Do prayer work if in Mortal Sin?

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  • “In the lowest and most painful (degree of Purgatory)… here there are the sinners who have committed terrible crimes during life and whose death surprised them in that state. It was almost a miracle that they were saved, and often by the prayers of holy parents or other pious persons. Sometimes they did not even have time to confess their sins and the world thought them lost, but God, whose mercy is infinite, gave them at the moment of death the contrition necessary for their salvation on account of one or more good actions which they performed during life.” (Revelation from a soul in Purgatory to Sister M. de L.C, from “An Unpublished Manuscript on Purgatory”)
littlestsouls.wordpress.com/2…d-conversions/

 
  • “In the lowest and most painful (degree of Purgatory)… here there are the sinners who have committed terrible crimes during life and whose death surprised them in that state. It was almost a miracle that they were saved, and often by the prayers of holy parents or other pious persons. Sometimes they did not even have time to confess their sins and the world thought them lost, but God, whose mercy is infinite, gave them at the moment of death the contrition necessary for their salvation on account of one or more good actions which they performed during life.” (Revelation from a soul in Purgatory to Sister M. de L.C, from “An Unpublished Manuscript on Purgatory”)
Thanks so much for your post. I went to Confession this morning and feel that a huge weight has been lifted from my shoulders.
 
“…on account of one or more good actions which they performed during life.”

Wow. That surprises me.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.
(Ephesians 2)
 
“…on account of one or more good actions which they performed during life.”

Wow. That surprises me.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.
(Ephesians 2)
That’s one of the reasons I understand that the revelations they have are not binding upon us. Because they strike a certain soul, a certain way, at a certain time and we are interpreting it in current context and personal disposition.

I’ve recently learned of a document that the Catholics and Lutherans signed years ago. I didn’t realize it until Pope Francis made an outreach video to some televangelist schmuck and asked for unity.

[JOINT DECLARATION
ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION

by the Lutheran World Federation
and the Catholic Church](http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/p..._31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html)
 
Don’t forget that King David committed mortal sins galore. St. Paul committed mortal sins. Sometimes I think we are more focused on sinning rather than the forgiveness, healing and transformation that can be given to us. Zacchaeus, Mary of Magdala, the list goes on. All mortal sinners. Some of them didn’t even ask for forgiveness, God just provided it and changed their hearts. I don’t think it is as cut and dried as we Catholics seem to think.

I have a hard time thinking Christ came to die to save only those who don’t commit sins.

So…are your prayers heard when you have committed mortal sin? YES! His desire is to bring you back to Him, not throw you out with the trash.
 
Don’t forget that King David committed mortal sins galore. St. Paul committed mortal sins. Sometimes I think we are more focused on sinning rather than the forgiveness, healing and transformation that can be given to us. Zacchaeus, Mary of Magdala, the list goes on. All mortal sinners. Some of them didn’t even ask for forgiveness, God just provided it and changed their hearts. I don’t think it is as cut and dried as we Catholics seem to think.

I have a hard time thinking Christ came to die to save only those who don’t commit sins.

So…are your prayers heard when you have committed mortal sin? YES! His desire is to bring you back to Him, not throw you out with the trash.
 
“…on account of one or more good actions which they performed during life.”

Wow. That surprises me.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.
(Ephesians 2)
"A bruised reed He will not break And a dimly burning wick He will not extinguish; He will faithfully bring forth justice.

If God can find a tiny spark of goodness in your Heart… he wont let it die out in Hell.
 
Don’t forget that King David committed mortal sins galore. St. Paul committed mortal sins. Sometimes I think we are more focused on sinning rather than the forgiveness, healing and transformation that can be given to us. Zacchaeus, Mary of Magdala, the list goes on. All mortal sinners. Some of them didn’t even ask for forgiveness, God just provided it and changed their hearts. I don’t think it is as cut and dried as we Catholics seem to think.

I have a hard time thinking Christ came to die to save only those who don’t commit sins.

