Do Muslims Worship A Black Stone?

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Thank you for all of your insightful replies.

While I appreciate that this topic may cause you irritation, could the Muslim members on this thread please exercise charity when responding to things they may find offensive.

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Does anyone know the pre-Islamic history of the Black Stone?

We know that the Muslims believe it originated with Adam and Eve, but I want to know what happened to it after Abraham and before Muhammad? Where did Muhammad find this stone? And why did he kiss it?
 
Americanrevert said:
Hello and good mornin to everyone,

wow, accusations are just digusting when one cannot come to a truthful conclusion

Thank you from the heart.
Isa, you are clueless of Islam’s tenants, beliefs and actions. You are not sincere and all you want to do is cause havoc in the forum…you want to sike up everyone with your petty, ignorant, little, vices of arrogant sayings which people actually see in front of their faces that they are untrue. You may want to continue in the fashion, but in the head, please, try to have electrotherapy. your name depicts what you cause here, “the misery”.
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I’d say ad hominem, but would you know what it means?

No, I’m sorry I know quite a bit about Ilslam, not the least being living in the Muslim world, studying your hadith and your book. That you are embarassed is not my problem.

So enlighten us, convert, what is the reason why you kiss the idol of pagan Arabians, Does your book tell us? Can you give us a hadith to tell us why? A muslim flolk tale at least?
 
Psalter said:
(St. John of Damascus يوحنا الدمشقي], c. A.D. 675-749)
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I feared casting our pearls but thanks.
Btw, St. John was an official in the caliph’s court, the third generation of officials, and an Arab.

Like I said
Americanrevert said:
ridiculous…opinionated situations are not factual events or sayings

the ad hominems keep a-rolling.
Psalter;4210317:
Wow, that was mean!! :mad: I laughed when I read this, by the way, because what you wrote about Isa could easily describe you and your fellow Black Stone Worshipers (a.k.a. Mahometans). I think Isa is one of the most insightful and knowledgeable posters on the forum and his comments are always a delight to read.
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Thanks. Matthew 10:42
It also helps that he writes in correct English, uses complete sentences, as well as proper spelling, grammar, and puncuation, and a reasonable font size and color–unlike some of the other posters here cough cough
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.

Whoever could you mean?
Need some cough drops?😛
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Dempsey1919 said:
Does anyone know the pre-Islamic history of the Black Stone?

We know that the Muslims believe it originated with Adam and Eve, but I want to know what happened to it after Abraham and before Muhammad? Where did Muhammad find this stone? And why did he kiss it?
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See post #40.

There is no pre-islamic history of the black stone in the ‘islamic’ sense. They don’t even know why they do the things they do in relation to it. muslims usually reject all references to the black stone if someone brings up that it was used in mohammed’s pagan religion.

In islam, muslims are not supposed to question. They don’t question why they follow such a despicable character such as mohammed - why would they question the rituals around a black rock?
 
**-the same pagans practiced the pilgrimage to the hajj, the fast of ramadan, running around the kabaa 7 times, kissing the black stone, shaving the head, animal sacrifices, running up and down 2 hills, throwing stones at the devil, snorting, spitting, praying several times a day towards Mecca, giving alms, Friday prayers, etc. **
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Based on this post, it appears that the Black Stone is of Arabic paganism in origin. This makes sense. Afterall, Muhammad was originally pagan, and he would have known about this stone in his pre-Islamic days. The kissing of the stone appears to be a pagan ceremony that was continued by Muhammad.

Muslims do not know the reasons behind the veneration of the Stone because they originate in Arabic paganism and the pagan reasons for these ceremonies were not taught to them by Muhammad. I think the real significance of this Stone will be revealed by making a study of Arabic paganism, since this is a pagan practice.

Despite being fierce monotheists, Muslims appear to be unknowingly venerating a pagan idol.
 
Does anyone have a photo of the stone in question? 🤷

I saw this online:
Ibn‘Abbas said: The Messenger of Allah said concerning the Stone: “By Allah, Allah will bring it forth on the Day of Resurrection, and it will have two eyes with which it will see and a tongue with which it will speak, and it will testify in favour of those who touched it in sincerity.”
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Matariel said:
Does anyone have a photo of the stone in question?
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You can go to this prior post for a close-up view.

BTW, Islam teaches that on the Day of Judgment when we stand before our Creator, all of our our body organs like our eyes, ears, hands, feet, liver etc. will also be able to talk and to either testify for us for all the good deeds that we did with that particular organ… or to testify against us for all the bad and sinful deeds that we used those organs for.

There will also be “video” evidence of all of our deeds, whether good or bad and no matter how big or small those deeds may have seemed to us at the time we did them.
 
hamba2han said:
BTW, Islam teaches that on the Day of Judgment when we stand before our Creator, all of our our body organs like our eyes, ears, hands, feet, liver etc. will also be able to talk and to either testify for us for all the good deeds that we did with that particular organ… or to testify against us for all the bad and sinful deeds that we used those organs for.
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This is not the same as a stone talking and criticising/praising humans for their deeds though.
 
hamba2han said:
You can go to this prior post for a close-up view.

