deeper than an unfulfilled emotional love-life. If it is not really all that true, though; if is more hyperbole than reality - cut it out. Don’t throw out bombastic phrases that are designed to engender sympathy and turn a thread toward one that is more sympathetic to your desires.
In short - no you don’t have to divorce your husband. That was a leading title designed to guide people in a direction you want. You should not, must not, divorce him. If you feel you are a fraud, then change. If you have unfulfilled emotional needs, then he probably does too.
You are looking for permission to do something wrong - it’s not likely to come from this forum. At least, I hope so,
thank you, I think I need to hear this. But what if it is all true, What if it is true that I am a manipulater looking for sympathy. Can Ichange. I keep trying and failing. It really sucks.
D
dmoondog
Guest
Ghost man, what if it is true. What if I am just a manipulator looking for sympathy. What if I am looking for a reason to leave? or permission as you say.
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whatevergirl
Guest
This is an interesting thread…on the one hand, I can see you feeling like you commited a fraud dmoon–and it is not fair to your husband to really never have truly wished to marry him. If you did so for the wrong reasons, then I can see why you might want to explore leaving. But, on the other hand, it might be a good idea to seek counseling, before you make any rash decisions. At one point, I wanted to leave my marriage. I have been with my husband for 18 yrs nearly, and about 8 years ago, we had some difficulties. I think I just didn’t know what I wanted, and needed to grow up a bit. Counseling and prayer helped me to see that what I was searching for, was a deeper relationship with Christ…and to love myself, first. I don’t know if I really knew how to love, and knew what being a good wife meant. I now know.
I encourage you to seek a strong spiritual advisor, and counseling if possible. I think it will help you to see where you might have some issues that could be causing you to feel like you want to leave your marriage. Maybe in the end of that, you realize that you shouldn’t have married this man. But, before you make any rash decisions, try to find out if there is something deeper going on inside your heart.
I will pray for you!
I encourage you to seek a strong spiritual advisor, and counseling if possible. I think it will help you to see where you might have some issues that could be causing you to feel like you want to leave your marriage. Maybe in the end of that, you realize that you shouldn’t have married this man. But, before you make any rash decisions, try to find out if there is something deeper going on inside your heart.
I will pray for you!
G
GhostMan
Guest
Only a fool throws away what he, or she, has before understanding what they are searching for. You do not seem like a fool; you are acting foolish, but that is not the same.
We are, none of us, the person we thought we would be. As children and young people we had dreams and expectations that just do not pan out. Such is life. It is natural, at certain points in your life, to look back and question what you have done - or not done - and wonder if there is still time to accomplish what you once expected would happen as the natural flow of your life.
You cannot find happiness by throwing things away and looking for new experiences or new people. There is a hole inside of you that only you can fill. It is filled as an act of will; a demand of self to be content in your station, to see your life as a blessing and not a curse. Until you can do that, no person, no thing, no experience will make you happy.
Again, if you do not love your husband, but he is a lovable person - that is, a person who can be loved - then purpose yourself to be that person. Change your mind and your heart will follow.
The real issue is why you are seeking chaos, why are you not content? What is it you are seeking? If you cannot answer these questions, then you stop being foolish and start becoming the fool.
You dread ending your life with unfulfilled expectations; in some sense, we all do. Perhaps not dread for some of us, but a melancholy sense of the unaccomplished. How much worse, though, to come to the end of your life and have regrets of actions that you did take that led only to pain and suffering? Do not make a rash decision only to end up crying in the night, screaming, “What have I done?”
Do some self-searching. Be honest with yourself and understand what you are really experiencing. Remember, though, wish-fulfillment cannot be an excuse to sin, nor can it be an excuse to hurt other people. We have a term for people who do that sort of thing in our society: Bad People. I don’t think you want to be thought of that way; most of us spend our lives trying to stay out of the class of people.
Seek contentment in all things. Emotions are poor guideposts for our decisions. They ebb and flow. The Roman emperor Augustus had a slave that was instructed to sit behind his right ear and constantly whisper, “This too shall pass.” It was a reminder that the cheering crowds would inevitably become the angry mob. We can also use this to temper our highs and lows. In all things, remember that “This too shall pass”. Do not allow a low time to make a mockery of your life.
T
TLDenmark
Guest
Dear dmoondog
Forget the harsh words from some of the other posters, you don’t sound like someone wanting to leave your husband. Instead find comfort in the fact, that you should not go around being afraid about your marriage being a fraud. The Catholic stance on marriage, is that any marriage is to be presumed valid until proven otherwise. So please don’t allow yourself to despair over this issue.
Also you may not be in love with your husband (feeling the butterflies), but I actually think that you do love him more than you realize. That is evident from the way you talk about how you respect and care for him. So I say you should stay with him, and make yourself a blessing to his life. Ultimately that is what love is about. Will pray for you and your husband.
God bless you
TL
Forget the harsh words from some of the other posters, you don’t sound like someone wanting to leave your husband. Instead find comfort in the fact, that you should not go around being afraid about your marriage being a fraud. The Catholic stance on marriage, is that any marriage is to be presumed valid until proven otherwise. So please don’t allow yourself to despair over this issue.
Also you may not be in love with your husband (feeling the butterflies), but I actually think that you do love him more than you realize. That is evident from the way you talk about how you respect and care for him. So I say you should stay with him, and make yourself a blessing to his life. Ultimately that is what love is about. Will pray for you and your husband.
God bless you
TL
M
mrpathetic
Guest
I agree with most of the posters in this thread. Throwing away this marriage is senseless. It makes much more sense, to try to find common ground, for a lasting relationship, with this husband you have.
Quite frankly, I wish I had your marriage. And I suspect that probably other folks in this forum wish they had yours as well! Many of us live in abject misery. Some of us cope with adultery, abandonment, physical or verbal abuse - or all of the above! Under those circumstances, seeking divorce/separation/annulment might make sense.
But if you are just bored, lonely, or demoralized,then your marriage can certainly be saved. I recommend that you pray as hard as possible, to seek guidance. Abandoning a reasonably solid marriage just seems like a total waste.
Quite frankly, I wish I had your marriage. And I suspect that probably other folks in this forum wish they had yours as well! Many of us live in abject misery. Some of us cope with adultery, abandonment, physical or verbal abuse - or all of the above! Under those circumstances, seeking divorce/separation/annulment might make sense.
But if you are just bored, lonely, or demoralized,then your marriage can certainly be saved. I recommend that you pray as hard as possible, to seek guidance. Abandoning a reasonably solid marriage just seems like a total waste.
M
mercygate
Guest
This exact situation is addressed in the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola – you can google it. The problem is coming to terms with one’s condition of life. The particular series of meditations is for people who are married but want to become monks. People who are married but want NOT to be married. Priests who are fed up with their vocation. Monks who want OUT of the monastery.
Frankly, nearly every form of committed life is subject to a period of disillusionment and doubt. If you married with the idea that the only way out is in a body bag, you’re on the right track. As a friend of mine observes, “at Cana, Jesus saved the best wine for last.”
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