M
Montalban
Guest
Considering that the Moslems first prayed towards Jerusalem, then later to Mecca they themselves don’t even pray as they first did.
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M
Mr.Bee
Guest
I don’t know. Does anybody know?
The problem I see is everyone else thinks they know God better than the other guy’s religion, not only with Christians and Moslems, but also between the 30,000 or so different protestant churches.
Obviously nobody really knows God.
C
cestusdei
Guest
So Muslims pray in Hebrew? Celebrate Mass? Chant the psalms? That’s how Jesus prayed. There is nothing in the gospels that shows Jesus praying in the muslim fashion. In fact there is nothing in the quran that states exactly how salat is supposed to be done. If the quran is complete then how could it leave out something so vital eh?
F
freesoulhope
Guest
You believe in the gospel of Muhammad. This means you believe in God according to whatever Muhammad considers to be the truth. It seems that Muhammad goes unquestioned; unsuspected.
Personally, I would question somebody who wanted me to believe that they were sent by God; it could be a lie. Even Jesus was suspected and questioned thoroughly; at least he appeared to “fore fill a prophesy”. Different Kings from different lands visit the birth of Jesus with presents; having no guide but a star and a prophesy, or vision. That is somebody I would consider following long before Muhammad or any mere man that only says he is a prophet; and yet, he doesn’t even attempt to give me any proof.
A smooth talker, or somebody that has “authority” in their voice, doesn’t need any real evidence to persuade a listener , and there are a lot of smooth talkers in the world. They have a gift which they abuse because they like the buzz and the power they obtain through using their manipulative abilities. After hearing them, you would swear to your self that they were telling the truth; they are very convincing, my friend.
In Jewish scripture, I find that there are certain tests that a prophet must pass; Their were things that even Jesus had to for fill before anybody gave him respect. This why I respect Christianity and became one.
Muhammad on the other hand seems like somebody who has seen the suffering of a people and has used God as a means to unite them and rally them to revolution. Though one might have respect for somebody that feeds hope to a nation of people, this doesn’t count as a true prophet’s identification.
Many have seen the power and influence of the message brought by the Jewish people. Many through out history have made up there own versions, with their own interpretations, to suit their own whims. How is Muhammad any different? Muhammad was not perfect; so how do you know that he wasn’t the one that took the message from the Jewish people; corrupting it as he saw fit? It might even be the case that Muhammad truly wanted to help the suffering of a people, but did so by weaving lies together.
A suffering people can be fooled by an oasis; a false representation of the real thing.
M
Montalban
Guest
Well you’ve got several religions claiming that they know. To suggest none of them are right is odd that God would make it so difficult to be known that he doesn’t provide any real answer.
To a point nobody can know God, in that ultimately he is God and therefore beyond our knowing, but he’s let us know of him.
G
Gara3987
Guest
I posted this information on a different post, it is from Father Trosch. You may look more in depth in what he has to say I just posted some interesting facts from his site trosch.org/bks/islm/allah_false_god.html.
The generic term “allah” is translated into the English equivalent “god.” It can be used to relate to any concept of deity including pagan allahs’, totem pole worshippers allah, the allah of the Hindus, the allah of the Buddhists, or the allah of witchcraft otherwise known as Satan. Christians in Muslim countries can properly use the term Allah in reference to Jesus, or Allah the Father, or Allah the Holy Spirit with the difference being that the members of the Holy Trinity are the true God.
The concept “Allah,” the Muslim idea of a single being they consider “god” with supposed eternal existence, portrays only an unmotivated and undifferentiated being. The multiplicity of gods of the ancient pagan Romans illustrated the recognition of a need for motivational variables in relation to creation. In this sense the Roman’s concept relating to creation is superior to that of Islam.
ctically speaking, Allah can only be a fabrication of man’s imagination. Allah is a human construct that serves humanistic purposes. The concept Allah should be seen as a totally unmotivated existence without purpose or need for using reason; a being without impetus to create. Allah is an imaginary construct, not a reality. It is a construct in part formulated by using Judeo-Christian teachings (Scriptures) derived within Mohammed’s imagination in association with his wife who financially provided for him. Mohammed’s first and only true wife was a Catholic-Christian (who highly venerated the “Blessed Virgin Mary”). The only form of Christian of that place and time frame.