So…are your prayers heard when you have committed mortal sin? YES! His desire is to bring you back to Him, not throw you out with the trash.
:amen:
"A bruised reed He will not break And a dimly burning wick He will not extinguish; He will faithfully bring forth justice.

If God can find a tiny spark of goodness in your Heart… he wont let it die out in Hell.
:amen:
 
My surprise was not regarding God’s great mercy!

My surprise was that a Catholic source was saying we could be saved and/or be given mercy “on account of good actions we have performed…”

For the wages of sin is death; but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6)
 
My surprise was not regarding God’s great mercy!

My surprise was that a Catholic source was saying we could be saved and/or be given mercy “on account of good actions we have performed…”

For the wages of sin is death; but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6)
You are right. That “Catholic source” is from a private journal as far as I can tell, about a private revelation to a particular saint. A lot of times they were only able to communicate with their spiritual director and had no idea they’d some day become public record for all to see over an electronic “seed-multiplier and scatterer” aka “the Internet.”

It may or may not have any bearing whatsoever on “reality” for you or me, and it is not binding upon Catholics to either agree or disagree. Some of the things they would write and then later clarify or even change. They grow, and that’s part of being saints.

So to that saint, the Lord needed the saint to hear that. We need make nothing more of it than that. If I can get a useful idea or prayer or some hope from a saint’s revelation, that that’s great. But it isn’t “binding” upon Catholics.

That’s one problem I think I’m seeing less of than I used to. Is that Catholics are learning more about what is a “teaching” and what is either a tradition or a personal thought that is documented for no particular interpretation. Some saints, like especially doctors of the Chruch, wrote things that can change your heart just to read through once or more if you can identify with with, like Teresa of Avila & St. John of the Cross, who made quite the pair it seems.

And then the Little Flower? Saint Thérèse of Lisieux? And the Little Way? All wonderful ideas and useful for many I think. They are not binding; we get to “pick and choose” which flavors we wish to use. 👍
 
My surprise was that a Catholic source was saying we could be saved and/or be given mercy “on account of good actions we have performed…”
Its the good that you do in your life that redeems you in God’s eyes, its the worthless that go to Hell.
 
You are right. That “Catholic source” is from a private journal as far as I can tell, about a private revelation to a particular saint. A lot of times they were only able to communicate with their spiritual director and had no idea they’d some day become public record for all to see over an electronic “seed-multiplier and scatterer” aka “the Internet.”

It may or may not have any bearing whatsoever on “reality” for you or me, and it is not binding upon Catholics to either agree or disagree. Some of the things they would write and then later clarify or even change. They grow, and that’s part of being saints.

So to that saint, the Lord needed the saint to hear that. We need make nothing more of it than that. If I can get a useful idea or prayer or some hope from a saint’s revelation, that that’s great. But it isn’t “binding” upon Catholics.

That’s one problem I think I’m seeing less of than I used to. Is that Catholics are learning more about what is a “teaching” and what is either a tradition or a personal thought that is documented for no particular interpretation. Some saints, like especially doctors of the Chruch, wrote things that can change your heart just to read through once or more if you can identify with with, like Teresa of Avila & St. John of the Cross, who made quite the pair it seems.

And then the Little Flower? Saint Thérèse of Lisieux? And the Little Way? All wonderful ideas and useful for many I think. They are not binding; we get to “pick and choose” which flavors we wish to use. 👍
Its an account of a Nun talking to a fellow Nun who was in purgatory: catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=6253 An Unpublished Manuscript on Purgatory
 
Its the good that you do in your life that redeems you in God’s eyes, its the worthless that go to Hell.
With all due respect, that’s plainly incorrect and goes against the teaching of scripture and the Catholic Church.

We have all become like one who is unclean,
and all our righteous deeds are like a filthy cloth.

(Isaiah 64)

But God demonstrates His own love toward us,
in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

(Romans 5)

This is important. I don’t argue to prove “I am right” or “You are wrong.” But it’s crucial that no one reading this thread comes away from it with the idea that we may, in any sense, “earn” our salvation. God is good! Amen?

