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bobzills
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mgrfin
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bobzills
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Let’s take a look at a Catholic view on large families:
Let’s take a look at what a Catholic says about abortion:
But what do we read in the newspaper?
"According to the Alan Guttmacher Institute, which tracks reproductive health data, non-Hispanic Catholic women of childbearing age are 29% more likely than their Protestant counterparts to have abortions (full study*). The rate is even higher–33%–if Hispanics are factored in. Another way of looking at it: while Protestant women make up about 54% of the population, they account for only 37% of the abortions. Catholic women make up 31% of the population and account for 31% of the abortions. "
Please see: beliefnet.com/story/63/story_6301_1.html
What is happening across Europe? Muslims are growing by leaps and bounds, Mosques are being built and Catholic Churches are closing.
Because of its high birthrate, Islam is overtaking Catholicism across the world and your response to this is to assassinate my character because I have noticed what is happening?
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mgrfin
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Montalban
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That is indeed Bobzills only purpose for this thread.
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Hellisreal
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Has he proven it?
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Montalban
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He has by seeking to draw false comparisons, and even cotinuing that line over into another thread.
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Hellisreal
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I dont agree that he has proven a thing but bluster a bunch.
Where is this thread BTW?
Thanks
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bobzills
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Well, take a look at what Pope Benedict has said recently:
MARIAZELL, Austria (AFP) — Pope Benedict XVI blasted Europeans for being selfish and not having enough children, in a sermon on Saturday at the 850-year-old pilgrimage site of Mariazell in Austria.
“Europe has become child-poor. We want everything for ourselves and place little trust in the future,” the pope told a crowd of faithful from his canopied area at an open-air, afternoon mass that took place under heavy rain.
afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5ir8j1XajfDtE4GRsx_M6F_3-QXZw
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Kaninchen
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Since the message isn’t getting through even to the faithful and there’s not the faintest chance of the availability of birth control being reduced, what would you suggest (that any politician could propose and have the slightest chance of being elected) as a means of increasing the fertility rate?
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bobzills
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The Pope needs to give more speeches like this one so that Catholics, including those who have sounded out and attacked me on this thread, are finally convinced of the need to increase the Catholic birthrate.
afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5ir8j1XajfDtE4GRsx_M6F_3-QXZw
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Kaninchen
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Well, I’m Jewish but even I know that Popes have been going on about this subject for a long time and most people are obviously not taking the slightest notice. That’s why I asked about what anybody could actually do about it - other than moan about it, of course, but that’s both easy and completely ineffective.
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bobzills
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If you have been to any Catholic services, you probably have not heard too much on this subject.
BTW, what is the Orthodox Jewish position on limiting the number of children in a family? In Israel, isn’t the birthrate of Palestinians of some concern?
A neighbor of ours has just come back from a trip to Salt Lake City Utah. According to what he tells us, Mormons are encouraged to have 5 children per family.
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Kaninchen
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Only ever seen people going in or out of services, never been in, never expect to go in.
It’s as easy to check as the Catholic position - you count the children.
Ask an Israeli.
I wonder what the actual average family size of Mormons is?
All that interesting diversion to the Middle East and the Great Salt Lake still leaves us with my question - what can be done about it, other than ineffective moaning?
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bobzills
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Do Orthodox Jewish rabbis encourage large families? I heard it was so in Israel. And that some rabbis did not approve of birth control methods.
According to my neighbor, there are many large Mormon families.
Back to your question, in my personal opinion, if the Church is serious about Catholics having larger families, there then need to be more sermons on this issue. As it is, I have not heard anything from the pulpit about it.
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Kaninchen
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Do you think that more sermons will actually work?
You see, I don’t believe that there are many people sitting in Catholic services who are doubtful about the position of the Church authorities on fertility (if a Jewess like me knows about it and she’s never been into a Catholic church in her life then . . . . it’s more than likely that a Catholic churchgoer will know). What they’re doing is ignoring Church teachings, just like there are members of all sorts of religious groups ignoring what their leaders are telling them - don’t forget, by the way, that the average family size in Muslim Turkey and the Islamic Republic of Iran is less than two children nowadays.
Seems to me that sermons are not working.
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bobzills
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My personal opinion is yes, they will work.
Let me give you an example.
In 1930, divorce was considered to be a serious sin. And you were asked to make serious efforts to stay in a marriage and to try to make it work.
However, recently, I haven’t heard about that. For example, the last sermon I heard was how Jesus had sympathy for outcasts in society and how we must by like Jesus and reach out to those who feel abandoned by society, such as gays and lesbians.
Nothing about family life or children, just a sermon about having sympathy for homosexuals.
Well, what is the result? Take a look at the statistics. In 1930, there were 9 marriage annulments in the USA, whereas recently it has reached as high as 60,000 marriage annulments per year.
So, yes, I think that sermons have some effect.
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andzy
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You’d be surprised. There are many Catholics who don’t know the Church’s position on artificial birth control, even though they go to mass (almost) every Sunday. Because nobody tells them that. I’ve been a Catholic for over 6 years and have attended church every Sunday, but have heard this mentioned maybe once or twice (and not a single sermon on this topic per se). Even on this forum I’ve seen a couple posts that go like this “I’ve been a Catholic for all my life, but just heard that artificial birth control is sinful. Is it true?”
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andzy
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YES! The secular world keeps giving us sermons on how artificial birth control, abortion, divorce, etc. are good for everybody. Majority of Catholics are listening to these “sermons”, which certainly seem to work. A major reason why Catholic sermons don’t work is simply because there aren’t any.
I think priests have become too afraid of offending people, so instead of being guided in the truth, their flocks are becoming confused and disoriented and are dispersing…
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