Allah is a non-existent being constructed by Mohammed through a perversion of Judeo-Christian teachings. Any Christian who accepts as real the non-existent god termed Allah, or associates it with “Yahweh” of the Biblical Trinity, is heretical and risks eternal damnation if not repentant. – Quotes from the Koran, the holy book of Islam - emphasis added:
The Qur’an rejects the concept of the “The Holy Trinity”: [Surat 4.171 – “O followers of the Book! do not exceed the limits in your religion, and do not speak (lies) against Allah, but (speak) the truth; the Messiah, Isa (Jesus) son of Marium is only an apostle of Allah and His Word which He communicated to Marium and a spirit from Him; believe therefore in Allah and His apostles, and say not, Three. Desist, it is better for you; Allah is only one God; far be It from His glory that He should have a son, whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His, and Allah is sufficient for a Protector.”]
There is a lot more information but I think that this gets the main point across.
The generic term “allah” is translated into the English equivalent “god.” It can be used to relate to any concept of deity including pagan allahs’, totem pole worshippers allah, the allah of the Hindus, the allah of the Buddhists, or the allah of witchcraft otherwise known as Satan. Christians in Muslim countries can properly use the term Allah in reference to Jesus, or Allah the Father, or Allah the Holy Spirit with the difference being that the members of the Holy Trinity are the true God.
The concept “Allah,” the Muslim idea of a single being they consider “god” with supposed eternal existence, portrays only an unmotivated and undifferentiated being. The multiplicity of gods of the ancient pagan Romans illustrated the recognition of a need for motivational variables in relation to creation. In this sense the Roman’s concept relating to creation is superior to that of Islam.
Code:
Picture the purported being of the concept known as Allah. It is a presumed creator but was not created and that was without having reason to think, to develop ideas, to use language, nor did it have the availability of images or beings to reflect upon in order to have or develop thought processes. In other words Allah represents the concept of existing blankness, an empty intellect.Allah is a non-existent being constructed by Mohammed through a perversion of Judeo-Christian teachings. Any Christian who accepts as real the non-existent god termed Allah, or associates it with “Yahweh” of the Biblical Trinity, is heretical and risks eternal damnation if not repentant. – Quotes from the Koran, the holy book of Islam - emphasis added:
The Qur’an rejects the concept of the “The Holy Trinity”: [Surat 4.171 – “O followers of the Book! do not exceed the limits in your religion, and do not speak (lies) against Allah, but (speak) the truth; the Messiah, Isa (Jesus) son of Marium is only an apostle of Allah and His Word which He communicated to Marium and a spirit from Him; believe therefore in Allah and His apostles, and say not, Three. Desist, it is better for you; Allah is only one God; far be It from His glory that He should have a son, whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His, and Allah is sufficient for a Protector.”]
There is a lot more information but I think that this gets the main point across.
C
colliric
Guest
Yes. they are the same God interpreted differently because Mohammad is a false prophet.
I think C.S Lewis landed dead on with this issue in the final “The Chronicles of Narnia:The Last Battle”. In the book Aslan’s image as peace loving creator of that world gets tainted when a false prophet, a selfish ape comes along and acquaints Aslan, through immatation(he dresses up a poor donkey in a lion skin and parades him about as Aslan), as also being Tash, the vengeful god of the Tarkaans(rather Arabic people with a thirst for violence and honor).
Thus a new false interpretation of Aslan turns him into “Tashlan”, misguiding the once loyal followers of the Real Aslan into believing in an incorrect interpretation of the works,stories and even words(“He is not a tame lion” is changed from meaning he is courageous into meaning he is fearce and violent) of the lion.
What Lewis understood as an important point is to stress how the congregation of animals tried to remain loyal to Aslan by believing in a false interpretation of him. They will still worshipping their own Aslan in that sense, but a false prophet had given them a flawed interpretation(Only the reader and protagonists know that this new “Tashlan” isn’t the real Aslan). In the same way the Moslems worship our god, only they have been given a tainted and flawed interpretation to follow by a man with questionable intentions.
I won’t ruin the story, surfice to say that the Real Aslan eventually shows up and correct things at the right time.
I think C.S Lewis landed dead on with this issue in the final “The Chronicles of Narnia:The Last Battle”. In the book Aslan’s image as peace loving creator of that world gets tainted when a false prophet, a selfish ape comes along and acquaints Aslan, through immatation(he dresses up a poor donkey in a lion skin and parades him about as Aslan), as also being Tash, the vengeful god of the Tarkaans(rather Arabic people with a thirst for violence and honor).