Happy New Year and peace to all. 🙂
 
With all due respect, that’s plainly incorrect and goes against the teaching of scripture and the Catholic Church.

We have all become like one who is unclean,
and all our righteous deeds are like a filthy cloth.

(Isaiah 64)

But God demonstrates His own love toward us,
in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

(Romans 5)

This is important. I don’t argue to prove “I am right” or “You are wrong.” But it’s crucial that no one reading this thread comes away from it with the idea that we may, in any sense, “earn” our salvation. God is good! Amen?

Happy New Year and peace to all. 🙂
Lol, you sound like a protestant you absolutely have to earn your way to Heaven .
 
Its an account of a Nun talking to a fellow Nun who was in purgatory: catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=6253 An Unpublished Manuscript on Purgatory
Yes, and my point is that it is not Catholic teaching. People throw this stuff around like it’s infallible but it isn’t. It’s a nun who had a vision of purgatory and wrote it down, and it may or may not apply to anything today for any of us. That’s why, unless I’m grossly mistaken, the Church does not require us to believe these kinds of things.

The first paragraphs at your linked article spells it out:

Note: In conformity with the decrees of Pope Urban VIII, the author formally declares that the preternatural or seemingly supernatural facts recorded in this historical narrative rest on purely human authority, and consequently he does not in any way intend to pronounce a final judgment, or to anticipate any future decision of lawful Church authority as to their nature.

Introduction

At the expressed desire of the Directors of the Bulletin “Notre Dame de la Bonne Mort,” this pamphlet is published with all the reservations ordered by the Church in the decree of Urban VIII, and as a purely historical document.

It was sent to that periodical by a zealous and devout missionary and is a pious document based on alleged conversations between a nun and a soul in Purgatory.

This is just a story, as far as the author is claiming. What place does it even have in a discussion about Catholic Teachings?

Other posters had understood these writings to be “Catholic” and questioned them against the Bible. Thus it raised a cognitive dissonance in the mind of a poster, and I was trying to clear it up. My point is that they don’t have to reconcile because they are not “Catholic Teachings” so they don’t have to withstand apologetic debate against scriptural challenges.
Unsubscribing…

God bless you.
I appreciate you letting us know.

I’m glad you have cleaned your slate of the messiness of this issue, and let us know that you have. Ta ta, I say to your spirit. Or to you, if you’re peeking back at your eulogy post mortem and btw you can unsubscribe but you can’t un-read. 😛

MS
 
Yes, and my point is that it is not Catholic teaching. People throw this stuff around like it’s infallible but it isn’t. It’s a nun who had a vision of purgatory and wrote it down, and it may or may not apply to anything today for any of us. That’s why, unless I’m grossly mistaken, the Church does not require us to believe these kinds of things.

MS
Yes, I know this, I thought you might like something like this seeing that you are a Mystical Seeker.🙂
 
Yes, I know this, I thought you might like something like this seeing that you are a Mystical Seeker.🙂
Honestly, yes, I love to hear may different views, but sometimes there are so many and they seem so little suited toward my current needs, that they seem cumbersome.

My trigger really is when Catholic teachings are misrepresented especially by presenting tradition or optional concepts such as Marian apparitions, as if they were required Church teachings.

As far as I know, the last thing Mary “officially” told us to do was scriptural, “do what He says.” Everything beyond that is optional, not binding on Catholics, and when I think someone is “pushing” their solutions as “the” solution for somebody else, it gets me all riled up. Personal problem on my part, of course. :rolleyes:

You know what? If I can ever frame a situation to where I’m the one who’s wrong, then I rejoice because then I’ve won as soon as I can switch my ideas around in my mind. If I’m wrong, all I have to do is become corrected and the problem is fixed. If others are wrong, then I do not have direct control over whether it gets fixed and I have to resort to my powers of persuasion. 😃

MS
 
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