BTW, Islam teaches that on the Day of Judgment when we stand before our Creator, all of our our body organs like our eyes, ears, hands, feet, liver etc. will also be able to talk and to either testify for us for all the good deeds that we did with that particular organ… or to testify against us for all the bad and sinful deeds that we used those organs for.

There will also be “video” evidence of all of our deeds, whether good or bad and no matter how big or small those deeds may have seemed to us at the time we did them.
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Ironic - ‘videos’ didn’t even exist during mohammed’s time. Where does it say that in your koran and/or hadiths?

That closeup looks even worse than the wikipedia pic of the stone.
 
I’m no fan of islam. But i don’t think they worship a stone, no more than we worship a statue of Jesus or Mary. I could be wrong i don’t know.
 
Do Muslims accept the theory that this stone was/is a pagan idol?
 
Dempsey1919 said:
Do Muslims accept the theory that this stone was/is a pagan idol?
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**Sahih Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 59, Number 661: **
“We used to worship stones, and when we found a better stone than the first one, we would throw the first one and take the latter, but if we could not get a stone then we would collect some earth (i.e. soil) and then bring a sheep and milk that sheep over it, and perform the Tawaf around it. When the month of Rajab came, we used (to stop the military actions), calling this month the iron remover, for we used to remove and throw away the iron parts of every spear and arrow in the month of Rajab. Abu Raja’ added: When the Prophet sent with (Allah’s) Message, I was a boy working as a shepherd of my family camels. When we heard the news about the appearance of the Prophet, we ran to the fire, i.e. to Musailima al-Kadhdhab.”
(E) (A)

More info here:
coptichistory.org/new_page_203.htm

http://www.islamicvoice.com/february.2001/images/blackstone.jpg

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)



"*Some say there are 15 pieces, but thin the other seven pieces are deeply covered over in the brownish paste mixture, which is also touched by the circumambulators. This paste is a mixture of wax. musk and ambergris put on the top of the Black Stone. Muhammad Ibn Nafie AI-Khuzaie saw the Black Stone on the day when it was taken by the Qarmatians in the fourth century Hijrah. The top of the Black Stone was black but the rest of it was white. The length was about a cubit. Ibn I’llan Al-Makki, one of the scholars at that time, saw the Black Stone during the reign of the Ottoman Sultan Murad. Its length was then half a cubit and its width was a third of a cubit. It was white in colour but its top was black because of the misdeeds done by mankind. If the sins affect solid stone, their effects on the heart are even greater.

The first who encircled the Black Stone with silver rings was Abdullah Ibn AI-Zubair (may Allah be pleased with them). Then other caliphs and wealth) people followed suit and made the frame from silver and gold. The last who donated a frame of pure silver for the Black Stone, before the Saudi Government. was Al-Sultan Muhammad Rashad Khan in 1331 H. King Abdul Aziz (may his soul rest in peace) repaired part of it in 1366 H. In Sha ban, 1375 H., King Saud (may his soul rest in peace) replaced it with a new frame made of sterling silver.*"

kabahinfo.net/eng-php/kabah-black-stone-right-hand-allah.php
 
Based on the evidence we have, and the lack of response by Muslims, I think it is fair to say that Muslims continue to practice elements of Arabic paganism. Their lack of knowledge concerning the stone arises from the fact that they no longer practice the paganism from which the stone originates.

It would appear that Muslims do indeed “worship” the Black Stone, albeit unknowingly. I arrive at this conclusion because they continue to practice the ceremonies of the pagans who knowingly bowed down to this idol.

This provides more evidence to prove that Islam is a mix of gnostic Christianity, Judaism, and Arabic Paganism. Nothing new came with Islam; it is simply a strange mix of many different religions, brought together in a contradictory manner.
 
Dempsey1919 said:
Do Muslims accept the theory that this stone was/is a pagan idol?
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No, Muslims believe that the Black Stone was found by the one who built the Kaa’ba i.e. Prophet Abraham (pbuh).

"Then we inspired you (O Muhammad) to follow the religion of Abraham, monotheism; never was he an idol-worshiper." … [al-Qur’an, 16:123]

There is only One God who created one race of human beings, and communicated to them one message: submission to the will of God—known in Arabic as Islam. That message was conveyed to the first human beings on this earth, and reaffirmed by all of the prophets of God who came after them, down through the ages.

In the years after they were sent by God to their respective people, the Message that the Prophets taught gradually became lost and eventually the people went back to wrong and abhorrent practices such as idol-worship and associating partners with their Creator.

It is therefore no surprise then that at the time of Muhammad (pbuh), the pagan Arabs were worshiping idols in the Kaa’ba, despite them being the likely descendants of Abraham (pbuh) through his son, Ishmael (pbuh).

The essence of the message of Islam is that humankind should worship only One God by obeying His commandments, and should avoid worshiping God’s creation in any way, shape or form.
 
No, Muslims believe that the Black Stone was found by the one who built the Kaa’ba i.e. Prophet Abraham (pbuh).
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Why is this stone significant? Why all of the ceremony? Why is it important?
 
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