Thus a new false interpretation of Aslan turns him into “Tashlan”, misguiding the once loyal followers of the Real Aslan into believing in an incorrect interpretation of the works,stories and even words(“He is not a tame lion” is changed from meaning he is courageous into meaning he is fearce and violent) of the lion.
What Lewis understood as an important point is to stress how the congregation of animals tried to remain loyal to Aslan by believing in a false interpretation of him. They will still worshipping their own Aslan in that sense, but a false prophet had given them a flawed interpretation(Only the reader and protagonists know that this new “Tashlan” isn’t the real Aslan). In the same way the Moslems worship our god, only they have been given a tainted and flawed interpretation to follow by a man with questionable intentions.
I won’t ruin the story, surfice to say that the Real Aslan eventually shows up and correct things at the right time.
M
Mr.Bee
Guest
Interesting.
The fact remains however that it is difficult to know God, even in a basic sense, if anybody had the answer then we wouldn’t be having this discussion, now would we
Whenever somebody makes a point, even a strong one, somebody else invariably has a counterpoint. You can argue with a Muslim till you’re blue in the face and it will go nowhere. The only way to quiet them is to actually do what God commands us to do… which apparently is impossible.
So… Who are the Muslims listening to when they blow themselves (and a bunch of other people) up?
B
Booklover
Guest
Where do you get those statistics?? They’re totally absurd!
H
hamba2han
Guest
A word of explanation regarding Muslim prayer.
The 5 daily prayers are called salat whereas Muslims continually utter prayers in the form of supplications known as dua throughout the day in just about everything they do.
It is these dua which are somewhat similar to Christian prayers and therefore when Christians say that they perform daily prayers, keep in mind that Muslims perform these supplications a lot more frequent than you during any given day.
As for the 5 daily salat, I do not think there is any Christian equivalent to these prayers.
The 5 daily prayers are called salat whereas Muslims continually utter prayers in the form of supplications known as dua throughout the day in just about everything they do.
It is these dua which are somewhat similar to Christian prayers and therefore when Christians say that they perform daily prayers, keep in mind that Muslims perform these supplications a lot more frequent than you during any given day.
As for the 5 daily salat, I do not think there is any Christian equivalent to these prayers.
M
Mr.Bee
Guest
M
Mr.Bee
Guest
Ooops, sorry, sent a reply without writing anything.Ya know… I really don’t care how much anybody prays, fasts, goes to confession, knows the scriptures inside and out, etc… Those to me are between you and God and become pointless when done in vain. Just because someone prays a lot doesn’t give you a get-out-of-jail-free card. What matters is what you keep secret.
H
hamba2han
Guest
I think there is some truth to what you say but there is also a limit to what we should keep secret when we worship the Creator.
Only evil continually cloaks itself in secrecy in order to cover it’s hideous nature.
M
Mr.Bee
Guest
Yes, I agree. There must be a balance.
But when does prayer become a cloak of secrecy? I think Jesus said something to the effect of: beware of those who make a big deal out of praying for the sake of others,(referring to the Pharasiees) better for you to go to your room and quietly pray to God. (sorry for the paraphrase)
That is not to say there is a time for public worship.
Do you catch my drift?
B
Booklover
Guest
Do you say any prayers that ask God to have mercy on the whole world, as we Christians do?
Vickie
M
Mr.Bee
Guest
And oh yeah, you can’t keep anything secret from the creator.
B
Booklover
Guest
Mt. 6, 5-15
When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, who love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on street corners so that others may see them. Amen, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you pray, go to your inner room, close the door, and pray to your Father in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will repay you.
In praying, do not babble like the pagans, who think that they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them. Your Father knows what you need before you ask him.
The Lord’s Prayer. This is how you are to pray:
Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as in heaven.
Give us today our daily bread;
and forgive us our debts,
as we forgive our debtors;
and do not subject us to the final test,
but deliver us from the evil one.
If you forgive others their transgressions, your heavenly Father will forgive you. But if you do not forgive others, neither will your Father forgive your transgressions.
H
hamba2han
Guest
Muslims, particularly the men, are encouraged to perform the salat prayers in congregation at the mosque.
On the other hand, the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) advises that non-obligatory prayers are best done in the prvacy of one’s home.
How’s that for striking a nice balance in matters of worship?
One of the names of the Creator is the Most Merciful and Muslims do indeed continually pray for His Mercy.
M
Mr.Bee
Guest
Thanks. Couldn’t have said it better myself
H
hamba2han
Guest
I meant keeping secrets from other worshippers, not the Creator.And oh yeah, you can’t keep anything secret from the creator.
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